Sennheiser RS220 Availability?

[Gwarmi]

Quote:

I said in a previous post that other impressions of the sound signature have been general, not specific. After actually going back and looking at a few of them (not all...so there may be more I missed), I see I was wrong.
It's interesting to note the differences between Otinkyad's and Head Dragon's impressions - which are more or less in agreement with each other - and Gwarmi's. Not to put down anyone's observations - it's just striking how subjective this hobby is.

 
 Guess we all have different views - just putting the RS220 through some bright stuff now - Aerosmith's 'Dude looks like a lady'
 compared to the HD650 next to me they sound more forward and definitely brighter! I'm running them in tandem, HD650
 off a Sugden HA-4 Masterclass, SPDIF out from the DAC to the RS220 base unit.
 
 To me the RS220 has a slight mid range 'shoutiness' that is absent from the HD650.
 
 

 

 

[otinkyad]

My comparison of RS220 with HD 650 was definitely tentative, as I didn't have the HD 650 with me any more to compare (and I didn't listen to the HD 650 that much when I did have it).  I'm sure there were differences I missed/didn't remember.  I would certainly defer to a comparison made by someone who has both.
 
I'd have more confidence in my comparison that RS 220 sounded more like LCD2 than like HE500, as I had all three with me at the time, and feel like I'm fairly familiar with the LCD2 and HE-500 sounds.

 

[curiousgeorgieo]

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I'm having trouble finding literature on this model, since everything I've found so far is in Japanese. In his review of the DS7500, George includes a translated blurb: "Also supports high-quality source with more than six times the amount of information about 192kHz, 24bit maximum." Based on this, I would tend to agree this suggests the inputs can accept the hi-res signal, but not necessarily that the transmitter transmits in the same signal. It would be helpful, though, if there were more to back this up. Can you direct us to more information, kstuart?

Hey guys these are some very valid and interesting points on the Sony MDR-DS7500.  That would be some tricky false advertising if they are marketed as a true lossless wireless headset if it in fact does downsample during transmission.  I e-mailed Sony Canada trying to ask if it downsamples while transmitting through the headphones.  I do notice a sound quality difference when in truehd or dts hd-ma mode compared to dolby digital mode, for example, , however yes it would be good to confirm if this is my own amateur placebo effect which is very possible.
 
Thanks for the good insight,
 
George

 

[GiacomoHoldini]

That would be some tricky false advertising if they are marketed as a true lossless wireless headset if it in fact does downsample during transmission.

It depends on what definition of "lossless" to which one adheres. If we mean lossless from a redbook standard, then the Sony would be lossless. If, though, it has to downconvert higher-res signals for transmission, then it clearly would not be lossless for all formats.

I'm also curious to know if the DSSS chip is the same in both models. If kstuart can tell us what he's basing that assumption on, that too might be helpful. I haven't seen any literature stating that all DSSS transmissions are limited to a modulation of 16/48.

 

[Head Dragon]

When I was doing my comparisons, it was in relation to my Stax setup, powered by a tube amp.  I've never owned any other Sennheiser
headphones, so have no way of comparing the sound of the RS220 with the HD 650, or any other Sennheiser product.  I've listened to
other dynamic headphones over the years, both open and closed, but have no way to do a direct comparison with any of those at this time.
The one thing about the Stax that is a bit fatiguing for me is the treble can be a bit harsh or bright, perhaps a bit too revealing of the source, and the use of the tube amp helps to soften this sonic characteristic for me. The top end of the RS220 don't seem harsh or overly bright for me in comparison to the Stax, but might seem so to others comparing them to other dynamic driven headphones.
  My RS220 setup is way more casual, and so is my critical listening with them.  As I mentioned my time is spent watching late night TV/DVD and on weekends,  music on the deck.  I haven't tried the optical input yet for music yet, only coaxial.  I will try and pick up some cable this weekend and give that a listen as well.  I still haven't experienced any of the drop outs or hum/whining sounds that others have reported.
I do have an Apple wireless router, but live in a house, not in the city in an apartment, so maybe interference is not such an issue for me.
    I can understand that if I was experiencing drop outs, or annoying hums, I would probably obsess about it as well, as I tend to do about such things,  and it would take away from my enjoyment of the overall good sound and convenience.  $600 ain't cheap no matter how you slice it, and for that money you need to be able to sit back and enjoy the ride, not spend your free time doing workarounds for problems inherent in the design of the product.
  For the record, I also have high ceilings in my bedroom that peek at around 15 feet and the transmitter in located at around the 12 foot mark.
All this being said, for my specific needs, good sound, convenience, and comfort, and not looking for the ultimate and last word in audiophile headphone design, these cans do the job as intended.

 

[VandyMan]

I've had my RS220 for about a week now. No issues with dropouts except when I go to to the adjoining room. No micro dropouts. There is sometimes a very faint high pitched sound when no music is playing, but I can't hear it when there is sound -- even with quiet sounds at low volumes.
 
Overall, very clear detailed sound that is about halfway between an open and closed can.
 
As for comfort, there is something that is hurting the top of my head unless I position the phones just right. I think I will get used to positioning them correctly, so I'm not worried about this.
 
I prefer my 12+ year old HD600s, but I am really am enjoying being free of wires and expect I will use the RS220s quite a bit for TV. I've owned a variety of wireless headphones, but gave up on them prior to Klear or whatever the new tech is called. They sure have come a long way.
 
It would be really cool if the base station supported AirPlay.
 
 
 
 

 

[rav3n]

Hi all.
 
I have been lurking around this thread for quite some time, and finally decided to take the plunge and bought the RS 220 today.
 
As for my history, I have been using a custom IEM by JH audio (JH11) for about 2 years now, so I suppose I can only compare the SQ between the RS 220 and the custom IEMs. I am not an absolute audiophile, so don't take my words!
 
Of course, the IEMs cost a lot more and is made to fit my ears, but I have to say, for now, having listened to the RS 220 for about 20 minutes, the experience has been great (especially since this is wireless).
 
I have always wanted to get some over ear headphones, and came across with the RS 180. So many people have said good things about it, so just when I was about to purchase it, I saw this thread, and knew about the RS 220. I thought it would be quite stupid, if I were to go for the RS 180 now, since I am prepared to pay the extra for a newer, more stylish, and possibly better wireless headphones.
 
I was indeed very worried, that it will have micro drop-outs like some members here have been experiencing. I have literally just opened the box and tried them on (the battery seems to be a bit charged, not completely empty). I couldn't wait until it is fully charged before trying it.
 
So far, no micro drop-outs AT ALL. The bass, for me, is more than enough. It is crisp, solid, and tight. Comparing it to the JH11, which has duo drivers for the bass department, I have to say that it obviously does not match up to it, but I am really impressed by it, giving that it is wireless too.
 
Mids and trebles are fine, too, but I think they do need some burning in before I can comment on it in detail.
 
I have never used/tried any Sennheiser over-head earphones, so I cannot compare it to say, the HD 600/650.
 
On a side note, while I went to the shop today, I saw a HD 800 and I tried it on for about 10-15 minutes. Of course, that costs a fortune, and is supposed to be one of the best headphones out there. I feel that both RS 220 and the HD 800 feel very comfortable around my head, and that the SQ, bass, mids, trebles and the soundstage of the HD 800, to be honest, is almost equal to my custom IEM (maybe because I don't have a very sensitive ear?). But I really do not think HD 800 is worth its asking price.
 
As some members have said before, these cans do its job so far. I finally understand why Jude says these headphones are the ones that he will recommend as a primary headphones, they are really 'that good', especially when it is wireless too!
 
Cheers.

 

[GiacomoHoldini]

Thanks, Rav, and welcome to Head-Fi. Please be sure to keep us posted how the RS220 is working out for you.

 

[rav3n]

Thanks for the welcome Giacomo. I read that you have been pondering as to whether to get the RS 220 or not? Which headphones do you currently use?

 

[GiacomoHoldini]

Right now my options are pretty limited. I have past experience with a number of older Sennheiser and Sony models, but for now I trade off between a Sennheiser HD570 and Bose QC15, as well as a pair of Monster Turbines that I use solely for working out. None of them are ideal, although I steadfastly maintain the QC15 isn't as bad as a lot of people on this forum would suggest. I recently bought and returned a Sony V900 HD, which was so lacking in bass, and so clinical on the top end, that I simply couldn't enjoy it. At this point, I'm taking my time mulling over options, considering relatively affordable models like the Denon AH-D2000, slightly more expensive options like the RS220 and HD650, and have even considered waiting longer, saving up, and either going the custom IEM route, or into higher-end over-ear models like the HD800, LCD-2 or 3, or whatever. Right now, I'm just gathering as much information as I can, and having discussions with the fine folks here.

 

[otinkyad]

It's encouraging to hear the three new reports (Gwarmi, VandyMan and rav3n, if I'm counting right) of RS220 positives without negatives.  I'd definitely like to have a set of these at some point down the road.  (I returned the RS180s, by the way -- I began to find the treble a bit too pronounced).

 

[kstuart]

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(I returned the RS180s, by the way -- I began to find the treble a bit too pronounced).

I continue to be very satisfied with the RS180s.   I found very significant improvements in sound quality by changing how it was hooked up to my system, and the relative volume of source vs volume on headphones and attenuate switch up/down.  Also a cable change made a difference - even though it was not from a "regular" cable to an "audiophile" cable.
 
It does have an amplifier and since it is not an "RSA Dark Star" level amplifier, then it has certain limitations and you can make it clip, which automatically causes the treble to be annoying, of course.
 
I still find this comment from Mike at Headfonia's professional review to be accurate:
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Overall, the tonal balance is very likeable, far more likeable than the reference HD650/HD800 models. Think of it as a lighter footed HD650. The sound doesn’t quite have the weight of the HD650, but at the same time it’s more nimble, less dark, and is more forward and engaging than the HD650. The RS180 is more or less similar to the HD558/598 when it comes to the overall refinement and sound fidelity factor. However, compared to all the Sennheiser I have in my possession: the HD800, HD650, HD598, HD558, and the HD555, the RS180 still stood out as having the most enjoyable tonal balance among the bunch. The difference is mostly in the midrange, where the fuller midrange of the RS180 makes it more engaging and fun, and less dark than the other Sennheiser compatriots (with the exception of the HD800). It is indeed interesting that Sennheiser chose to fit such a fun sounding tonal balance for its wireless model, but at the same time not making it available on the wired models. As it is, the RS180 stands out very strongly due to the tonal balance.

I would add that I find the RS180 to have the most accurate reproduction of electric guitar based music, of any headphone I have used - which, unfortunately is a far smaller range of models than Mike.
 
I see the RS220 being compared in this thread with the LCD-2, HE-500, HD800, JH11 and SE535, but if you do not normally use headphones in that price range, you might find the RS180 more practical (as long as you are willing to spend a little time adjusting them).
 
Of course, all of the above is highly variable, with great dependence on a) your equipment b) your musical tastes c) your taste in audio balance, which is probably partially due to small differences in ear shape and structure between different people.
 
 

 

[kstuart]

Quote:

I'm also curious to know if the DSSS chip is the same in both models. If kstuart can tell us what he's basing that assumption on, that too might be helpful. I haven't seen any literature stating that all DSSS transmissions are limited to a modulation of 16/48.

The RSSS products are very new and there is no information at all - google searches come up with "RSS" misspelled as "RSSS" and a Camaro.  The translation you quoted is the only information on the new Sony.   Even the 16/48 of the RS220 is from a Forum comment somewhere. So, what I said was "The RS220 undoubtedly uses the same third-party DSSS transmission chip as the Sony, so both are 16bit 48khz,"  The word "undoubtedly" means the same as "I am confident that", in other words, "based on all previous experience".

In order to have wireless headphones and digital transmission, you must have a specialized chip in the headphones, discrete or generic parts will not suffice. The Sennheiser Kleer series (RS180, etc) uses a third-party chip:

http://www.smsc.com/index.php?tid=346&pid=227&cid=&tab=1

So, it seems highly unlikely that Sony and Sennheiser have different DSSS chips in their headphones.- especially since both DSSS headphone products appeared at the same time.  Since the chip is a relatively small cost at this price point, if there were a 16/48 chip and a 24/192 chip, it would seem odd for Sennheiser to downsample the 96k input that they support, if there were a 24/192 receiver chip available.   But again, it would be odd for the third-party to have both variations at exactly the same moment, rather than developing one after the other (as SMSC did with Kleer).
 
Also, reviews of the previous models in the Sony Wireless line do not engender a lot of confidence - no user replaceable battery and not as comfortable as the RS180 (although I have not heard any of the Sony Wireless line).

 

[GiacomoHoldini]

The RSSS products are very new and there is no information at all - google searches come up with "RSS" misspelled as "RSSS" and a Camaro. 

I got the same thing when I searched "RSSS." But searching "DSSS" tends to produce more results.

 

[otinkyad]

I should have mentioned that the RS180 having too much treble for me has a lot to do with my being treble-sensitive.  As I've noted in earlier posts, I think the SQ is good in general, and I do think the RS180 will be an excellent option for many people, especially at half the price of the RS220, although $330 is not inexpensive either.  I also found, like kstuart, that SQ could be improved -- in my case, by putting a DAC in the chain.  I listen at extremely low volumes, so I'm guessing clipping was not a factor affecting treble.