RAZ's TOTL review and rambles thread... could it be.... alive?

[jwbrent]

I personally haven't experienced burn in with any IEM that I've owned - and in the times that I have, it's easily attributable to brain burn considering just how flawed we are as an animal haha.

Regardless though, even if the shoutyness was to disappear, I'd still have several issues with the Odin's upper midrange, especially with how forward and in your face it is. Not only that, the entire midrange remains very thin and shrill, and to my ears it doesn't match the texture and decay of the bass.

To add to that, I mentioned that the Odin does sound pretty nice with the jazz that I listen to, but the majority of my alt rock, pop, rap and hip hop were plain unlistenable on it - to get it to where I more or less enjoy it the burn in would need to shave off several entire decibels from the upper midrange, and realistically that can't happen, especially since you can't see the effects of burn on any FR graph.

If I had a small issue in some aspect of the Odin I'd try and see if I can correct it, but throwing 3400$ at something that I dislike in almost every way is just silly

Thank you for the chat, and I look forward to reading more in this thread.

 

[mvvRAZ]

Thank you for the chat, and I look forward to reading more in this thread.

Thank you bud!

Ultimately there's like a million different preferences - best I can do is share what works for me, and hope it can be helpful as just one more reference point. I generally encourage anyone reading this thread to absolutely not read only this thread - these are ridiculously expensive purchases and you should collect as much information as possible before committing to anything.

 

[gLer]

Thank you bud!

Ultimately there's like a million different preferences - best I can do is share what works for me, and hope it can be helpful as just one more reference point. I generally encourage anyone reading this thread to absolutely not read only this thread - these are ridiculously expensive purchases and you should collect as much information as possible before committing to anything.

You should pin this post Michael. Also, not sure if you have already, but can you maybe do a post with your music preferences (and main test tracks), and maybe a bit about what you listen for/how you like them presented?

Saying something along the lines of "I prefer my Def Leppard drums more aggressive" or "I want Lana sounding more euphonic than dry" would be more useful than saying I like a more lively sound and drier vocals.

 

[froger]

I enjoyed both Sultan and Odin the most during my audition with various iems like Campfire Solaris 2020, Final audio A8000 and EE Hero, ESR II. I felt the 2 stood up well above the rest, by being very good technically and yet highly musical. In my personal experience, compared to Odin, I thought Sultan is more in your face with its forward mid while Odin is smoother with clearer details. Odin seems more effortless and it also has better bass texture. I listen mostly to pop songs.

 

[Damz87]

On the topic of burn in, sometimes I wonder if it’s something a lot simpler than actual burning in of the drivers - maybe it’s just our ears getting a better/different fit with the shell/tips?

Tips and insertion depth of IEM’s has a pretty drastic effect on sound quality in my experience. And sometimes it’s a very subtle change in how an IEM sits in your ear or how wide a tips bore is that can change the sound.

The other thing I’ve noticed is that my ears stretch and tighten depending on how often I am listening to IEM’s, so if for example I use an IEM for an extended period on one day, the next day I’m able to get a deeper fit in my ear and I notice a difference in sound (more isolated, fuller bass, extra clarity in the treble etc).

Not saying any of this is fact, but this is just something I have noticed and thought maybe some could potentially interpret these subtle changes as burn-in? Thinking out loud here

 

[gLer]

In my personal experience, compared to Odin, I thought Sultan is more in your face with its forward mid while Odin is smoother with clearer details.

That's almost the exact opposite of how @mvvRAZ heard them. Gotta love this hobby. That's a horse! No it's a camel! No it's a donkey! Meanwhile...

 

[mvvRAZ]

You should pin this post Michael. Also, not sure if you have already, but can you maybe do a post with your music preferences (and main test tracks), and maybe a bit about what you listen for/how you like them presented?

Saying something along the lines of "I prefer my Def Leppard drums more aggressive" or "I want Lana sounding more euphonic than dry" would be more useful than saying I like a more lively sound and drier vocals.

I believe I made a mini post like that after the whole Odin drama, but I might just add it to the post with all the rest of the biases.

As a more general principle though, I'm a consumer first and a reviewer second - whether or not I enjoy something remains the most important factor to me

I'll add the disclaimer though, thanks for the input!

I enjoyed both Sultan and Odin the most during my audition with various iems like Campfire Solaris 2020, Final audio A8000 and EE Hero, ESR II. I felt the 2 stood up well above the rest, by being very good technically and yet highly musical. In my personal experience, compared to Odin, I thought Sultan is more in your face with its forward mid while Odin is smoother with clearer details. Odin seems more effortless and it also has better bass texture. I listen mostly to pop songs.

Do you listen to Asian pop by any chance? I've been told that forward upper mids are extremely popular over there (the entire Acoustune lineup for example - especially the 1695Ti), the Homunculus is really successful in China etc - it might be specific to what each of us listens to

That's almost the exact opposite of how @mvvRAZ heard them. Gotta love this hobby. That's a horse! No it's a camel! No it's a donkey! Meanwhile...

This hobby is a nightmare, but this lama is mad cute

On the topic of burn in, sometimes I wonder if it’s something a lot simpler than actual burning in of the drivers - maybe it’s just our ears getting a better/different fit with the shell/tips?

Tips and insertion depth of IEM’s has a pretty drastic effect on sound quality in my experience. And sometimes it’s a very subtle change in how an IEM sits in your ear or how wide a tips bore is that can change the sound.

The other thing I’ve noticed is that my ears stretch and tighten depending on how often I am listening to IEM’s, so if for example I use an IEM for an extended period on one day, the next day I’m able to get a deeper fit in my ear and I notice a difference in sound (more isolated, fuller bass, extra clarity in the treble etc).

Not saying any of this is fact, but this is just something I have noticed and thought maybe some could potentially interpret these subtle changes as burn-in? Thinking out loud here

Agreed - there's a million factors that are extremely difficult to control for. Even using a set of tips for a while makes them assume the shape of your ear (especially prevalent with Acoustune tips) so the insertion and fit keep on getting better and better with more listening time.

 

[froger]

I listen to a mixture of Asian and English pop songs. Not sure about the preference, but the singer definitely sounds more forward and in the face with Sultan as compared to Odin.

 

[mvvRAZ]

I listen to a mixture of Asian and English pop songs. Not sure about the preference, but the singer definitely sounds more forward and in the face with Sultan as compared to Odin.

Interesting. Would you say that happens with both male and female singers? I found that the sultan makes male singer sound closer to you, while the Odin makes female vocals sound much too forward for my taste

 

[froger]

I didn't notice the difference in the fowardness between male and female voices, but I remember hearing more details in the female voices.

 

[mvvRAZ]

I didn't notice the difference in the fowardness between male and female voices, but I remember hearing more details in the female voices.

Yeah, there's just a lot of upper mids on the Odin - considering that's where most female vocals reside you'd be hearing just about everything in that region

 

[froger]

I guess that's what I prefer: not so in the face, yet able to hear the details.

 

[mvvRAZ]

I guess that's what I prefer: not so in the face, yet able to hear the details.

That wasn't my experience with the Odin, but hey, to each his own

 

[chickenmcnug]

I only just had the realisation that my library has only 2 female artists lol.

It's also 95% of different rock, this is probably why I like my warmth.

 

[mvvRAZ]

I only just had the realisation that my library has only 2 female artists lol.

It's also 95% of different rock, this is probably why I like my warmth.

Actually I might as well just post a screenshot of the stuff I listen to

@gLer I'm attaching a full list of the artists I listen to on the daily (I have more stuff in my Tidal but this covers like 90% of my listening). The Gaming EDM folder has a variety of stuff, so does the Singles folder (individual tracks that I like but where I don't have a full album I enjoy). The Rockstar folder has most of my classic rock, as I don't have too many albums I can listen to back to back there so it's mostly a few tracks from different artists scattered here and there.

The only artist missing from this list is Yelawolf (a sort of trashy Southern country rap). Might update this list as I go to the trouble of downloading more stuff but just to get an idea