[LugBug1]

  My K712s got delivered this morning, will put them to burn in for a few hours before I give them a go!

Congrats! enjoy

 

[AdamTR]

Any K712 owner can help me out? http://www.head-fi.org/t/778901/k712-owners-help-meeee

 

[chekock1]

How these headphones compares to the HD 600? 

 

[SomeGuyDude]

  How these headphones compares to the HD 600? 

 
Bigger soundstage, better bass that doesn't muddy the sound, detailed as hell without being shrill. I'd call them a step up unless you really value the neutrality of the HD600. 

 

[raybone0566]

How these headphones compares to the HD 600? 

I own both, and I can just say this. The k712 is a great addition to my collection. Soundstage. Instrument seperation & placement. You must really hear these to appreciate just how good they are. And if your really lucky & pair them with a tube amp. They blow me away every time.

 

[chekock1]

I own both, and I can just say this. The k712 is a great addition to my collection. Soundstage. Instrument seperation & placement. You must really hear these to appreciate just how good they are. And if your really lucky & pair them with a tube amp. They blow me away every time.

I like the mids on the HD 600, in the K712 the mids are up front or recessed compared to the HD600?

 

[chekock1]

   
Bigger soundstage, better bass that doesn't muddy the sound, detailed as hell without being shrill. I'd call them a step up unless you really value the neutrality of the HD600. 

Are the k712 warmer? 
Brighter or darker?

 

[raybone0566]

I like the mids on the HD 600, in the K712 the mids are up front or recessed compared to the HD600?

I don't find anything is recessed on the 712's. The soundstage is incredible. The 712 places instruments so well. At times they sound like they come from the sides, behind you, and above you. Detail retrieval is outstanding. You really have to hear these phones to get a better idea of the sound. It does take a bit to get use to, but my 600's have been getting some down time since the 712's moved in. There's an eBay seller "infinity camera" who has them for 279.00 that's where I got mine. For that price it's a no brainier

 

[SomeGuyDude]

  Are the k712 warmer? 
Brighter or darker?

 
Warmer, but not darker. The mids are a little pulled in, but it's not a major issue. 

 

[kman1211]

  Are the k712 warmer? 
Brighter or darker?

I've owned both the K712 and HD 600 for a while and spent countless hours comparing the two. The HD 600 is warmer and darker. The K712 is brighter and more energetic. Midrange wise, I find the HD 600 has more lower-midrange presence while the K712 has more upper midrange presence. Overall midrange presence is actually quite similar just focused more on different parts on the midrange. Female vocals definitely stand out more with the K712 than the HD 600, the HD 600 adds more heft to male vocals. The upper midrange presence of the K712 helps it sound more dynamic with more presence in the upper registers. Soundstage and imaging wise the K712 is bigger and more precise, the HD 600 sounds a bit claustrophobic in comparison as I personally found the HD 600 to suffer a bit in terms of soundstage width, good depth and height though. I do find the HD 600 to have slightly better timbre. I personally prefer the K712 of the two as I found it more resolving of detail, less grainy overall, and a more enjoyable listen overall. 

 

[SomeGuyDude]

  I've owned both the K712 and HD 600 for a while and spent countless hours comparing the two. The HD 600 is warmer and darker. The K712 is brighter and more energetic. Midrange wise, I find the HD 600 has more lower-midrange presence while the K712 has more upper midrange presence. Overall midrange presence is actually quite similar just focused more on different parts on the midrange. Female vocals definitely stand out more with the K712 than the HD 600, the HD 600 adds more heft to male vocals. The upper midrange presence of the K712 helps it sound more dynamic with more presence in the upper registers. Soundstage and imaging wise the K712 is bigger and more precise, the HD 600 sounds a bit claustrophobic in comparison as I personally found the HD 600 to suffer a bit in terms of soundstage width, good depth and height though. I do find the HD 600 to have slightly better timbre. I personally prefer the K712 of the two as I found it more resolving of detail, less grainy overall, and a more enjoyable listen overall. 

 
I also owned both. The HD600 was not warmer by AAAAAANY stretch. Its bass is significantly lower than the K712 all the way from subbass to upper bass into the lower midrange. That was actually a reason I went from the HD600 to the 650, I wanted something more warm and "soft" instead of the HD600's colder sound. The K712 has a lot of that warmth and lush sound, heck AKG made a big deal of talking about how they bumped the bass in the literature on these things. 
 
The only reason the K712 can seem "brighter" is because of those treble spikes, particularly that big one around 8KHz. Those do come through nicely, but the headphone as a whole is absolutely not what I'd call "bright," not when it's got that huge layer of bass under it. The HD600 got really shrill and piercing at high volumes, the K712 does not. It's actually a dangerous headphone like a Greek siren because it sounds so inviting it just makes you want to turn it up louder and louder.

 

[kman1211]

   
I also owned both. The HD600 was not warmer by AAAAAANY stretch. Its bass is significantly lower than the K712 all the way from subbass to upper bass into the lower midrange. That was actually a reason I went from the HD600 to the 650, I wanted something more warm and "soft" instead of the HD600's colder sound. The K712 has a lot of that warmth and lush sound, heck AKG made a big deal of talking about how they bumped the bass in the literature on these things. 
 
The only reason the K712 can seem "brighter" is because of those treble spikes, particularly that big one around 8KHz. Those do come through nicely, but the headphone as a whole is absolutely not what I'd call "bright," not when it's got that huge layer of bass under it. The HD600 got really shrill and piercing at high volumes, the K712 does not. It's actually a dangerous headphone like a Greek siren because it sounds so inviting it just makes you want to turn it up louder and louder

At the same time? The HD 600 was notably warmer and lusher than my K712. Maybe my HD 600 was an oddity as it sounded warmer and more intimate in the mids than my HD 650 while the HD 650 took a step back in the mids in comparison. When I put the HD 650 drivers in the HD 600 frame, I would say it was bit colder than the K712, but not the drivers that were in my HD 600. I owned and compared them side by side for over 6 months on a variety of systems, the HD 600 was always warmer and darker. The HD 600 had somewhat grainy highs which may come across as brighter to some but they really weren't. Yes, the HD 600 is softer, but the K712 was brighter and not just because of the treble peaks. I didn't find the HD 600 shrill and piercing at high volumes, I did find the 3-4khz region somewhat annoying at higher volumes on the HD 600 though. I found the HD 600 had more bass presence than the K712 while the K712 had better extension but I didn't find the subbass that rolled off on the HD 600.

 

[SomeGuyDude]

  At the same time? The HD 600 was notable warmer and lusher than my K712. Maybe my HD 600 was an oddity as it sounded warmer and more intimate than my HD 650. I owned and compared them side by side for over 6 months on a variety of systems, the HD 600 was always warmer and darker. Yes, the HD 600 is softer, but the K712 was brighter and not just because of the treble peaks. I didn't find the HD 600 shrill and piercing at high volumes. I found the HD 600 had more bass presence than the K712 while the K712 had better extension but I didn't find the subbass that rolled off on the HD 600.

 
If your HD600 was warmer than your HD650 something is very strange indeed because that's literally backwards of how those two headphones are made. Admittedly no, I didn't put the K712 directly against the HD600 because I sold the 600s a little bit ago but I compared the hell out of the 600 vs 650, traded the 650s for K712s so I can sort of work by analogy and calling the HD600s "warm" is really bizarre to me. 
 
I mean, ears are ears and I know people don't want to spend forever looking at charts, but...
 

You can see pretty clearly that the bass is raised and the treble is lowered on the HD650. I don't know how that could translate into the 600 being warmer unless you got a really weird set of 600s. Hell that's sort of the common reason people choose one or the other. The 650 is more "warm and lush" while the 600 is "accurate and neutral". 
 
Let alone the HD600 vs the K712...
 

 
Take away that spike at 8KHz and the treble on the K712 never goes higher than the HD600 (though they're at different areas), while the bass is ENORMOUSLY higher, over a 10dB difference in the lower region.
 
Again, ears are ears, and you hear what you hear, but these graphs line up pretty much exactly with how I heard them and how the reviews I've seen describe all three. If you found the HD600s warm, there's really nothing I can say because that's what you heard, but I'm definitely going to say that this isn't the expected outcome and if someone has a pair of HD600s and they buy the K712's hoping for something brighter they are likely going to be left INCREDIBLY disappointed.
 
I have right now the K712s and the Philips X1s and to be honest the K712s sound like a marriage of the HD650 and the X1 in a lot of ways. I don't really like bright headphones and these are just lovely to me.

 

[kman1211]

   
If your HD600 was warmer than your HD650 something is very strange indeed because that's literally backwards of how those two headphones are made. Admittedly no, I didn't put the K712 directly against the HD600 because I sold the 600s a little bit ago but I compared the hell out of the 600 vs 650, traded the 650s for K712s so I can sort of work by analogy and calling the HD600s "warm" is really bizarre to me. 
 
I mean, ears are ears and I know people don't want to spend forever looking at charts, but...
 

You can see pretty clearly that the bass is raised and the treble is lowered on the HD650. I don't know how that could translate into the 600 being warmer unless you got a really weird set of 600s. Hell that's sort of the common reason people choose one or the other. The 650 is more "warm and lush" while the 600 is "accurate and neutral". 
 
Let alone the HD600 vs the K712...
 

 
Take away that spike at 8KHz and the treble on the K712 never goes higher than the HD600 (though they're at different areas), while the bass is ENORMOUSLY higher, over a 10dB difference in the lower region.
 
Again, ears are ears, and you hear what you hear, but these graphs line up pretty much exactly with how I heard them and how the reviews I've seen describe all three. If you found the HD600s warm, there's really nothing I can say because that's what you heard, but I'm definitely going to say that this isn't the expected outcome and if someone has a pair of HD600s and they buy the K712's hoping for something brighter they are likely going to be left INCREDIBLY disappointed.
 
I have right now the K712s and the Philips X1s and to be honest the K712s sound like a marriage of the HD650 and the X1 in a lot of ways. I don't really like bright headphones and these are just lovely to me.

Yet the bass on the K712 sounds a bit less present to me. I've heard a couple pairs of HD 600, I've always found them a bit warm sounding, it's just been a long time since I heard the first pair of HD 600. Odd because I always found the bass on the K712 to be less than the HD 600 and HD 650(the HD 650 had more bass than the HD 600 but I found the bass to midrange transition to make the HD 600 to sound warmer), I found the K712 much tighter in the bass and can hit harder overall. While the Senns had this bloomish bass that had a more constant presence. The graphs honestly don't represent my experience with the K712 compared to either Senn. The two present sound in such a different way it makes them hard to compare for me based on graphs. 

 

[SomeGuyDude]

Like I said man, ears are ears and we don't necessarily hear the same, just that's really baffling to me, unless "warm" means something different for us. I just know the bass isn't less than the 650 or 600 at all. Can't speak on this whole "transition" thing. The HD600s sounded about as far from "warm" as they get outside of Grados or something along those lines, they were incredibly analytical to my ears and that's a strength for those who want a sound like that. 
 
I also can't figure out how bass can hit harder but be "less present." My GUESS is that the fact that the K712's scoop the mids a bit with that falloff going from about 500Hz to 1100Hz compared to the more subtle slope of the HD600s that gave the impression of "warm" since the upper bass is at the same volume rather than being audibly "separate" which leaves it "tighter". The Senns don't have "bloomish" bass, it just doesn't have a hard rolloff so those upper bass frequencies and lower mids aren't nearly so recessed. I guess that would leave a "bloomy" sound. I mean, going by that "transition" business, I'd almost wager a totally flat headphone would sound VERY warm to you because there's no dropoff from the bass to mids that scoops into the highs.
 
I'm thinking this is the biggest problem with headphone fandom. Words like "warm," "bloomy," "transition," and "bassy" can all mean wildly different things depending on who's talking.