[xjaynine]

Everyone owes it to themselves to learn.

1) What under-powered really sounds like.
2) What correct IEM fit is.
3) What sound they are after in the end.

I feel like these ideas should show in a popup window message whenever someone clicks into a thread.

 

[Simon T]

Well... while the weekend on the Z1r was spent mostly for burn-in... decided to take a couple of pictures for size comparison among some Sony IEM OLDer and NEWer:



Brief background history, the EX1000 is my "first love" in IEM, which pushed me to purchase the 800ST and EX600 for investment purposes (maybe one day they will be worth more than i paid for, "mentality"); then, it became a quest of finding the Sony successor of the EX1000, was a little disappointed with the H3, while Sony took a different approach/signature with the Z5; hence, here we are with the Z1R. And... i need more time to find my personal conclusion.

Also, in lieu of the last few pages discussion on source equipment, the "weirdest" pairing i have experienced so far on the Z1R is with the Sony NW-ZX1 (pic below), without the ClearAudio+ setting the sound on the Z1R was 1 dimensional i.e. no width (right and left channel almost non existent), everything was presented/layered in front of you like a tunnel. On the other hand with the ClearAudio+ setting switched on, the sound was much more bearable, and it made the Z1r sounding much brighter albeit the bass was not controlled.



Cheers

 

[nanaholic]

I looked at Crinacle's graphs last year (product demo) and this year (after product release). They looked identical with no changes. This is what someone posted on reddit:

"The people on Head-Fi can't read between the lines and are overly trusting of manufacturers. When an industry rep at a trade show gives you an answer to a sensitive question like the release date of a product, its always phrased in such a way so you stop asking questions.

The idiot of Head-Fi that said Sony was going to re-tune the IER-Z1R is one of those people. He was probably told that Sony was still working on improving the sound quality of this product and therefore couldn't provide a release date. Instead of having social skills and being able to read the air, he took that response at face value and concluded that they actually re-tuning the product.

Addicted to Audio, an Australian retailer, said much later that the delays were a result of production issues related to the zirconium shells. That's an answer that makes sense and that's not an answer Sony was going to provide at a trade show."

It seems like there wasn't a product retune. This is good news for those who were afraid Sony will pull a tia fourte and make the final version worse. This is good news!

Your post doesn't make sense, if an industry rep said there is a production issue it also means they want you to stops asking questions regarding release dates, it has exactly the same effect as saying they are still fine tuning the product because both still implies the product is not ready, this has nothing to do with social skills, rather people wanting to believe in unverifiable conspiracies.

 

[candlejack]

Your post doesn't make sense, if an industry rep said there is a production issue it also means they want you to stops asking questions regarding release dates, it has exactly the same effect as saying they are still fine tuning the product because both still implies the product is not ready, this has nothing to do with social skills, rather people wanting to believe in unverifiable conspiracies.

Whether true or not, his post does make sense: "production issues" doesn't have the same PR ring as "improving the quality of the sound".

 

[dohonghai81]

1Z + Z1r just amazing.
Why i cant post any images here?

 

[jeffreyw311]

Your post doesn't make sense, if an industry rep said there is a production issue it also means they want you to stops asking questions regarding release dates, it has exactly the same effect as saying they are still fine tuning the product because both still implies the product is not ready, this has nothing to do with social skills, rather people wanting to believe in unverifiable conspiracies.

Addicted to Audio isn’t really an industry rep with the same degree of skin in this game, they don’t represent Sony. They’re a retailer and have their own asses to cover with the number of people asking where the hell the IER-Z1R is. That’s why they can say that there are production issues with the shells.

If Sony tells you directly that they’re having production issues with this item, what connotation does that statement invoke? None of it is positive, that’s why they’re not going to say that to the public.

That doesn’t mean Addicted to Audio is being honest either, seeing their statement isolated the production issues to the aesthetics of the shells and nothing else, but production issues are by far the most obvious explanation for the delays as there’s nothing in these IEMs that are straight off the shelf.

All of this kind of has to do with social skills. It should be pretty clear when something is a crafted PR friendly statement and when something isn’t. Industry trade shows, especially audio, are nothing but a whole lot of puffing. It’s no different to Addicted to Audio telling me that the Focal Utopia had a million man hours put into the development of the world’s most advanced headphone driver in an attempt to get me to ditch my Sennheiser HD800.

 

[Redcarmoose]

1Z + Z1r just amazing.
Why i cant post any images here?

You just need to make a couple more posts then it will let you post photos.

 

[ProF3T1]

Well... while the weekend on the Z1r was spent mostly for burn-in... decided to take a couple of pictures for size comparison among some Sony IEM OLDer and NEWer:



Brief background history, the EX1000 is my "first love" in IEM, which pushed me to purchase the 800ST and EX600 for investment purposes (maybe one day they will be worth more than i paid for, "mentality"); then, it became a quest of finding the Sony successor of the EX1000, was a little disappointed with the H3, while Sony took a different approach/signature with the Z5; hence, here we are with the Z1R. And... i need more time to find my personal conclusion.

Also, in lieu of the last few pages discussion on source equipment, the "weirdest" pairing i have experienced so far on the Z1R is with the Sony NW-ZX1 (pic below), without the ClearAudio+ setting the sound on the Z1R was 1 dimensional i.e. no width (right and left channel almost non existent), everything was presented/layered in front of you like a tunnel. On the other hand with the ClearAudio+ setting switched on, the sound was much more bearable, and it made the Z1r sounding much brighter albeit the bass was not controlled.



Cheers

Me, as a current wm1a + ex1000 user, would be very interested in your opinion They do look huge I must say.

 

[nanaholic]

Addicted to Audio isn’t really an industry rep with the same degree of skin in this game, they don’t represent Sony. They’re a retailer and have their own asses to cover with the number of people asking where the hell the IER-Z1R is. That’s why they can say that there are production issues with the shells.

If Sony tells you directly that they’re having production issues with this item, what connotation does that statement invoke? None of it is positive, that’s why they’re not going to say that to the public.

That doesn’t mean Addicted to Audio is being honest either, seeing their statement isolated the production issues to the aesthetics of the shells and nothing else, but production issues are by far the most obvious explanation for the delays as there’s nothing in these IEMs that are straight off the shelf.

All of this kind of has to do with social skills. It should be pretty clear when something is a crafted PR friendly statement and when something isn’t.

Saying they have a production issue or that they are still fine tuning the production is both a net negative thing to say. Also the risk of saying they are still fine tuning the product is actually bigger, because you inflate the expectation of the launch which could mean unmet expectation causing a bigger backlash when the product is actually sold. That is a potentially bigger PR blunder to manage than being upfront with a relatively minor production delay reasoning.

There's no different payoff for the rep to pick one line of reasoning over the other if the original intent was to stop the line of questioning. There's also the possibility that it was actually BOTH were the reasoning of the delay, and that the different people merely relayed a different part of the message.

Again, this has nothing to do with any social skills. It just means you want to believe in conspiracies that big companies are always lying to you that you pick the one that sounds better to you, when either options are actually equal.

 

[jeffreyw311]

Saying they have a production issue or that they are still fine tuning the production is both a net negative thing to say. Also the risk of saying they are still fine tuning the product is actually bigger, because you inflate the expectation of the launch which could mean unmet expectation causing a bigger backlash when the product is actually sold. That is a potentially bigger PR blunder to manage than being upfront with a relatively minor production delay reasoning.

The original claim, from memory, was that Sony was taking impressions from auditions and striving to produce the best product possible. That’s like the most PR friendly statement imaginable.

The statement doesn’t even suggest that there will be any changes, which there are none as shown by measurements. In fact a statement like that literally says nothing at all.

The only way anyone can come to a conclusion that there will be a retune is if they take that statement at complete face value. Which then I’ve got a 1990 Ford Falcon for sale, it’s in perfect working condition, has 300,000 easy miles on it, is a collectable classic that will appreciate and has had no problems whatsoever in its lifetime.

 

[Redcarmoose]

1Z + Z1r just amazing.
Why i cant post any images here?

Click on “upload file”

 

[Sp12er3]

Well... while the weekend on the Z1r was spent mostly for burn-in... decided to take a couple of pictures for size comparison among some Sony IEM OLDer and NEWer:



Brief background history, the EX1000 is my "first love" in IEM, which pushed me to purchase the 800ST and EX600 for investment purposes (maybe one day they will be worth more than i paid for, "mentality"); then, it became a quest of finding the Sony successor of the EX1000, was a little disappointed with the H3, while Sony took a different approach/signature with the Z5; hence, here we are with the Z1R. And... i need more time to find my personal conclusion.

Also, in lieu of the last few pages discussion on source equipment, the "weirdest" pairing i have experienced so far on the Z1R is with the Sony NW-ZX1 (pic below), without the ClearAudio+ setting the sound on the Z1R was 1 dimensional i.e. no width (right and left channel almost non existent), everything was presented/layered in front of you like a tunnel. On the other hand with the ClearAudio+ setting switched on, the sound was much more bearable, and it made the Z1r sounding much brighter albeit the bass was not controlled.



Cheers

So the driver housing radius is as big as the old Sony's, even tho the DD diameter is clearly smaller.. Hmm.. I do remember they had to fit a tube on back side of the circumference of that DD, one thing for sure, those DDs have way more volume of air to move.

I'm one of those Rares that is comfortable in wearing any "big" IEM housing tho, so I'm not really worried about fit.
I feel the XBA A3/Z5 is very comfortable. IM04, fits like a glove.
Damn this thread is packed.
I blame @Redcarmoose for this influx of traffic .
Your review is just that fun.

 

[Kitechaser]

And Kite's "straight ten girlfriend."

Not about to put post pics of my girl for you degenerates. She will probably be with me at CanJam though.

 

[candlejack]

Not putting her pics up for you degenerates. She might be with me at CanJam though.

Good thinking, that still buys you a few more months.

 

[Goldfish memories]

Saying they have a production issue or that they are still fine tuning the production is both a net negative thing to say. Also the risk of saying they are still fine tuning the product is actually bigger, because you inflate the expectation of the launch which could mean unmet expectation causing a bigger backlash when the product is actually sold. That is a potentially bigger PR blunder to manage than being upfront with a relatively minor production delay reasoning.

There's no different payoff for the rep to pick one line of reasoning over the other if the original intent was to stop the line of questioning. There's also the possibility that it was actually BOTH were the reasoning of the delay, and that the different people merely relayed a different part of the message.

Again, this has nothing to do with any social skills. It just means you want to believe in conspiracies that big companies are always lying to you that you pick the one that sounds better to you, when either options are actually equal.

I don't think Sony facing production issues in manufacturing the zirconium housings is a "conspiracy theory". In fact, an interview with DUNU I read a few months ago seems to support this view. Here are the relevant parts:

Interviewer: So in terms of the delay in getting sufficient quantities in stock; you mentioned the Zirconium alloy casing was the big delay. But doesn’t the Falcon-C use the exact same manufacturing process? As I can recall, Campfire Audio used the alloy for a number of their previous models as well, and the new Sony IER-Z1R flagship, outside of its Magnesium alloy inner structure, uses it for the exterior housings as well.

Andy Zhao: Well, let’s just say that when I go visit the shell factory, which is just a few blocks away from us, I get to see the production progress of shells for other brands as well, and it definitely seems like everyone, regardless of brand, has a difficult time with this alloy. If we tried to do mirror finish polishing like one of the other models you mentioned, it would be even more difficult to produce.

CEO Mike: Material-wise, the Zirconium alloy is really great, but it is just so difficult to work with. We’re not sure we’ll continue to work with this material in the future, and we’re going to hold internal discussions on whether to transition to something else in the future.

The fact that measurements of the pre-production and retail units are virtually identical also seems to disprove the theory that the delay was due to sony re-tuning the sound.