Testing audiophile claims and myths
Apr 9, 2015 at 6:44 PM Post #4,321 of 17,336
I don't understand the point of forcing the slower speed just because. It checks itself, and if a read error is detected, it reads the frame many times: http://www.exactaudiocopy.de/en/index.php/overview/basic-technology/extraction-technology/

You might want to focus more on the error detecting features of your drive and make sure you have EAC configured properly for that. Test it with a somewhat scratched CD using DAE Quality: http://www.exactaudiocopy.de/en/index.php/other-projects/dae-quality/

The point of forcing the slow speed is DUE TO CD MAT - it can not be 100% centered on the drive and going full speed will eventually throw everything off - scracthing CD-R, CD mat, in worse case drive. Up to approx 10x there is no problem - but shiit did happen few times I forgot to check ALL the boxes relevant to speed in Nero. Due to this, changing speed is also not welcome - hence the question.
 
Although I almost exclusively work with new or mint CDs and CD-Rs, I will test it with somewhat scratched CD using DAE Quality.
 
I will look into it today - it is already tomorrow. After I wake up.
 
Thank you for the info !
 
Apr 9, 2015 at 6:47 PM Post #4,322 of 17,336
  If I have a cd mat and use it in my cd-rom drive in my pc does it somehow magically make my data better and more pure. Will my quickbooks find some money that somehow got lost because the data was copied too fast? SMH

Be careful, if you print the money it's counterfeiting, if the Fed prints money it's called Quantitative Easing.
 
Apr 9, 2015 at 7:09 PM Post #4,323 of 17,336
The point of forcing the slow speed is DUE TO CD MAT - it can not be 100% centered on the drive and going full speed will eventually throw everything off - scracthing CD-R, CD mat, in worse case drive. Up to approx 10x there is no problem


That makes sense :)
 
Apr 9, 2015 at 7:13 PM Post #4,324 of 17,336
Quote:
  There are EXTREMELY few commercially available recordings made with only two microphones outside binaural variety - which in itself is rare.
 
I already knew that which is why this...
 
Quote:
  Since my recordings are ALWAYS two mike only

 
seemed a little unlikely.  It still doesn't square with this either...
 
  However - and that is big HOWEVER - if I were listening only to two mike recordings, practically none of my records and CDs would ever get for a spin.

 
Apr 9, 2015 at 7:29 PM Post #4,325 of 17,336

If I can choose between two mike version and multimiked version of approximately same musicianship , I will go 99% with 2 mike version.
 
If I do not have 2 mike version, I will not go into the corner and sulk listening to - silence. I will enjoy what can be enjoyed.
 
I do not even have any equipment that could support multimiking - unless you count artificial head and stereo pair as something for "mixing"... - certainly never even touched a mixing desk - not even with a barge pole.
 
Apr 9, 2015 at 7:46 PM Post #4,326 of 17,336


I believe he means the recordings he makes are always two mike recordings, not the recordings he listens to.
 
I know it can be hard to decipher his posts sometimes, don't worry
smile.gif

 
Apr 9, 2015 at 7:52 PM Post #4,327 of 17,336
Be careful, if you print the money it's counterfeiting, if the Fed prints money it's called Quantitative Easing.

...
 
Apr 9, 2015 at 7:54 PM Post #4,328 of 17,336
 
I believe he means the recordings he makes are always two mike recordings, not the recordings he listens to.
 
I know it can be hard to decipher his posts sometimes, don't worry
smile.gif

Yes, the recordings I make are always two mike recordings.
 
When listening to recordings of others, I give preference to 2 mike versions - IF available. 
 
Apr 9, 2015 at 7:56 PM Post #4,329 of 17,336
  I believe he means the recordings he makes are always two mike recordings, not the recordings he listens to.
 
I know it can be hard to decipher his posts sometimes, don't worry
smile.gif

 
Now that finally makes some sense.
 
BTW, good to see another familiar face around here
 
Apr 9, 2015 at 8:51 PM Post #4,330 of 17,336
   I took a 2 year break and when I came back nothing was different. 
 
deadhorse.gif
 
 
 

 
Hey, welcome back!
I don't thing you've missed much, except maybe the HOT debacle, that was fun:
 
http://www.head-fi.org/t/741043/some-hot-science-from-synergistic-research
http://www.head-fi.org/t/744295/synergistic-research-hot-device
 
Anyone know about the final test results? I can't remember to have seen them.
 
Apr 9, 2015 at 9:46 PM Post #4,331 of 17,336
  Hey, welcome back!
I don't thing you've missed much, except maybe the HOT debacle, that was fun:

 
Wow...
 
6 pages in and I don't know whether to laugh or cry....
 
Apr 9, 2015 at 10:00 PM Post #4,333 of 17,336
  Supposedly someone's bringing one to the meet here in DC on Sunday. We'll see if it causes fisticuffs ^_^

 
Someone should bring a decent ADC and measure it while no one's looking.  Also get an accelerometer app and balance their phone on it to check if that piezoelectric sand is doing any transducing.
 
evil_smiley.gif

 
Apr 9, 2015 at 10:22 PM Post #4,334 of 17,336
  OK, thank you for the clarification.
 
As you are most probably using it - does it change reading speed during the process ? According to the Features, it does. Can it be forced to go slowly, at some constant speed, not exceeding say 10x during ripping ?

 
FWIW, I just ripped a track 10 times using cdparanoia, and the resulting rip was identical all ten times. And it was certainly reading faster than 1x speed, and had to correct a few frame jitter errors that occurred at different times for each rip. So it's at least consistent.
 
Apr 10, 2015 at 7:44 AM Post #4,335 of 17,336
   
FWIW, I just ripped a track 10 times using cdparanoia, and the resulting rip was identical all ten times. And it was certainly reading faster than 1x speed, and had to correct a few frame jitter errors that occurred at different times for each rip. So it's at least consistent.

Interesting, I will have to try this one too.
 
Same question as for EAC - can it be kept from spinning - EVER - faster than say 10x ? Does it change it speed, in case it finds sector(s) it needs to read again?
 
This is the reason why it is impossible to check for errors while burning in Nero using mat - there is NO WAY the verification can be done at anything but top speed of the drive and that was the first time I got "shiit happens" ( it will, naturally, throw the mat, which can , for all practical purposes, never be 100% centered on the CD/drive, off - together with the CD(R), in best case only scratching mat ). No other way of preventing this fatal spin-up but unchecking the box for verification of the copy after burning in Nero. If I have overlooked something that CAN control the speed during verification after burning in Nero ( I am using Nero 8 because back compatibility with Yamaha CRW-F1E USB burner and compatibility with Win7 - later versions of Nero may no longer work ) and someone knows how to do this, I would appreciate it very much.
 
Please note authoring physical CDs is VERY important to me - musicians generally do not have time or knowledge working with files of ANY kind - and they are the most satisfied with CDs (strictly speaking CD-Rs). Therefore burning in highest possible quality IS a concern and that leaves for now Yamaha/Nero combo as the only one I know to support Audio Master Recording Quality. Changing the Yamaha drive is NOT an option - under any circumstances ( I did stock up on these... - NOS, used, refurbished, whatever-that-still-works-ed ...).
 
Long story short - does cdparanoia EVER spin up beyond say 10x speed, even for the shortest of time? Can this be controlled/limited - damn the time required ?
 
Here comes the clincher :  no time were the errors you all are obviously so preventing to occur while copying AUDIBLE. According to at least one result, my copy SHOULD sound like - shiit. No way this was borne out in listening - EVER.
 
But playing back the CD in a normal CD player with or without CD mat is instantly audible. And copy made using mat during ripping and burning sounds also better than the one that used mat only during ripping OR burning - let alone one not using mat at all.
 
In short - errors other than that as displayed by numbers of any of these "exact copy" methods have to be at work during normal playback on CD (DVD, did not try Blue Ray) players. Picture improvement on the DVD players that can use CD mat ( usually spin-up in certain models precludes use of mat ) is CLEARLY VISIBLE.
 
This is an honest question - I am not making this up. Even if it turns out CD ripping without mat using "exact" methods is good enough for creating file to be listened from HDD/SDD, I would still like to know how and why it makes so audible difference when playing disc back by a player.
 

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