[ericp10]

Quote:

No, the SE535 has even more bass than W4.   UE900 would have been the perfect choice.

 
That is not true! Well, it's not true to my ears. Not by a long shot.

 

[tinyman392]

Quote:

 
That is not true! Well, it's not true to my ears. Not by a long shot.

 
Are you talking about the The W4 being less bassy than the Shures?  Or the UE 900 being the choice?  Just curious, as it seems that the Shure model has been measured to have less bass than the W4 (from when I last looked at two graphs ).
 
 

No, the SE535 has even more bass than W4.   UE900 would have been the perfect choice.
 

 
Regarding UE 900 vs W4.  Although it would definitely fix the excessive slam of the W4, I feel that the W4 still has more depth than the UE 900.  So the 900 being the perfect choice is still a trade off.  You get bass that is more neutral, but loss a tad bit of depth.  Now, if the user you quoted ment that he wanted better balance between the sub-bass and low/mid-bass (to create the illusion of better depth), then I'll agree 100% with your statements.  The mids will be pushed up quite a bit though.  At the same time, based on the graphs I've seen, the Shure model will do the same as well  Based on impressions, the Shures have beautifully rendered mids as well.

 

[ericp10]

Quote:

 
Are you talking about the The W4 being less bassy than the Shures?  Or the UE 900 being the choice?  Just curious, as it seems that the Shure model has been measured to have less bass than the W4 (from when I last looked at two graphs ).
 
 
 
Regarding UE 900 vs W4.  Although it would definitely fix the excessive slam of the W4, I feel that the W4 still has more depth than the UE 900.  So the 900 being the perfect choice is still a trade off.  You get bass that is more neutral, but loss a tad bit of depth.  Now, if the user you quoted ment that he wanted better balance between the sub-bass and low/mid-bass (to create the illusion of better depth), then I'll agree 100% with your statements.  The mids will be pushed up quite a bit though.  At the same time, based on the graphs I've seen, the Shure model will do the same as well  Based on impressions, the Shures have beautifully rendered mids as well.

I just go by what I hear. I'm saying that I hear more bass (sub-bass even) in the W4 than I did in the SE535 or the UE900. Now, that's not to say that the W4 isn't a neutral IEM (although it's not totally flat), but if you use the right tips and get a good deep insert, the bass is there without a doubt. Let me stress this is how I hear them. Now, I lean more toward being a bass-head (although it would probably be a mistake to label me that), and yet when looking at all of the IEMs I've owned and sold, I still have the W4 and I love it. Trust, if it didn't have more bass than the SE535 and UE900 I would have gotten rid of it awhile ago. As a matter of fact, not enough bass is exactly the reason I got rid of the SE535 and UE900 (didn't even hold onto the UE900 for a week).

 

[tinyman392]

Quote:

I just go by what I hear. I'm saying that I hear more bass (sub-bass even) in the W4 than I did in the SE535 or the UE900. Now, that's not to say that the W4 isn't a neutral IEM (although it's not totally flat), but if you use the right tips and get a good deep insert, the bass is there without a doubt. Let me stress this is how I hear them. Now, I lean more toward being a bass-head (although it would probably be a mistake to label me that), and yet when looking at all of the IEMs I've owned and sold, I still have the W4 and I love it. Trust, if it didn't have more bass than the SE535 and UE900 I would have gotten rid of it awhile ago. As a matter of fact, not enough bass is exactly the reason I got rid of the SE535 and UE900 (didn't even hold onto the UE900 for a week).

 
I hear it the way you do actually.  The W4 isn't neutral, it's got a pretty strong midbass and a spike somewhere in the upper treble.  

 

[Inks]

Pinhole modded [tape+needle hole) UE900 easily has more depth and subbass than W4 from what I recall. W4 doen't have that much depth honestly, considering the amount of midbass. 

 

[skeptic]

Well after 3 or so years of hard use, my IE8's recently failed on one side. I just ordered up some W4's as their replacement.

Really excited to finally pick these up after years and years of reading about their many virtues. Haven't owned a pair of ba iems since my er6i's back in 2005/2006. I can't wait to enjoy that level of detail again, but with the substantial clean bass that the etymotics just couldn't muster.

 

[giveit2menow]

so theres a big difference in price between the 4 and 4r. The big advantage being cable upgrades. So is say the 4r with say the baldur mk2 cable really a noticeable improvement over the much cheaper fixed cable version. I also read that the baldur cable is heavier and less comfortable than stock cable because its harder to get it to sit round the ear. is that right?
 

 

[kookoo]

Quote:

so theres a big difference in price between the 4 and 4r. The big advantage being cable upgrades. So is say the 4r with say the baldur mk2 cable really a noticeable improvement over the much cheaper fixed cable version. I also read that the baldur cable is heavier and less comfortable than stock cable because its harder to get it to sit round the ear. is that right?
 

most cables will be heavier than the stock cables. Depends on what your definition of "really noticeable" is, you might be in for a shock.
 You can get a bigger change in sound from just changing the tips than the cables

 

[leogodoy]

The big advantage being cable upgrades. So is say the 4r with say the baldur mk2 cable really a noticeable improvement over the much cheaper fixed cable version.

The advantage is being able to change the cable if it breaks, not "upgrades" per se. Save your money, unless the stock cable is defective it doesn't get much better than that.

 

[milford30]

Quote:

so theres a big difference in price between the 4 and 4r. The big advantage being cable upgrades. So is say the 4r with say the baldur mk2 cable really a noticeable improvement over the much cheaper fixed cable version. I also read that the baldur cable is heavier and less comfortable than stock cable because its harder to get it to sit round the ear. is that right?
 

 
You have to try it for yourself, i personally find it worth the cost (i have a different cable not baldur mk2), so does my friend who has tried it, as for the comfort i can only speak for the brief time i tried it, i tried the 'beat audio' version (not the ones on ebay) and they are more comfortable than the stock cable.
 
It really depends on the cable builder, something with sleeving like this:
 
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Beyond-BALDUR-MK2-Nordost-silvering-ODIN-cable-SHURE-535-UE900-TF10-WESTONE-W4-/111007581716?pt=Other_MP3_Player_Accessories&hash=item19d8914614
 
will probably feel better than the cheaper alternatives.
 
I suggest you to try it if possible, i personally tried quiet a few during my time in Hong Kong

 

[Inks]

Upgrade cables are a waste of time if tryin to improve sound for these unless you like to blatantly get ripped off. Buy a 33-75ohm resistor, use Phonak or Star tips and then you pretty much have gotten the most out of these. W4R has better channel matching, thus the premium cost.

I only see a different cable making sense for its ergonomics, even then it shouldn't be too much more

 

[meiaen]

Upgrade cables are a waste of time if tryin to improve sound for these unless you like to blatantly get ripped off. Buy a 33-75ohm resistor, use Phonak or Star tips and then you pretty much have gotten the most out of these. W4R has better channel matching, thus the premium cost.

I only see a different cable making sense for its ergonomics, even then it shouldn't be too much more

I was also skeptic at first but you never know unless you try it I used w4r before and I was able to demo a stage93 silver cable and boy I was in for a shock the sound signature really change the improvement in the high is what caught my attention so now I always plan what cable to get for my iems to suit my liking

For me Cable does more dramatic change than tips (tips itself not seal) depending on quality
And about star tips its not for everyone , I wasnt able to get a good seal from them and they are rather uncomfortable

 

[barid]

Quote:

Upgrade cables are a waste of time if tryin to improve sound for these unless you like to blatantly get ripped off. Buy a 33-75ohm resistor, use Phonak or Star tips and then you pretty much have gotten the most out of these. W4R has better channel matching, thus the premium cost.

I only see a different cable making sense for its ergonomics, even then it shouldn't be too much more

 
I agree with this.  I've tried a few different cables on full size phones (not the w4's) and while you can glean some sort of sonic difference, I find it it to be so insignificant it's not worth the cost.  Half the time I didn't even prefer the new cables to the stock (Canare on HD650 for example).
 
I could see changing the cables for ergonomic reasons (like the horrendous EX600/1000 stock cables), but I actually think the westone stock cable is the best I've tried.

 

[giveit2menow]

so then it comes down to whether the 2db channel balancing is of note. I mean has anyone got the plain w4 and noticed channel inbalance?
 

 

[barid]

Quote:

so then it comes down to whether the 2db channel balancing is of note. I mean has anyone got the plain w4 and noticed channel inbalance?
 

I have the regular w4 without the removable cables.  I do not notice any imbalance.  YMMV