The Watercooler -- Impressions, philosophical discussion and general banter. Index on first page. All welcome.
Jun 16, 2022 at 11:48 PM Post #27,271 of 91,344
Don't let the UI affect you since there are Pros and Cons. One thing for me is that it's fast and 3 clicks to play the song. It's functional. Try and listen to one first:)
But I know it's getting harder to get hold of one since the LP7 will be delayed and not even confirmed to come out hence people are holding onto their current ones and even people snapping up the old ones.

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Nice blue strap & an awesome L&S ... 😉👌
 
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Jun 17, 2022 at 12:40 AM Post #27,272 of 91,344
Do you mean N8ii level r-2r or do you want an updated middle weight just like the current R01 N6ii?

For me personally I would like one at the $1K or $1.5K level.

The Moondrop Chu is pretty impressive.

Enjoy! Courtesy of @Blanchot

Still trying to wrap my head around it.

Loving the M9 -> Eletech Socrates -> SM...thank-you for the opportunity.

65965509-30C3-4324-BB27-638C432305B0.JPEG
 
Jun 17, 2022 at 1:15 AM Post #27,273 of 91,344
By surprise I got my new Shanling M7 and Yanyin Monnligths delivered the same day. Initial impressions are creating high expectations.

The overall tuning and timbre of the Moonlights is right up my alley even before break-in. Reminds me a great deal of my Tea MkIIs with better detail and a sense of being more neutral despite similar frequency graphs.

The M7 is as nice as a toy gets in terms of design and build quality, and a clear step up from my phone/dongle combinations I have used in the past. I might even become a DAP fan despite being a streamer with a large ripped CD library that I seldom listen to...
 

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Jun 17, 2022 at 2:47 AM Post #27,276 of 91,344
Coherence I think of as the extent to which a sound signature manifests as though from a unified whole or single sonic tapestry...for lack of a better way to put it. I'm not trying to say that people are wrong for loving their hybrid & tribrid IEMs or that any specific hybrids are incoherent. On the contrary my use of this term stems more from my trying to capture something I appreciate about single driver or single driver type IEMs like the Zen Pro or Supermoon. There is a real allure for me in single driver sound signatures...I have trouble putting it in words exactly but there is a quality they have that really stands out to me when it's there and is more and more apparent with time. I'm sorry for not being able to explain myself better.

Timbre I relate to the overall feel of the sound. It's quite connected to FR which is why I sometimes closely associate it with tonality-- but imho it is not just FR. In my experience different driver types are characterized by a specific "feel" which I think can be traced back to the speed of the driver and what it is doing-- a DD is a vibrating membrane for example, and a BA is a vibrating reed. There are obviously extremes brought about by different tuning but to my ears DD timbre, in particular in the lows and mids, is characterized by a certain natural body and richness. BAs in the mids often feel unnaturally thin to me after a while. Estats also have a very specific feel-- I wouldn't want them doing my mids or bass.. Done well I don't notice at first but I've yet to embrace a fully BA IEM (or lately an IEM with the BA doing the mids) for any substantial length of time. Planars, for me, are the best of all worlds.

The thing with both of these factors is that neither really jump out at me right away in a quick demo or blind test situation...but over time they tend to jump out at me and be increasingly more important.



I should have listed tonality as well. Timbre, Tonality, Technicalities and Coherence.



Maybe, but at least we're talking :D
Coherency is how the overall sound melds together and is major component of resolving ability. With a high quality driver handling the entire spectrum, coherency shouldn't be an issue but it can definitely be affected by the speed of the driver and its ability to handle all the info being thrown at it every second. A single driver has to produce slower bass notes and cram all the treble and mids in between almost simultaneously. In a way, a competent driver acting alone has more control in producing a seemless sound since it's literally doing all of its own work. A high res driver is inherently more coherent than a low res one. In IEMs, a well designed crossover should eliminate phase issues and the perception of there being multiple drivers, and for the most part that's true, but it's not always that simple. With the LX, one gripe was that the bass seemed to permeate the rest of the sound and not in the usual "bass bleeding into the mids" way. I figured it was because the sound is literally coming out of different tubes at the same time. When I switch over to the Vega 2020, which has a comparable quantity of bass, I don't get the same effect. With hybrid designs, you also introduce the issue of mixing DD timbre with BA/EST timbre.

Moving on to timbre, I understand it to be the distinct character of the sound. Sound is characteristically different depending on the material by which it's produced, what it's bouncing off of, or travelling through. A biocellulose driver has a unique timbre and decay compared to a beryllium driver. BAs can be extremely articulate with an unnaturally fast decay that can sound dull and plasticky, or metallic meaning raspy, wobbly, or searing, as if you were listening through a metal tube. Open backs may have an airier timbre compared to closed backs, which may be more reverberent. I remember when I tried the Utopia and it made saxophones sound raspy and weirdly resonant. I was super disappointed and wondered if that had anything to do with the fact that it's a metal driver.

Emotional engagement just means you're getting into the groove. It doesn't replace or negate describing how and why you got there :wink:
Ok so in both cases you're talking about coherence and timbre of the drivers. Got it. It all makes sense, just needed to know which parameters you're discussing. As for emotional engagement or 'getting in the groove', it's no secret I found my groove the minute I heard the Sony Signature sound in my brain. That's my bar for everything else now, which is why I keep it well away from my mainstream reviews. Because, you know...


A high end R2R dap from anyone would be a treat.
By that you mean high-end Android R2R I assume? Watch this space...
For me personally I would like one at the $1K or $1.5K level.
...yeah, that's not going to happen, not high-end anyway. You're probably looking at upward of $2.5K for Android, and upward of $6K for the rumoured L&P flagship. High-end R2R is not easy to get right in DAP format.
 
Jun 17, 2022 at 3:09 AM Post #27,277 of 91,344
By that you mean high-end Android R2R I assume? Watch this space...
Looks like you’re teasing something… 🧐
 
Jun 17, 2022 at 3:17 AM Post #27,279 of 91,344
Really not enough space in a dap to get many R2R ladders…they take up so much space on desktop gear already
 
Jun 17, 2022 at 3:35 AM Post #27,280 of 91,344
on occasion, also sound flat and meh. But those same songs I play from the Ti and it gives me exactly what the N8ii couldn't
Same here with N6ii Ti and RS6 that is a bit less techinical but still transparent with wamer/bodied tone and longer decay.
N6ii Ti is more controlled and precise, works amazing with jazz, classic, acoustic music, ambient but i prefer RS6 with hip hop, rock and lofi music.
Maybe i'd try a P6 pro
 
Jun 17, 2022 at 3:36 AM Post #27,281 of 91,344
I tihnk the most natural upgrade of n6ii TI (that is to say a flagship R2R DAP) isn't out yet :D

A high end R2R dap from anyone would be a treat.
LP6 Ti or P6 pro aren't? :smiling_imp:
 
Jun 17, 2022 at 3:39 AM Post #27,282 of 91,344
Wow, with all your other IEM experience I'm a little surprised you've not at least demoed any CFA. Andro2020 is kind of a no-brainer imho, I've had mine a year now and it still never fails to deliver with it's musicality and engagement.

You've got an RS6, right? That is an absolute dream pairing with the Andro, I sometimes wonder why I have anything else when I'm using it. Andro2020 is often described as 'bass-lite', but with the low OI of the RS6 coupled with it's rich R2R sound, I find Andro2020 almost transformed, esp with heavily electronic music.

I've demoed Solaris a few times, but each time I just haven't been able to get a decent fit, despite trying several different tips, so I've given up on them unfortunately.

Dorado2020's balls-to-the-wall bass is right up my alley, but with some of the other basshead-leaning gear I've got, I haven't found a place for it.
Thank you very much for your feedback, Andro Gold should have more bass right?
 
Jun 17, 2022 at 4:10 AM Post #27,283 of 91,344
Interesting to read the discussion on coherency, timbre etc. I've started the book 'This is your Brain on Music' by Daniel Levitin while on holidays and fascinating to read how different parts of the brain deal with various components of music such as say rhythm, pitch, tone etc. He refers to 'gestalt' and likens it to viewing a mosaic pattern as individual parts or viewed as a complete picture, becoming a cohesive whole... in the same way our brain processes each component of the music. There are of course studies on how the brain responds to various frequencies, but I doubt any have considered the intricacies of a complex IEM shoved in our ears, and how the brain then responds to driver configurations etc! Anyway, interesting to consider the discussion from the perspective of how our brain computes the cohesiveness of sound as it hits the various components the brain.
 
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Jun 17, 2022 at 5:10 AM Post #27,284 of 91,344
Jun 17, 2022 at 5:21 AM Post #27,285 of 91,344

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