[nor_spoon]

So, no Alcantara, but another material which has "better wear characteristics" all of a sudden. Really? From my understanding of your (Sennheisers) marketing, nothing could beat alcantara and you made a big deal out of this material.
Why do I have the feeling you are only telling half the truth?
Also, would you really tell us if there were changes made to the driver? I am not so sure, sorry.

 

[Omriff]

As a long-term headphone user, but also as one who is totally new to contributing to this thread (or any thread, for that matter), I wonder if I can add something to the debate.

I have a range of good headphone systems. They all depend on synergy, since, in my experience, one hears a sound which results from a combination of factors. So, for example, my Stax OmegaII sounded a little dull and uninspiring until I found the right combination of DAC and turntable inputs, with the right interconnects and - critically - mains lead, to work with my Stax 007tii (Kimik-modified) energiser. Similarly, my ALO-modified Ultrasone Edition 9s, with 18AWG Cryo cable (JenaLabs), did not sound right until I had a good, tight, but natural sounding input for them. The latter includes a Benchmark DAC 1, feeding signals into and out of it through quite high quality Nordost cables, into a Lehmann Black Cube Linear.

I have also recently bought the Denon AH-D7000s, I have the Grado GS1000 with 18AWG JenaLab cable (put on by Grado) and Grado RS1s. I have also had Sennheiser HD600s and 650s for a number of years. And I have K701s with Equinox cable.

With all of these headphones, I have found that it is essential to have the right balance of source, amplification, interconnects and mains cables for the headphones to work well. And I have the range of equipment that I do because recordings vary so much. One recording will sound good on one system, and not on another. The K701s, for example, work best through a valve headphone amplifier (such as the Earmax Silver), and in some cases are just as involving as almost any other headphone, and not too harsh. On other occasions, they work rather less well than other headphones with the same recording.

So, what I suspect is that the HD800s will sound worse in some set-ups with some recordings than other headphones, but very good in other set-ups.

What I have found, however, is that electrostatics (and I have also the SR-404 with a 006t energiser, also modified by Kimik) often sound quite different from dynamic headphones. I have, however, not heard the Orpheus. But I am willing to bet that its sound will depend on the source equipment and software. It will, nevertheless, be very interesting to hear how the two compared, Jude.

 

[Kees]

I want to know what color options we get for the new pads.
And how does Sennheiser know the new material REALLY doesn't change the sound signature?
And did they take people with allergies into account when they chose the new material?
Does the new material make them heavier or lighter?
Will the new material, being synthetic, cause static discharges?



I think the new info will keep us occupied for a couple of weeks......

 

[subtle]

Quote:

Originally Posted by immtbiker /img/forum/go_quote.gif ...especially since Alcantra was one of the selling points. So we are getting something that we pre-ordered and now the construction has changed. Why weren't we informed of this? If we weren't lucky enough to have you as a member, then we would be getting something other than what we originally paid for. Bait and switch. These headphones should have never been announced and released for pre-order, until everything was straightened out.

I couldn't agree more. This is the last thing I ever expected from a company with the stature of Sennheiser.

 

[John Willett]

Quote:

Originally Posted by nor_spoon /img/forum/go_quote.gif So, no Alcantara, but another material which has "better wear characteristics" all of a sudden. Really? From my understanding of your (Sennheisers) marketing, nothing could beat alcantara and you made a big deal out of this material. Why do I have the feeling you are only telling half the truth? Also, would you really tell us if there were changes made to the driver? I am not so sure, sorry.

Firstly, the change only happened because something came to light in the pre-production batch - that's exactly what pre-production batches are for - so it was fixed. The website was changed as soon as the change from Alcantara was made, so it was there for all to see as soon as the change was made.

And - yes - if there was a change made in the driver I would say so. Of course I would, there would be no point in hiding anything as it would only come out in the end anyway.

Any delay is only because production models have to be perfect - and almost perfect is not good enough.

 

[Morph201]

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Willett /img/forum/go_quote.gif Firstly, the change only happened because something came to light in the pre-production batch - that's exactly what pre-production batches are for - so it was fixed.

I think it was unfortunate for Sennheiser to make the BIG announcement before having all of their checks complete, including a pre-production run. The 'perfect' slogan has the potential to bite someone in the ...what rhymes with glass?

 

[John Willett]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kees /img/forum/go_quote.gif And how does Sennheiser know the new material REALLY doesn't change the sound signature? And did they take people with allergies into account when they chose the new material? Does the new material make them heavier or lighter? Will the new material, being synthetic, cause static discharges?

The change is from one micro-fibre fabric to another - I don't think you will notice any difference at all.

 

[John Willett]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Morph201 /img/forum/go_quote.gif I think it was unfortunate for Sennheiser to make the BIG announcement before having all of their checks complete, including a pre-production run.

I won't keep answering all these individual posts - I will just say that this is absolutely normal for all manufacturers.

It is normal to announce at the major show before release - with headphones it's CES and if you don't announce there you wait until next year when it's old news.

I know of several products from several manufacturers that were announced at the May European AES which were not on the market before November or December, 6 or 7 months later.

When you do a pre-production run everything is 98% there, just occasionally a change needs to be made to improve something - it's normal - but it won't degrade anything at all.

 

[TMM]

LOL @ people complaining about changes to a headphone they haven't even heard yet.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Omriff /img/forum/go_quote.gif So, what I suspect is that the HD800s will sound worse in some set-ups with some recordings than other headphones, but very good in other set-ups.

what a revelation! </sarcasm>

 

[Morph201]

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Willett /img/forum/go_quote.gif I won't keep answering all these individual posts - I will just say that this is absolutely normal for all manufacturers. It is normal to announce at the major show before release - with headphones it's CES and if you don't announce there you wait until next year when it's old news. I know of several products from several manufacturers that were announced at the May European AES which were not on the market before November or December, 6 or 7 months later. When you do a pre-production run everything is 98% there, just occasionally a change needs to be made to improve something - it's normal - but it won't degrade anything at all.

John,

I'm not trying to add to the frustration, just making an observation ... With such a 'high profile' release, you really don't want too many missteps, I just think after 7+ years in R&D something like 'wear characteristics' would have been checked.

 

[blessingx]

Quote:

Originally Posted by immtbiker /img/forum/go_quote.gif My reaction is not an over reaction by any means. It is how I feel. It is my opinion based on my credo and what I believe is right and wrong. I am not asking other's to do the same.

Since when has that been the definition of "overreaction"? Oh course it's how you feel and is an opinion. In this case it's still possibly an overreaction. Which guess what? Is my (and I suspect many others) opinion. And you're asking Sennheiser to change. Why deny you're asking others to adjust to your opinion?

Quote:

Originally Posted by immtbiker /img/forum/go_quote.gif If you don't agree with me, then I will say that I am entitled to my opinion...

What does your right to an opinion have anything to do with us agreeing or not with it? We respect your right to an opinion. Doesn't mean we have to respect your opinion.

Not to press the issue, but you're ranting in public and you're surprised someone might respond?

This thread keeps getting more and more ridiculous. Not sure why I am reading, but just to keep things straight - so now we're guessing Sony is suing Sennheiser and thus the cause for the delay?

Let me take an alternative stab - could 1-800-FLOWERS be suing over the HD800 name and preventing release?

 

[Gamerphile]

Yarrgh.... Me pirate caught an eel. Nasty one it was indeed:

• Eel's head got off in an instant ugly thing! And it was shielded with a screw on hardshell - what a mess!
• Notice how wicket its guts is with 2 supporting spines following 2 hollow spines filled with additional shielding and the individual blood veins - Yearghh what a sight!
• Every sailor knows his colors for navigation do you? Notice the boat was rocking so not fanciest job in the world but the shielding is end to end and all the practicals are 5 by 5 maity!

[/Pirate]
Sorry spend some hours in the lab and when choosing the colors for the XLR plugs pirates gut us...

 

[Wmcmanus]

Quote:

Originally Posted by TMM /img/forum/go_quote.gif what a revelation! </sarcasm>

Why go on the attack against someone who has been a long timer lurker and now a first time poster, especially when considering that he has many top end headphone systems and may well have some interesting observations to offer in the future?

I think a better response would be to say, "Welcome to Head-Fi and, well, I guess your wallet has already suffered, so there is no sense in picking apart your first post. Thanks for sharing your thoughts on the matter..."

 

[Piotr Ryka]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Omriff /img/forum/go_quote.gif As a long-term headphone user, but also as one who is totally new to contributing to this thread (or any thread, for that matter), I wonder if I can add something to the debate. I have a range of good headphone systems. They all depend on synergy, since, in my experience, one hears a sound which results from a combination of factors. So, for example, my Stax OmegaII sounded a little dull and uninspiring until I found the right combination of DAC and turntable inputs, with the right interconnects and - critically - mains lead, to work with my Stax 007tii (Kimik-modified) energiser. Similarly, my ALO-modified Ultrasone Edition 9s, with 18AWG Cryo cable (JenaLabs), did not sound right until I had a good, tight, but natural sounding input for them. The latter includes a Benchmark DAC 1, feeding signals into and out of it through quite high quality Nordost cables, into a Lehmann Black Cube Linear. I have also recently bought the Denon AH-D7000s, I have the Grado GS1000 with 18AWG JenaLab cable (put on by Grado) and Grado RS1s. I have also had Sennheiser HD600s and 650s for a number of years. And I have K701s with Equinox cable. With all of these headphones, I have found that it is essential to have the right balance of source, amplification, interconnects and mains cables for the headphones to work well. And I have the range of equipment that I do because recordings vary so much. One recording will sound good on one system, and not on another. The K701s, for example, work best through a valve headphone amplifier (such as the Earmax Silver), and in some cases are just as involving as almost any other headphone, and not too harsh. On other occasions, they work rather less well than other headphones with the same recording. So, what I suspect is that the HD800s will sound worse in some set-ups with some recordings than other headphones, but very good in other set-ups. What I have found, however, is that electrostatics (and I have also the SR-404 with a 006t energiser, also modified by Kimik) often sound quite different from dynamic headphones. I have, however, not heard the Orpheus. But I am willing to bet that its sound will depend on the source equipment and software. It will, nevertheless, be very interesting to hear how the two compared, Jude.

Junior member, you are really wise! I'm agree with all what you have wrote except that, the electrostat are quite different. I don't see such fundamental difference. By the way, AKG 701 are best with Leben CS 600.

 

[Drumonron]

Thanks for the updates, John Willett...tell your sennheiser suits, a little communication goes a long way.