[amoeba1126]

Quote:

I strongly recommend you read the posts of "Gary in MD" at the "Speaker amps for headphones" thread.

Gary's writings evidence a great ear and the ability to communicate what he hears. He's an experienced HiFi guy who's jumping into Head-Fi, buying, comparing, and returning amps at the moment, for suitability with his having previously settled on the LCD-3.

Having dismissed the Burson Soloist and a few other amps, he has narrowed his search down to two speaker amps: The 32W into 8-Ohm TBI Millemia MG3 and the 110W into 8-Ohm Odyssey Cyclops.

http://www.head-fi.org/t/649107/speaker-amps-for-headphones/480_20#post_9673952

Mike

 
Cool thanks! Can either of those speaker amps be safely used with headphones?

 

[stuartypoorty]

Hello,
 
Currently using Grado RS-1 headphones with a LaRocco PR II.
 
Considering a set of Audeze LCD-2.2 as replacements.
 
I have a question for Audeze users: will the LaRocco prove adequate to drive the Audeze cans? 
As I often travel the LaRocco is ideal for my needs.
 
I see the PR II mentioned as one of the partnering amps in the 50 best shoot out, do any forum members have experience with this combination.
 
I live in the UK and each dealer is a considerable distance from me.
 
Thanks,
Stuart

 

[zilch0md]

Quote:

 
Cool thanks! Can either of those speaker amps be safely used with headphones?

 
More safely with Audeze and HiFiMan orthos than with dynamic headphones that can't handle as many Watts.  I read in the Emotiva a-100 Mini-X thread that Audeze support says you can directly connect the LCD-2/3 to a speaker amps' terminals with amps rated as high as 80 Watts per channel into 8 Ohms.  That translates to about 13 Watts per channel into 50 Ohms.  But lots of people have gone to even higher power amps.  You just have to be diligent with how you turn on, connect, disconnect, and turn off the amp, as well as how you handle the volume control.  Best practice is to turn down the amp's volume control before turning on the amp and to turn it down again before turning off the amp.  If the amp has anything in the way of a significant pop, even with the volume turned down, you could also connect the headphones only after turning on the amp disconnect before turning it off. 
 
I'm using LCD--2 with the Emotiva a-100 Mini-X (50 Wpc into 8-Ohm, which translates to about 8 Wpc into 50-Ohm - where the Soloist is only about 1.2 Wpc into 50-Ohm).   I've not had any problems, but with the standard 2Vrms signal coming from my CEntrance DACmini CX' DAC section, I have to keep the amp's volume control at or below 9 o'clock - which makes it fairly sensitive to fine tune, but not annoying in the least.
 
 

 

 
I've inserted a Decware ZSTAGE between the DACmini CX and the Emotiva a-100 Mini-X, to smooth the treble and to enjoy the sound tailoring that comes with tube rolling - but lots of people find the currently $189 Emotiva amp to be terrific, when directly fed by whatever DAC they use.  I think I can say with some objectivity, however, that the Emotiva is a little bit brighter (than neutral) and a little bit harsh in the treble - thus the tube buffer.  But that might just be my tastes or a lack of synergy with the DACmini CX DAC which, on its own, does have a bit of a etch to in the treble - at least enough to not play well with the Emotiva - not with both the DAC and the amp being very detailed.  
 
The LCD-2 plugged directly into the DACmini CX headphone jack is about perfect, in my opinion, except for the tremendous dynamics and bass control that come with more power.  Lastly, the Emotiva + ZSTAGE isn't harsh, but the tube kills some of the resolution I crave.  So... I'm very interested in Gary in MD's experiments with the TBI Millenia M3 and the Odyssey Cyclops, especially.  

 
Here's a photo of a Cyclops Extreme that sold on AudioAsylumTrader, recently.
 
By the way, the integrated, 110 Wpc Odyssey Cyclops is, essentially, a Odyssey Khartago amp, with a pre-amp added to the same chassis.  Check out this Absolute Sound review of the Khartago as an indicator of why Gary of MD decided to test the Cyclops as an amp for his LCD-3.
 
Resistor networks can be added at the speaker taps for use with more sensitive headphones (with resistors running parallel, across the terminals, to protect the headphones) and/or with resistors in series, to match impedance and possibly protect the amp).  If anyone who understands this stuff better than I do cares to make a correction to anything I've said, please jump in, but my understanding is that you really don't need any resistors if you are connecting Audeze or HiFiMan orthos.  Gary's getting a better sound quality by doing so for his LCD-3, however, at least with the TBI Millenia MG3.
 
Mike

 

[wizia]

That's a very interesting read, thanks zilch0md.

 

[zilch0md]

You're welcome!  

 

[amoeba1126]

Quote:

 
More safely with Audeze and HiFiMan orthos than with dynamic headphones that can't handle as many Watts.  I read in the Emotiva a-100 Mini-X thread that Audeze support says you can directly connect the LCD-2/3 to a speaker amps' terminals with amps rated as high as 80 Watts per channel into 8 Ohms.  That translates to about 13 Watts per channel into 50 Ohms.  But lots of people have gone to even higher power amps.  You just have to be diligent with how you turn on, connect, disconnect, and turn off the amp, as well as how you handle the volume control.  Best practice is to turn down the amp's volume control before turning on the amp and to turn it down again before turning off the amp.  If the amp has anything in the way of a significant pop, even with the volume turned down, you could also connect the headphones only after turning on the amp disconnect before turning it off. 
 
I'm using LCD--2 with the Emotiva a-100 Mini-X (50 Wpc into 8-Ohm, which translates to about 8 Wpc into 50-Ohm - where the Soloist is only about 1.2 Wpc into 50-Ohm).   I've not had any problems, but with the standard 2Vrms signal coming from my CEntrance DACmini CX' DAC section, I have to keep the amp's volume control at or below 9 o'clock - which makes it fairly sensitive to fine tune, but not annoying in the least.
 
 

 

 
I've inserted a Decware ZSTAGE between the DACmini CX and the Emotiva a-100 Mini-X, to smooth the treble and to enjoy the sound tailoring that comes with tube rolling - but lots of people find the currently $189 Emotiva amp to be terrific, when directly fed by whatever DAC they use.  I think I can say with some objectivity, however, that the Emotiva is a little bit brighter (than neutral) and a little bit harsh in the treble - thus the tube buffer.  But that might just be my tastes or a lack of synergy with the DACmini CX DAC which, on its own, does have a bit of a etch to in the treble - at least enough to not play well with the Emotiva - not with both the DAC and the amp being very detailed.  
 
The LCD-2 plugged directly into the DACmini CX headphone jack is about perfect, in my opinion, except for the tremendous dynamics and bass control that come with more power.  Lastly, the Emotiva + ZSTAGE isn't harsh, but the tube kills some of the resolution I crave.  So... I'm very interested in Gary in MD's experiments with the TBI Millenia M3 and the Odyssey Cyclops, especially.  

 
Here's a photo of a Cyclops Extreme that sold on AudioAsylumTrader, recently.
 
By the way, the integrated, 110 Wpc Odyssey Cyclops is, essentially, a Odyssey Khartago amp, with a pre-amp added to the same chassis.  Check out this Absolute Sound review of the Khartago as an indicator of why Gary of MD decided to test the Cyclops as an amp for his LCD-3.
 
Resistor networks can be added at the speaker taps for use with more sensitive headphones (with resistors running parallel, across the terminals, to protect the headphones) and/or with resistors in series, to match impedance and possibly protect the amp).  If anyone who understands this stuff better than I do cares to make a correction to anything I've said, please jump in, but my understanding is that you really don't need any resistors if you are connecting Audeze or HiFiMan orthos.  Gary's getting a better sound quality by doing so for his LCD-3, however, at least with the TBI Millenia MG3.
 
Mike

 
Thank you for the informative response. Will I be able to use the Cyclops with earphones?

 

[zilch0md]

Quote:

 
Thank you for the informative response. Will I be able to use the Cyclops with earphones?

 
What do you mean by "earphones?"  
 
It's important to understand that I'm not recommending the Odyssey Cyclops for anyone's use - not yet, anyway.  I've never heard it and I only know one person (Gary in MD) who has tried it - and he has only just begun experimenting with the Cyclops and the Audeze LCD-3.
 
110 Watts (per channel into 8-Ohms) is more than the maximum 80 Watts that Audeze support says can be used with the LCD-3.  I don't know how much your "earphones" cost, but even if they're not worth $2000, like the LCD-3, I'd think twice about hooking them up to a 110-Watt speaker amp.  

   Remember also that dynamic headphones can't handle as many watts as orthos can.  
 
Let's wait and see what Gary in MD reports on the Cyclops at the Speaker amps for headphones thread.   

 
Mike

 

[DefQon]

Just to add on, I've had earphones and high impedence dynamic headphones killed by hooking them up to tube/power and integrated amplifiers. No resistors used but a dummy load did kill one of the test K701's I had at the time (gosh hated that headphone).

 

[Chris_Himself]

Quote:

Lol I see the lcd 2 has moved into the "gone" list on your profile, what did you upgrade to?

 
Oh I rarely update my stuff, I still run 2's. I tried going back to HD800 but it's a bit sharp for me. It's not deathly like some anti-800 people would have, but I really proved to myself that I'll take a bit less detail for sonic comfort. I operate with cans on my head for about 4-5 hours a day if not more if you can understand. There are analytical listeners who "know" headphones, but headphones really are my life.
 
Whats the latest and greatest amp for these? I've been away from Head-Fi for a while LOL. Been a little busy with the site changes and all.

 

[DefQon]

Quote:

Whats the latest and greatest amp for these? I've been away from Head-Fi for a while LOL. Been a little busy with the site changes and all.

BHSE + 007mk1 or 009. 

 

[Chris_Himself]

Quote:

BHSE + 007mk1 or 009. 

 
Wow that is a lot of money downrange LOL

 

[DefQon]

Yup LOL!

 

[dan.gheorghe]

Quote:

I was a little underwhelmed with the Soloist/LCD 3/HE 500 (to my ears). I wanted to get the latest GS amp from Justin but decided not to wait 12 weeks (or longer). I bought the Gungnir/Mjolnir stack and to me, this is near end-game.

Conductor/soloist is a very good combo with lcd2. However, the interconnects / power cable can change your experience with it. I didn't like the wireworld aurora power cable with it for example.

 

[NZheadcase]

You should. You need a good, powerful SS amp in your collection. It would be great for your Fostex too.

+1

Th900 and the soloist is very good. I reserve the right not to say great and awesome until i have heard other amps with the th900. With no burn in, they are already keepers in my book paired with the soloist. however, LCD 2 and Soloist is already a great pairing (to my ears, of course).

 

[Tony1110]

This guy's post really made me want to try the combo

http://www.head-fi.org/t/653932/item-audio-burson-soloist-fostex-th-900