[Clemmaster]

Of course the French of that pre WWII era are in their 30s today... And all rich.

That's a ridiculous explanation.

We don't want to speak English because we suck at it. The end.

 

[jacal01]

Very well stated.

 

[artur9]

...
And mind you, it`s not even the multibit.

I went from the UberFrost to the Gumby having decided not to get the Gungnir then upgrade later to save the hundred bucks.

I've convinced myself that the UberFrost seemed to blur the sounds a little so that they did not sound as realistic as the Gumby makes them sound. That and the lower apparent noise floor makes everything sound so good.

 

[castleofargh]

Of course the French of that pre WWII era are in their 30s today... And all rich.

That's a ridiculous explanation.

We don't want to speak English because we suck at it. The end.

I have to agree, it is mostly shame from how bad we are at speaking English. and some decide to badly disguise that as pride for our language. rejection often comes from ignorance after all.
our schools organized by pure geniuses, went on for decades teaching and evaluating a spoken language while almost never making us speak a word. all my tests were in writing... same as Latin, we apparently weren't expected to speak either one.
I believe I've mostly learned to understand English from songs and watching DVDs in the original language, "tasukete onii chan"(oops wrong DVD). ^_^

to give the others an idea, here are our politicians, some came out of one of the most prestigious school in the country. enjoy what the elite of French teaching can achieve when it comes to languages:

so now you guys know. when you see a French dude being a jerk about not wanting to speak English, this is usually what he's so desperate to hide(me included). don't resent him, he's probably dead inside remembering those 10 year old vikings trolling his accent in an almost perfect English last time he went playing online games.

 

[Baldr]

Speaking of goose bumps. One of my favorite 20th century compositions is Bartók's Music for Strings, Percussion and Celesta. Last weekend, I started ripping a 67 disc box set of everything that Pierre Boulez conducted for Columbia ("Boulez: Complete Columbia Album Collection" https://www.sonyclassical.com/releases/88843013332). Its performance of that composition on disc 7 is the goosebumpiest I've heard in a long time.

I have the same box set and it is fantastic. I am not so sure the older Boulez always aged well in his recordings.

 

[earnmyturns]

I have the same box set and it is fantastic. I am not so sure the older Boulez always aged well in his recordings.

I have also his DGG box set to rip, I'll get to do some comparisons eventually.

Besides that Boulez interpretation of MfSPaC, I also have also the Fritz Reiner/CSO one, and the Iván Fischer/BFO/Zoltán Kocsis one, which used to be my favorite until I heard the Boulez.

 

[Baldr]

A little more to it than that. Has to do more with intact post-WWII economies. And English is a polyglot language, that is, it has Latin, Germanic and Greek roots, which makes it easier to learn, and vice versa.

And Holland as a traditional trading nation required its citizens to learn French, when the known world economy was being run by the rich and landed nobility at all the courts, and after WWII, English is now a required language in your high schools, for the same reason.

Which also explains why the French resent English and insist you speak French while in their country, or they pretend not to understand you. They used to have the international language that everyone else needed to speak.

As one who spent considerable time in the Spanish and Portuguese colonies, the Spanish mother country, and to a lesser extent France and Italy, I have a different impression. This impression is also informed by the fact that my Spanish was once to the point where where I had almost forgotten English. My impression is that Spanish, Italian, Portuguese, and Catalan (no accent mark on this keyboard) are spoken with an inherent politeness where it is introductory greetings and small talk are required. One always begins conversations with greetings and, given time, remarks on weather, etc. To just come up to a shopkeeper and ask how much, say, bananas are (as North Americans routinely do) is coarse and boorish in those countries. Perhaps those impressions are dated. I hope not.

 

[jacal01]

To quote cousin Vinny, "You were serious about that?"

But speaking vs. reading/writing is true for most languages. And oral can be divided further into spoken and understanding others. I think for most people that in ranking ones own proficiency in a foreign language reading/writing is first, as is mostly taught in school, followed by comprehending spoken conversation from your vocabulary knowledge, and only lastly as speaking it competently enough to be understood in real time.

I find that when immersed in a foreign country, like Japan for me, it's easiest to learn phrases phonetically. You can develop a working vocabulary in 6 months, as unlikely as that seems. And because you learned by imitating native speech, you generally can make yourself understood, which is the whole point. Pronunciation trolls only lessen themselves, not you.

Sometimes it seems only a matter of tuning your ear for comprehending foreign speech. Like a little switch inside turning on a shift of oral perspective to hear the English word. Some MP action. Dutch was like that for me.

But French completely baffles me for its spelling vs. how it's pronounced. Way too many vowels and total misdirection by English rules. And I'll never master the nasal high throat gutteral sounds or wend my way through the assorted sentence abbreviations. But it seems worth the attempt to understand one another. Communication, n'est-ce pas?

 

[HumanFly]

As one who spent considerable time in the Spanish and Portuguese colonies, the Spanish mother country, and to a lesser extent France and Italy, I have a different impression. This impression is also informed by the fact that my Spanish was once to the point where where I had almost forgotten English. My impression is that Spanish, Italian, Portuguese, and Catalan (no accent mark on this keyboard) are spoken with an inherent politeness where it is introductory greetings and small talk are required. One always begins conversations with greetings and, given time, remarks on weather, etc. To just come up to a shopkeeper and ask how much, say, bananas are (as North Americans routinely do) is coarse and boorish in those countries. Perhaps those impressions are dated. I hope not.

I always think its strange that in some american series and movies people don`t say goodbye when they hang up the phone. This would be considered really rude over here, even friends would call you back to ask what happened or expect the connection had dropped. And indeed, even at the shop we exchange at least three thankyous per transaction.

edit:
not sayng its better over here, just agreeing there is a difference.

 

[jacal01]

Politeness vs. candid conversation, if seemingly blunt and perfunct. It all comes down to the esteem you hold for the other person. All the rest is accepted social formality construct, however communicated.

The dark side of projecting into others ones own familiar mores.

 

[HumanFly]

Politeness vs. candid conversation, if seemingly blunt and perfunct. It all comes down to the esteem you hold for the other person. All the rest is accepted social formality construct, however communicated.

The dark side of projecting into others ones own familiar mores.

You are a social chameleon. If you can adept to Japan you can adapt to anything.
China has way less unspoken rules but even there I have a hard time not offending people.
I once drank my host under the table. He just kept filling my glass. And I was all like: this is my kinda dude!
Turns out he was waiting for me to put my hand over my glass and say enough so he could stop drinking himself.
He dissapeared for a couple of hours only to return white like a ghost acting like everything was fine.
After that I tried to be more aware and when in doubt ask my wife how to act.On my own I would be kind of lost.
Luckily they like the Dutch over there and they know we are like elephants in the porcelainstore.

edit:
many horrible typos

 

[Pietro Cozzi Tinin]

You're well informed.
There's a little more.
Today (besides Dutch) English, French and German are mandatory.
If I would have a kid now I would hire a Chinese nanny so it would learn the language from day one.
Furthermore; all films, TV programs an the like are in the original languages with subtitles.
It's a good way to learn a language.
I'm raised in both The Netherlands and Italy.
Italians suck at languages but yes... all human interaction goes with a certain theatrical friendliness.

 

[nerone]

As one who spent considerable time in the Spanish and Portuguese colonies, the Spanish mother country, and to a lesser extent France and Italy, I have a different impression. This impression is also informed by the fact that my Spanish was once to the point where where I had almost forgotten English. My impression is that Spanish, Italian, Portuguese, and Catalan (no accent mark on this keyboard) are spoken with an inherent politeness where it is introductory greetings and small talk are required. One always begins conversations with greetings and, given time, remarks on weather, etc. To just come up to a shopkeeper and ask how much, say, bananas are (as North Americans routinely do) is coarse and boorish in those countries. Perhaps those impressions are dated. I hope not.

Do you speak any Portuguese too? To which Portuguese colonies did you go?

 

[Pietro Cozzi Tinin]

Do you speak any Portuguese too? To which Portuguese colonies did you go?

Maybe he does but the language does not resemble Spanish that much.
Just like Dutch and German are waaaaay different.

 

[Ableza]

The lesson for me all these years later is the futility of audio equipment design with no understanding of the engineering inherent in music theory.

Keep the story coming, it's great. The line above reminds me of something I was told in the early 70's by engineering genius Rupert Neve: "You can't record a bassoon if you don't know what a bassoon is supposed to sound like."