[goodvibes]

I'm stuck pretty much in the middle of these extremes. For perspective, you could ask Westone or Phonak etc. how they finalize a product. They get their prototypes by math and test but they finalize them by listening and making choices beyond their measurements. If you could determine the absolute goodness by measurements this final step would not be necessary. Every good manufacturer 'voices' as a final step and that process is done by ear and not scope. It takes both but folks tend to take sides on issues and polarize discussions. The best engineer is one that understands what he doesn't know.

 

[FlySweep]

Yep.. I've never seen the two as mutually exclusive.  I love Inks knowledge on measurements.. but I also always take subjective impressions (from HeadFi'ers who's opinions I trust) into account before purchasing a phone.

 

[tinyman392]

In my mind, both have to go together (objectivism and subjectivism).  They complement and confirm each other.  Just like you would never make a big purchase based on one review, you shouldn't do it on one graph(s).  The opposite is true as well.  Just like you would never disregard a pair of headphones based on one review, you shouldn't do it because the one graph looks bad.  

 

[kiteki]

Not aimed at you, tiny.
 
goodvibes - Yes, for perspective anyone is free send letters of complaint to UE on why the UE18Pro measures like a weak UE700, they can also send letters of complaint to Fiio on why they're making the E12 when the E6 is already sufficient, and to Vsonic on why they're using more silver in the cable and not increasing the price.
 
Not sure why I have to defend attacks on these companies when they can speak for themselves.
 
I'm not really on an extreme, I look at as much science as I can but accept it's limitations, it should be a positive thing that audio science is very limited, that makes it more compelling, right?  At least that is my POV.
 
Now back to the Vsonic IEM...

 

[Freefallr4545]

Quote:

I'm stuck pretty much in the middle of these extremes. For perspective, you could ask Westone or Phonak etc. how they finalize a product. They get their prototypes by math and test but they finalize them by listening and making choices beyond their measurements. If you could determine the absolute goodness by measurements this final step would not be necessary. Every good manufacturer 'voices' as a final step and that process is done by ear and not scope. It takes both but folks tend to take sides on issues and polarize discussions. The best engineer is one that understands what he doesn't know.

WOW profound............

 

[Freefallr4545]

Quote:

 
Or what your favorite kind of tea and teacup is.
 
Last night someone tried to steal my motorbike... oh well it costs less than the LCD-3 anyway.  First world problems.

nooooooooo not the motorbike Did you chase away the would be robbers?

 

[Freefallr4545]

Quote:

 
Actually, I'm not even sure I want the spike reduced. It's what gives the GR07 the magic it has with snares and cymbals

eke, i have been thinking the same thing......not just with the snares and the cymbals, but I believe this is what makes guitars display harmonics, and gives it that EDGE>>>>oh yeah

 

[kiteki]

Yes audio is profound now back to the Vsonic IEM can we discuss the R04 or GR06 or something jeez.
 
Time to check the mailbox.

 

[sinquito]

A gotta say that FR won't matters if the headphones sounds like ****, I think maybe the technology has passed our imperfect ears, but still, our senses are subjective, just like the food to ours mouths, each to his own.

 

[kiteki]

The technology HASN'T "surpassed our imperfect ears" since the UE18Pro measures like a weak UE700 no matter which microphone you're using, in which lab, in which transfer function, in whichever internet site, look it up.
 
The 'technology' is like measuring a football field with a teacup.
 
If you want to continue this discussion post your thoughts in the Skullcandy versus Audeze thread, for the second time.
 

---

 
Now, back to the Vsonic IEM...
 
For the fifth time.

 

[Freefallr4545]

Must say I do like this thread... I would much rather continue to wait for the revs, and get a good review, with some good strong burn in and so on....... Not to start this up, but, I have a teeny bit of cabling experience, and someone wrote the new cable is light a "fluffy"  This different design, coating (cable) can all change the sound. Maybe not drastically, but enough for a focused listener, to easily pick up....I love this GR07 very much, and looking forward to more HeadFI speak
 
 
EDIT oh and by the way I'm on a green tea kick right now, just moved from Jasmine (yummy to the tummy)
 

 

[kiteki]

I will compare the silver cable versus a copper cable by...................................... using a copper extension cable.
 
You know, super advanced complicated [ 1 / N ] * Σ { [ (X_{[size=x-small]i[/size]} - μ_{[size=x-small]X[/size]}) / σ_{[size=x-small]x[/size]} ] * [ (Y_{[size=x-small]i[/size]} - μ_{[size=x-small]Y[/size]}) / σ_{[size=x-small]y[/size]} ]

 

[Freefallr4545]

Quote:

I will compare the silver cable versus a copper cable by...................................... using a copper extension cable.
 
You know, super advanced complicated [ 1 / N ] * Σ { [ (X_{[size=x-small]i[/size]} - μ_{[size=x-small]X[/size]}) / σ_{[size=x-small]x[/size]} ] * [ (Y_{[size=x-small]i[/size]} - μ_{[size=x-small]Y[/size]}) / σ_{[size=x-small]y[/size]} ]

The second sentence I understand. The first sentence I do not.......You are still going have silver in your copper test right?

 

[kiteki]

1 metre of Silver and 2 metres of Copper surely negates the Silver?

 

[kiteki]

...and the Hi-Fi ABX world went into a deep silent comatose foreverafter.