[n3utra1]

how does the W4 compare to the UM3X and which is better?

 

[Zalithian]

The W4 is a bit more flat imo. Bigger staging. UM3X is a bit more intimate/engaging with mids slightly more forward than W4. I'm starting to appreciate the W4's for their strengths when swapping back/forth from the W3's. Neither are really fatiguing or splashy in terms of treble. Better will depend on what you like and what genres you prefer. I think the UM3X is amazing for say acoustic, and vocal oriented music. I think they may be more similar in bass than I thought, but the W4 might have a bit less.

 

[n3utra1]

Quote:

The W4 is a bit more flat imo. Bigger staging. UM3X is a bit more intimate/engaging with mids slightly more forward than W4. I'm starting to appreciate the W4's for their strengths when swapping back/forth from the W3's. Neither are really fatiguing or splashy in terms of treble. Better will depend on what you like and what genres you prefer. I think the UM3X is amazing for say acoustic, and vocal oriented music. I think they may be more similar in bass than I thought, but the W4 might have a bit less.

 
This will be a tough decision since i listen to both rock and voice oriented songs. Thanks btw!

 

[Zalithian]

No problem. I actually didn't like the W4 at all when I got it. I've really come around to it, to the point I think I may keep it and send back the W3. If the W3 has any major weakness, imo it's the mids.

 

[Ultrazino]

Does the W4 have any impedance issues? My only sources right now are an iPhone 4, RSA amp and PC. It sounds fine on all of these but what happens if I'd stick them in a work laptop or Nintendo DS?

 

[nikp]

Quote:

Does the W4 have any impedance issues? My only sources right now are an iPhone 4, RSA amp and PC. It sounds fine on all of these but what happens if I'd stick them in a work laptop or Nintendo DS?

Nope, doesn't need an amp.
 

 

[Ultrazino]

Dammit, you're selling yours? Just ordered a brand new pair because I didn't find them used.

 

[spkrs01]

I was wondering what kind of music files you guys are listening to with the W4s? The majority of my files were in Wav lossless and the remaining in 320kbps mp3. I found the W4s had elements of veiling which lessened as the volume was set higher.
 
I decided to rip a few CDs using eac to FLAC. Wow the difference is huge. The neutral clinical nature that has been bestowed upon the W4s by many has all but disappeared. In its place is a totally different animal - lively, engaginging,  great bass, beautiful mids and sparkling highs. It's like changing to a new pair of IEMs.
 
On a few Cds - an example, Norah Jones, Come Away With Me - her vocals appears really imbedded in your brain and gives the illusion that you are singing the song. It was a weird first time experience but oh so magical!
 
I really cant  explain why listening on FLAC changes so much. I have always ripped my own CDs in Wav Lossless, thinking that was the best format???(can someone chime in?).......
 
The W4s has surpassed my expectations of them - they are just so revealing, truly awesome. I now have over 70 of my favorite CDs in FLAC and lots more to do in the coming weeks.

 

[Ultrazino]

FLAC is the same as WAV. What you describe makes absolutely no sense at all.
Unless you use different media players for different files.

 

[barleyguy]

FLAC is the same as WAV. What you describe makes absolutely no sense at all.
Unless you use different media players for different files.

Agreed. Well, other than WAV being the native format of most sound cards and media players, and FLAC taking craploads of processing power to decode. But as far as the bits that you end up with, they are exactly the same. FLAC decodes to WAV in order to play actually.

Also, this question should be in the sound science forum. There's probably already a thread there for this topic, along with tons of fun discussion.

 

[ericp10]

So what have I learned about the W4 in the few months that I've owned it. Well, it's been said here before but I will reiterate, the W4 is very tip dependent IMO (in a different way, but just as much as the SM3 is finicky with tips). 
 
Also, I have learned (this is for those who say it sounds veiled) that the W4 needs the deepest (yet most comfortable) insertion you can possibly get with your tips. You get a good deep insertion, nice seal and use a tip with a wide nozzle in diameter, the W4 will shine for you with the best bass, instrument separation, micro-detail, weight on instruments and clarity it can produce. For me, only two tips can take me there: the stock Westone XL oval silicon tips, and the XL Earportz/Sensorcorm tips. With these tips, there is a constant batte raging between my GR07 and the W4 on which is my favorite universal IEM period right now. Let me add that the Sony MDR 7550 isn't too far behind (although that has replaced my affection for the EX600/EX1000 pretty much). On any given day the Westone or the Vsonic displaces the other one.

 

[Uchiya]

As a testament to how good these W4 are; unamped out of the Ipod 7g classic headphone-out, they sound like my Lune cable TF10's, hooked up to a CLAS, amped by a pico slim.

 

[Zalithian]

As a testament to how good these W4 are; unamped out of the Ipod 7g classic headphone-out, they sound like my Lune cable TF10's, hooked up to a CLAS, amped by a pico slim.

I've been finding the W4's pretty special with acoustic. They do vocals better than the W3 for sure.

 

[Selenium]

Great example of the placebo effect here, as FLAC sounds exactly the same as WAV. Since they're both lossless, i.e. without loss. And like someone else said, FLAC actually decodes into WAV, so when you play your FLAC files you actually end up listening to WAV.
 
The only other way what you're saying makes sense is if you ripped the CDs using a DSP that your WAV files didn't have or something along those lines perhaps
 
Quote:

I was wondering what kind of music files you guys are listening to with the W4s? The majority of my files were in Wav lossless and the remaining in 320kbps mp3. I found the W4s had elements of veiling which lessened as the volume was set higher.
 
I decided to rip a few CDs using eac to FLAC. Wow the difference is huge. The neutral clinical nature that has been bestowed upon the W4s by many has all but disappeared. In its place is a totally different animal - lively, engaginging,  great bass, beautiful mids and sparkling highs. It's like changing to a new pair of IEMs.
 
On a few Cds - an example, Norah Jones, Come Away With Me - her vocals appears really imbedded in your brain and gives the illusion that you are singing the song. It was a weird first time experience but oh so magical!
 
I really cant  explain why listening on FLAC changes so much. I have always ripped my own CDs in Wav Lossless, thinking that was the best format???(can someone chime in?).......
 
The W4s has surpassed my expectations of them - they are just so revealing, truly awesome. I now have over 70 of my favorite CDs in FLAC and lots more to do in the coming weeks.

 

 

[mrzero63]

 
Quote:

how does the W4 compare to the UM3X and which is better?

 
 
W4 vs. UM3X
 
…And the new Westone is on the ropes!  The referee pulls him away from the ropes and gives him a standing eight count.  The Westone in question is the W4.  The UM3X the undisputed winner (to my ears).  Here’s the blow-by-blow breakdown:
 
Using only four songs I am intimately familiar with, I compared on an even playing field using a Sony NWZ-E345 and my UM56 tips (no amp used).  Now before anyone tells me that I should have used this Comply tip or that Olive, I actually did experiment with the different tips, ensuring a good seal.  I did this only AFTER judging using the UM56 (keeping the playing field as level as possible).  I used the same EQ settings for the tests (bumping the bass up ever so slightly as I normally do) and adjusted only the volume – raising the volume from 10 to 13 for the W4 since the UM3X is a bit more sensitive (124 dB vs 118 db for the W4).
 
The listening tests were accomplished only moments after the W4’s arrival.  There was no burn-in.  I did not burn-in my UM3X last year and it sounded great ‘right out of the box’ so I treated the W4 similarly.
 
First song: Simply Red, Holding Back the Years (320 kbit/s MP3)
 
W4 – The sound is lifeless and distant.  The bass grumbles in the background but offers no life.  It just sits there.  Vocals are forward but lack emotion.  The music as a whole is akin to incidental movie music, with vocals that are prominently displayed above the background music.  Midrange is really lacking. 
 
UM3X  - This song really shines with the UM3X.  Lush mid-bass is displayed alongside fluid synthesizers.  Instrument separation is superb.  Soundstage is wider than the W4 and the vocals fit nicely with the music volume.  Mick’s voice displays emotion – sadness and fear… loss.  The bass line is alive and smooth.  The bass is not any more or any less powerful than the W4, just more well-defined (and refined).
    
Second song: Royksopp – What Else is There? (320 kbit/s MP3)
 
W4 – There is not enough meat in the sandwich.  Where is the midrange?  No midbass, no upper mids, only a smidgen of middle mids.  Very little emotion.  Where is the angst?  The song is no longer haunting, just hollow.  Vocals are forward at the expense of synthesizers and other instruments.     Instrument separation is difficult to discern.  Soundstage is small.  Harp synth disappeared.  Smooth bass, not punchy – very lazy.  Fatiguing.   
 
UM3X – Layers upon layers of synthesizers sounding glorious.  Spacial reality sets in and the song gets a bit scary.  The synthesized claps and harp strings haunt me.  I can feel the rain falling.  The guitar sounds wet and buzzes slightly with electricity.  I worry about the electricity.  Piano is now recognizable as is the recurring build-up of synthesizers.  Bass is punchy and strong.  Subtle sounds are more prominent.  The song moves nicely, complementing the video I matched it with on the computer (for both the W4 and the UM3X).  Midrange is luscious but not overpowering or honking. 
 
Third song: REM – Man on the Moon (320 kbit/s MP3)
 
W4 – Instruments blend, difficult to hear piano and wood percussion.  Not a lot of bass at all.  Vocals forward but backing vocals are drowned out.  Thin sound.  Not much soundstage.  Vocals are clear and analytical, almost as if I could hear the vocals from Michael Stipes before they are revealed with the house sound.  This IEM is no fun.  No intimacy.  REM is practicing and the sound guy hasn’t finished setting up.  That must be it… Guitars blend with the mandolin.  The song struggles to keep speed – sounds a little slow but struggles to maintain speed.  Sounds more like a garage recording than something spit out by the WB. 
 
UM3x – Michael Stipes sings with emotion now!  Backing vocals are soulful and easily distinguishable from each other.  John Keane and Scott Litt hit it with this one.  (Kudos also go to Stephen Marcussen and Precision Mastering.)  The song comes alive.   Guitars/mandolin sound well-tuned and lifelike.  Bass line is smooth.  Soundstage and intimacy, like being on stage.  The recording sounds top rate and REM is REM. 
     
 Fourth song: The Golden Palominos – The Haunting
 
W4 – Another 5^th to 10^th row imaging exercise.  Lead vocals are very forward, dominating the performance but cold and unemotional.  Backing vocals are distant.  Bass is deep but very laid back.  A very unemotional experience overall.  There is difficulty differentiating between stringed instrument layers.  Electric guitar solo is…  it just is… nothing grand… a mediocre thing at best.  Drums are lacking.  Mids are MIA.
 
UM3X – I am on the axis of a carousel with the music surrounding me, swirling about.  Vocals sound proper, nicely weighted and emotional.  The GP’s signature bass kick drum sounds real and immediate.  Bass is deep and punchy.  Mid bass envelopes nicely.  Instrument separation is stellar.  Guitars jangle, electric guitar solo sounds electric and heavy – wonderfully plucky at times.  Dreamy.
 
**** 
 
I then put about 5 hours on the W4s and came up with the same results.  I used different tips (Comply and Olive) and came up with similar results.  I will now put on another 20 hours and see.  After that it’s back to Earphone Solutions for a refund.  I really expected so much more but now appreciate the UM3X more than ever!