[Paulo83]

Standard as well?

Sorry, I don't understand your question.

 

[Tony1110]

To be honest I had some slight glue/sealant seepage around the seal between the faceplate and body of my Savants (received about 3weeks ago) and slight scratch/indent to one faceplate. That being said it wasn't anything too major and I can't see it when they're in my ears . My other half said I should complain based on the amount of money spent etc but living in the UK I couldn't be bothered with the hassle.

Both my N6 and Savant came with little marks near the top of the shell. I asked about it and found out that they're put together that way. They are very minor and as they're covered by a two year warranty I'm not really bothered. The Noble universals have very tough shells.

 

[FullCircle]

Sorry, I don't understand your question.

 
 
There are two universal configuration, a two tier product placement.
 
 
1) classic/standard = injection molded, non hand polished, non lacquered shell/housing.  Due to this, injection molded seams will be present, along with any idiosyncrasies that may occur at the injection mold facility.   The face plate is not joined seamlesly to the shell, as it is glued on and scewed down.
 
2) Wizard design = injectiom molded as well, hand sanded, removing any idiosyncrasies that the is left behind through the injection mold process etc etc.   A hand crafted/carved face plate is joined to the shell, and sanded down with the shell as well. Giving a seamless joint/seal between the face plate and shell.   Lacquer is then hand applied giving a polished look to the shell and face plate.   Lastly, the Wizard signature is etched into the shell
 
 
Overall, a much greater amount of time is dedicated to the build prociess of a  Wizard design product.  

 

[FullCircle]

Both my N6 and Savant came with little marks near the top of the shell. I asked about it and found out that they're put together that way. They are very minor and as they're covered by a two year warranty I'm not really bothered. The Noble universals have very tough shells.

 
 
Those marks/divets are called "injection gate marks"
 
 

 
 

 
 
 
You are probably familiar with model car kits.  When you twist the part off the grid, a little piece of plastic is left behind on the part, and you then cut off the residule plastic, leaving behind an injection gate mark. The universal shells are also produced on a grid, much like model car parts.
 
 
On Wizard Design products, the injection gate marks are sanded down, along with injectiom mold seams.

 

[bobjane]

After reading the review that described the injection molding marks, I contacted Noble asking to cancel my order as I knew I wouldn't be happy with a $500+ IEM bearing such cosmetic flaws. I was given the choice between cancelling the order or having a pair without any marks cherry picked for me. It didn't happen and I ended up receiving a pair with IMO significant marks:

 
Upon returning them I was told that just about all standard Noble Universals have these marks and that there were no unmarked pairs available. I had to upgrade to a pair of Wizards instead.
 
Yes Dr Moulton you have explained the nature of the marks on multiple occasions now and I fully understand their origin. Yet you never addressed the concern that this level of finish really doesn't match a product in this price range. What I do not understand are the following:
 
1) I'd assume that other plastic shelled earphones/IEMs are built using a similar process. However I have never come across another earphone with these marks, regardless of whether they cost $2 or $300. Imagine if a $50 mass produced IEM carried similar marks - it would be unacceptable.
 
2) Yes I am familiar with model kits. Having built a great many of them I can say this - to get a mark as deep and ragged as the ones in the pair I received you would have to rip the part from the grid with either extreme carelessness and/or a complete don't-care attitude. A model kit has tens of these joins while a pair of Noble IEMs has two. So yes for $600 I personally expected these two joins to be processed with a lot more finesse. I've seen small children build their models more neatly than this.

 

[FullCircle]

  After reading the review that described the injection molding marks, I contacted Noble asking to cancel my order as I knew I wouldn't be happy with a $500+ IEM bearing such cosmetic flaws. I was given the choice between cancelling the order or having a pair without any marks cherry picked for me. It didn't happen and I ended up receiving a pair with IMO significant marks:

 
Upon returning them I was told that just about all standard Noble Universals have these marks and that there were no unmarked pairs available. I had to upgrade to a pair of Wizards instead.
 
Yes Dr Moulton you have explained the nature of the marks on multiple occasions now and I fully understand their origin. Yet you never addressed the concern that this level of finish really doesn't match a product in this price range. What I do not understand are the following:
 
1) I'd assume that other plastic shelled earphones/IEMs are built using a similar process. However I have never come across another earphone with these marks, regardless of whether they cost $2 or $300. Imagine if a $50 mass produced IEM carried similar marks - it would be unacceptable.
 
2) Yes I am familiar with model kits. Having built a great many of them I can say this - to get a mark as deep and ragged as the ones in the pair I received you would have to rip the part from the grid with either extreme carelessness and/or a complete don't-care attitude. A model kit has tens of these joins while a pair of Noble IEMs has two. So yes for $600 I personally expected these two joins to be processed with a lot more finesse. I've seen small children build their models more neatly than this.

 
 
I really can't attest to the way the shells are removed from the grid, as I'm not present when this process is done, the shells come direct from the factory pre-removed from the grid.
 
As said before, currently we offer two tier universals.   If someone desires our best build, then a Wizard Design would be the option to select. It does appear that this "tier" system is too far from tradition, and should be reviewed.

 

[ajs6269]

Those marks/divets are called "injection gate marks"











You are probably familiar with model car kits.  When you twist the part off the grid, a little piece of plastic is left behind on the part, and you then cut off the residule plastic, leaving behind an injection gate mark. The universal shells are also produced on a grid, much like model car parts.


On Wizard Design products, the injection gate marks are sanded down, along with injectiom mold seams.

I'm a nerd - I build model airplanes and I'm a member of IPMS...

 

[Simon T]

Personally speaking based on experience. I'd rather have Cosmetic defects, than functionality issues.

When I received my LCD3 (non fazor) sometimes ago, the left driver was faulty soon after (working one day and not working the other), until it went dead, and had to ship it back to the U.S.

Another scenario was when Sony launched their first hi res audio line, bought their PHA 2 (portable DAC) together with the NW ZX1. The PHA2 was not fully functional, and had to ship it back to Japan.

I have 4 of Noble's products (BTS inclusive), thank God, there are no problems with them.

Cheers

 

[tourneychamp23]

Personally speaking based on experience. I'd rather have Cosmetic defects, than functionality issues.

When I received my LCD3 (non fazor) sometimes ago, the left driver was faulty soon after (working one day and not working the other), until it went dead, and had to ship it back to the U.S.

Another scenario was when Sony launched their first hi res audio line, bought their PHA 2 (portable DAC) together with the NW ZX1. The PHA2 was not fully functional, and had to ship it back to Japan.

I have 4 of Noble's products (BTS inclusive), thank God, there are no problems with them.

Cheers

I agree but the point i think he is trying to make is reasonable. It isn't like he paid $5 on some street corner for the headphones...

 

[rmullins08]

Just had to take out my N6's I use at the office to take a look at mine.  Never noticed the little mark before.  Oh well.  Back in the ears they go.

 

[Richsvt]

The Savants are considered 'wizard' so they should not have those marks? Just curious.

 

[fiascogarcia]

  The Savants are considered 'wizard' so they should not have those marks? Just curious.

They have both a standard faced and a wizard designed faceplate.  It appears the standard faceplate suffers those marks.

 

[FullCircle]

How we differentiate products is the color of the screws, trouble is the screws are not aluminum, due to that u can't anodize them every color of the rainbow. We r limited on the colors that the screws can be plated, and our colors are used up. The sollution was to go with rose gold, and add the signature, as a rose gold N5 does not have the signature. So that is some of the history behind that.


As mentioned before, we offer two tier universals, one standard and one wizard design & so if the savant is not a wizard design, then it would have injection gate marks, obvious joint between face plate and shell..... And great sound

 

[Paulo83]

I understand where you are coming from with the tiering but I also personally feel I have paid quite a premium price for a pair of iems that do not appear premium in finish. There are no end of engineering/design solutions that would solve such a simple problem. For example why not place the 'gate' on the inner side of the shell?

To be honest for the problem to be dismissed as 'well you bought the budget option' smarts a little having parted with a sizeable amount of money.

 

[Richsvt]

Didn't realize that there was a choice in the Savant. Thought it was only Wizard.
I am looking to purchase this and just curious as to its designation. The website has it listed under the Wizard selection. Didn't see any mention of a 'standard' one.