[Mython]

How about a cirrus logic DAC is still a Cirrus Logic DAC, it doesn't matter how your design the circuit and body, it still gonna be the Cirrus Logic ? And don't deserve to be priced as such 2400$ ? AK240 ?
 

 
I agree that the AK240 doesn't deserve to be priced at $2400.
 
 
 
Difference between different circuit implementations of the Cirrus chip is quite different from the differences between ZX1 and ZX2 implementations of their in-house silicon, though, because the Sony chips are much more integrated than the circuitry in competitors' DAPs - even those that employ op-amps.
 
So, your point is valid, but (AFAIK, and I'm happy to be corrected on this) there seems less variation in implementation possible with the Sony chips.
 
And whether or not the circuit changes in the ZX2 improve the sound of the chips used in the ZX1, a circuit redesign still doesn't justify charging several hundred bucks more. It's just a different pattern of tracks on a PCB, and a few component alterations/improvements.
 
 
I'm actually surprised at how many people are leaping to Sony's defence on this - they have really done very little to justify charging you all $450 more.
 
Sure, you can all think I'm just a PITA, but the ZX2 approach is the thin end of the wedge. It's another step in the direction of A&K (anyone remember them doubling the price of the AK100 when they added a 2nd DAC chip in the AK120?).
 
Oh well... if people keep drinking the koolaid and willingly paying to be fleeced, so be it. It's bad for customers and the direction of the industry as a whole, and I dread to think what prices we'll be seeing in 5 years time.

 

[jamato8]

Well the proof is in the hearing. Mine got delayed on shipping. I expect that they got more orders than expected. And if it needs an amp for more demanding phones, which 15mW would denote (I didn't realize it had so little power when I ordered it and I don't use IEM's too much), I won't worry. From what I have read the ZX2 should be a fun listen. For a simple just throw in the pocket I like the Alien. 

 

[gerelmx1986]

 
I agree that the AK240 doesn't deserve to be priced at $2400.
 
 
 
Difference between different circuit implementations of the Cirrus chip is quite different from the differences between ZX1 and ZX2 implementations of their in-house silicon, though, because the Sony chips are much more integrated than the circuitry in competitors' DAPs - even those that employ op-amps.
 
So, your point is valid, but (AFAIK, and I'm happy to be corrected on this) there seems less variation in implementation possible with the Sony chips.
 
 
I'm actually really surprised at how many people are leaping to Sony's defence on this - they have really done very little to justify charging you all $450 more.
 
Sure, you can all think I'm just a PITA, but the ZX2 approach is the thin end of the wedge. It's another step in the direction of A&K (anyone remember them doubling the price of the AK100 when they added a 2nd DAC chip in the AK120?).
 
Oh well... if people keep drinking the koolaid and willingly paying to be fleeced, so be it. It's bad for customers and the direction of the industry as a whole, and I dread to think what prices we'll be seeing in 5 years time.

Ia gree, wonder how that *much* would be the difference between ZX series vs the A10, they use the same DAC made by sony, i don't think so a justificable diff. i'mpretty happy with my little A17 has soemthing ipods will never have (SQ and expandable storage), I want to try an zx1/2 vs my A17 but unfortunately i don't have that much money

 

[AUDIOBREEDER]

I had a chance to listen to ZX1 and A17 with EX1000, as dynamic drivers sound better and drive easy with walkmans, I was surprised as A17 sounds 'fuller and healthier'
Then to me, as A17 costs $299, the Zx1 sounds like an under $500 player to my judgement.
I will be getting the Zx2 sometime later this year as its available here in the US, as I waited for A17.

Ia gree, wonder how that *much* would be the difference between ZX series vs the A10, they use the same DAC made by sony, i don't think so a justificable diff. i'mpretty happy with my little A17 has soemthing ipods will never have (SQ and expandable storage), I want to try an zx1/2 vs my A17 but unfortunately i don't have that much money

 

[gerelmx1986]

I had a chance to listen to ZX1 and A17 with EX1000, as dynamic drivers sound better and drive easy with walkmans, I was surprised as A17 sounds 'fuller and healthier'

Then to me, as A17 costs $299, the Zx1 sounds like an under $500 player to my judgement.
I will be getting the Zx2 sometime later this year as its available here in the US, as I waited for A17.

Cool did really the A17 sounds better than ZX1, that's shoking for audiophiles, for me i knew it, same DAC by sony... expected little difference. but holy cow a "budget" player sounding better than a "audiophile-grade"  player.
 
The guy who sold me the fiio x3 told me the same between x3 and AK100, he spotted no difference to justify a price jump of 299 for x3 vs 1500 us for AK100
 
Glad i have the A17, a real pocket hi-fi, pairing it with XBA.H3 at work and 1R at home, currently listening the full "eition" of Jordi savall Marin marais pices de violes for Astree label (now known as Naive France, the label oof the Vivaldi edition) in 24-bit/88.2Khz, sound so good.
 
One of those albums is 16/44 and i will  upgrade it to 24/88.2, saw it on qobuz France for 15 euros, not bad about 300 mexican pesos, what most music stores sell you here in mexico s standard CD

 
do I spot a ifference on the 24 vs 16 bit versions, yes when concentrated on it, more airy, Harpsichord becomes more clear and forward sounding rather than pushed back and almost inaudible and the viol has it's spirit (internal resonances) present

 

[Whitigir]

You really want the competition reviews from the same guy ? Here

A17 vs ZX1 vs Po(r)No vs Zx2


First link 17-zx1-Pono

http://www.enjoythemusic.com/magazine/equipment/1214/Sony_NWZ_ZX1_NWZ_A17_Pono_Music_Player.htm

Second link Zx2

http://www.enjoythemusic.com/magazine/equipment/0215/Sony_NW_ZX2_Walkman_Review_Noble_Kaiser_K10.htm

Third link AK240, the top of the line here

http://www.enjoythemusic.com/superioraudio/equipment/0614/astell_kern_ak240_review.htm

It is a clear and by much the music quality from Zx2 perform better than both 17/zx1/Pono to me. Decay, resolution are 20-30% better....value for the money is also 4/5 stars. . To have this much quality improved, especially in audiophile world.....it is a leap! Not a marginal difference

The only thing I see ak240 more impressive = 24/384 vs Sony 24/192 ....but really....is there any music at 24/384 ? I can not find one for myself....even 24/192 is super rareeee

 

[gerelmx1986]

You really want the competition reviews from the same guy ? Here

A17 vs ZX1 vs Po(r)No vs Zx2


First link 17-zx1-Pono

http://www.enjoythemusic.com/magazine/equipment/1214/Sony_NWZ_ZX1_NWZ_A17_Pono_Music_Player.htm

Second link Zx2

http://www.enjoythemusic.com/magazine/equipment/0215/Sony_NW_ZX2_Walkman_Review_Noble_Kaiser_K10.htm

Third link AK240, the top of the line here

http://www.enjoythemusic.com/superioraudio/equipment/0614/astell_kern_ak240_review.htm

It is a clear and by much the music quality from Zx2 perform better than both 17/zx1/Pono to me. Decay, resolution are 20-30% better....value for the money is also 4/5 stars.

. To have this much quality improved, especially in audiophile world.....it is a leap! Not a marginal difference

The only thing I see ak240 more impressive = 24/384 vs Sony 24/192 ....but really....is there any music at 24/384 ? I can not find one for myself....even 24/192 is super rareeee

I was actualy referring sony vs sony... apples to apples... pono and astell & kern have different DAC manufacturers, sony develops it's own DAC chip and the S-master HX has been used since F880/zx1 to present A17/zx2
 
Yep i use 24/88.2 or 24/96, i find no audible difference past that sample/bit depths, i tried super hard and found no difference, mostly i have is 16/44.1, and i have the feeling some of the music will never be available in 24-bit esp 1980's to 1990's (earlier) was already recorded in 16/44

 

[Whitigir]

I was actualy referring sony vs sony... apples to apples... pono and astell & kern have different DAC manufacturers, sony develops it's own DAC chip and the S-master HX has been used since F880/zx1 to present A17/zx2

Yep i use 24/88.2 or 24/96, i find no audible difference past that sample/bit depths, i tried super hard and found no difference

Yes, follow the links. You will find 17 vs ZX 1 there...I found a17 to perform better than ZX1....while the Zx2 is leap and bound away from both. That was the way he rated it, and I will take it




Click on the pictures for larger and better resolution. The second one is NW ZX2

 

[Mmet]

Yes, follow the links. You will find 17 vs ZX 1 there...I found a17 to perform better than ZX1....while the Zx2 is leap and bound away from both. That was the way he rated it, and I will take it




Click on the pictures for larger and better resolution. The second one is NW ZX2

if those reviews are accurate and true that would be the increase in just sound quality !! ... let alone the battery life increase , the versatility of the android system and freedom of using all audio apps , the ability to watch video clips  too with such audio quality ,the size and portability factor !! i wish if can afford that player 

 

[mosh_2k7]

Just a quick question. Does it really matter what class of micro sd card i use in the zx2? Im torn between a lexar 300x (45mb/s) vs 633x (95mb/s). Would it make much of a difference?

 

[gerelmx1986]

 

I was actualy referring sony vs sony... apples to apples... pono and astell & kern have different DAC manufacturers, sony develops it's own DAC chip and the S-master HX has been used since F880/zx1 to present A17/zx2

Yep i use 24/88.2 or 24/96, i find no audible difference past that sample/bit depths, i tried super hard and found no difference

Yes, follow the links. You will find 17 vs ZX 1 there...I found a17 to perform better than ZX1....while the Zx2 is leap and bound away from both. That was the way he rated it, and I will take it




Click on the pictures for larger and better resolution. The second one is NW ZX2

he refers to a term as inner resolution, what is exactly that?, i understand new sonys are Hi-re capable e.g 24 up to 192KHz

 

[Whitigir]

Exactly, especially if you can rip Dvd and Bluray into video music tracks...etc you get that idea. Gonna be a lot of works

But Audio Quality alone is already "A Leap" from both Zx1 and A17.

 

[Mython]

Just a quick question. Does it really matter what class of micro sd card i use in the zx2? Im torn between a lexar 300x (45mb/s) vs 633x (95mb/s). Would it make much of a difference?

 
 
It depends how often you change the music on the microSD card.
 
If you fill most of it up and then leave it the same for months or years, then the slower one will be fine for you, as long as you are patient when you first need to fill it with music.
 
It will be fast enough for playback.
 
 
But if you change the music content of the card quite frequently, then it'd be worth buying the faster one.
 
Personally, I'm happy with the slower cards as I rarely change the music once they're filled.

 

[Whitigir]

he refers to a term as inner resolution, what is exactly that?, i understand new sonys are Hi-re capable e.g 24 up to 192KHz

I don't really get the clarification from him. But I would take where Goldenears refer to as High-Resolution and with the scale of "Dull-Vivid, -5/+5". I would take his "inner Resolution" as the expression of clarity and detail...vivid or dull ?

In this case it looks like he rated it full scale on vivid +5 ? Where Zx1 and A17 only was average 3/3.5...but his scale is full 5 and no negative then let's do 10. His 3/3.5 = 6-7/10 for zx1 and A17.... Then his ZX2 will score 10/10

 

[mosh_2k7]

It depends how often you change the music on the microSD card.

If you fill most of it up and then leave it the same for months or years, then the slower one will be fine for you, as long as you are patient when you first need to fill it with music.

It will be fast enough for playback.


But if you change the music content of the card quite frequently, then it'd be worth buying the faster one.

Personally, I'm happy with the slower cards as I rarely change the music once they're filled.

Thats good to hear. I'll get the slower card. No point paying double for a faster card. Thanks