[IpodHappy]

Quote:

I actually prefer dynamic over BA just like the bass better as well as th decay of dynamics. So while tempted to try customs I have held off. To be blunt other than wanting to try the FX700 I am seriously considering selling most of my higher end stuff and getting back to just enjoying music and spending money on things that integrate me with my family rather than isolate me not to mention take away funds that could be used for everyone vs just myself.

 
x3.  The rich experiences you have with your family will give you indelible memories while the pleasures of your sound explorations are a bit more transitory.
 
 

 

[IpodHappy]

Double post.
 
 

 

[nadsta]

Quote:

I'm not quite getting the hype about these.

These are good, smooth, non-fatiguing and comfortable, yes. However, this is what they're not: original.

They are boring, really. They actually kill most of the emotions of songs due to lacking highs, warm mids and accentuated midbass.
It's like they were designed for background listening. I can't really get into the music.

Maybe it's because I'm used to the HJE900, but if the SE215 did one thing to me, it's to appreciate the Panasonics even more!

 
I don't think these have been hyped that much.  Certainly no one's hyped their treble response. I found HJE900 had arguably a better sig for electronica but for alt rock or male vocal stuff they're surpassed by the 215s to my ears. Good complimentary headphones though. Not sure what you mean by 215s not being original.
 
 
Quote:

I actually prefer dynamic over BA just like the bass better as well as th decay of dynamics. So while tempted to try customs I have held off. To be blunt other than wanting to try the FX700 I am seriously considering selling most of my higher end stuff and getting back to just enjoying music and spending money on things that integrate me with my family rather than isolate me not to mention take away funds that could be used for everyone vs just myself.

x4!
 

 
 

 

[smw30]

Quote:

How long did you have it for? I have came across a few posts where one of the buds has died. did you try reattaching the cable?
pure bummer... This steers me away and have me lean toward choosing the Westone 1 over SE215.

Yeah I re-attached the cable, swapped the cable and the right bud works with the left cable so it's definitely the bud that's dead. 
Had them for a month. 
Sending them back to Shure. Ah wellllll. 

 

[IpodHappy]

Comparison between the SE215s and the SM3s
 
This was a more difficult comparison than the others which preceded it.  The SM3 is a chameleon line IEM, sounding one way with one piece of music and another with a second.  It's as though there some extra special sweet spots in the sound signature, and some notches elsewhere.  I've written and changed many of these comparisons as a result based on different tracks with different instrumentation.    The source material this time is Dream Theater's "Scenes from a Memory."  This album has some great features for listening; good punchy lows, sparkling highs, strong ambient echoes, vocals, instrumentals, you name it.  Some of the listening came from my own tracks.
 
Bass:  The bass on the SE215 is slightly more plentiful than that of the SM3s.  But that doesn't mean it's better.  The SM3 has a rich, deep bass which envelops you as you're listening to source material.  There's impact, thumping, down to the deepest levels.  The SM3 bass is fast and precise.  In contrast, the bass of the SE215s, though more pronounced, has a bit of bloat.  The bass drum beats come out, but the lowest frequencies are a bit blurred as though the constant eighth beat bass drumming is just too much for them.  Winner: SM3s.
 
Mids:  The mids of the SE215 are a bit more forward than those of the SM3.  Words jump out more clearly.  You can hear all the breaths of the vocalists with the SE215s.  The SM3s are just a bit more recessed in comparison.  But to me, the mix between the mids on the SM3s compared to the bass and treble is simply sweet, so carefully balanced, so buttery smooth.  Winner: SM3s.
 
Treble: The SM3s have more treble extension than the SE215s.  The instruments have a bit more shine, the singer's consonants a bite more bite.  The treble nudge helps the SM3s handle dense passages with more alacrity than the SE215s.  It should be said that muddy passages sound muddy with both the SM3s and the SE215s.   Though the SM3 is a warm balanced armature IEM, the SE215 is a bit warmer in comparison.  Winner: SM3s.
 
Spaciousness:  The SM3s put you on the stage with the performers.  The SE215s put you four or five rows back regardless of the volume.  The SM3 sound has more of that "in your head" quality than SE215s.  There's a bit more ambience with the SE215s, more echo.  But the SM3 is more spacious, with the instruments spreading out around you, even though you're on the stage with them.  This is really a bit confusing to me and kept me listening and listening.  More ambience and sense of location with the SE215s, but more breadth with the SM3s.  Hmm, I'll take the breadth.  Winner: SM3s.
 
Ergonomics:  I've modified my SM3s by cutting off the slider clasp at the Y of the cable.  The leads from the split to the ear pieces were just too short on the SM3s.  Additionally, the angular shape of the SM3 drivers can really dig into the ears over time, especially if you have relatively small ears.  I compared the driver bodies of the SE215s side by side, and surprisingly, the SE215s are a tad longer by a fraction of a millimeter.  But the contour of the SE215 housing keeps this length from digging into the ear.  Microphonics are better with the SM3s due to their almost perfect cable.  Winner: SE215s.
 
Isolation:  Due to the great sound blocking of the dense Shure foams, the SE215s give better isolation compared to the SM3s with the long Comply tips.  Winner: SE215s.
 
Conclusion:  The SM3 outshines the SE215s in many respects and provides a more satisfying listening environment.  The winner: SM3s.

 

[ericp10]

I have seen not hype on the 215 either. I just seen the majority who own them say that they are a very good IEM for the price. And I would never call them boring. Now, comparing the 215 to the SM3 or W3 (which I haven't heard personally) or any other top tier IEM is like comparing apples to oranges. I guess you can do it, but what is the point? On the other hand, comparing the 215 to the HJE900 or even DDM is more feasible and realistic IMO. I actually just listened to the HJE900 and 215 back to back yesterday, and for me it's more of a wash. There are some things the 215 does better than the HJE900 that I enjoy (such as mids and vocals). Than there are things the Panny does better than the 215 (such as electric guitars and it has a wider soundstage). When listening to strings, the HJE900 makes violins sound better to my ears, but the 215 win with the cello and lower stringed instruments. The conclusion I reach is that it is wash. I can't say one is better than the other in sound. It's just different sound signatures. I can see how someone would prefer one sound signature over the other. I happen to like both of the different sound signatures, but it depends on the mood I am in. 

 

[IpodHappy]

Ericp10, thanks for your comparison to the HJE900s.  You've asked a good question why I'm comparing a $100 IEM to a $350 IEM.  There are a number of reasons.  The primary goal was to see how close a state of the art dynamic might be to approaching a multi-driver balanced armature, or even a dynamic driver purchased at a much higher price point.  Flavio's premise at the start of this thread was that the SE215 will shake up the $100 dollar market.  In my opinion, he's right in that the SE215s are better than my UE700s, and marginally better than my MTPCs (almost a toss up).  Still, the comparison showed they're not what I would consider close to the W3s or the SM3s.  Additionally, I had read very little about the SE215s before purchasing them and starting the comparisons, so I'm hoping my impressions are unbiased compared to what they might have been with a lot of research before the purchase.
 
I've been a bit disappointed with my dynamic driver IEM explorations.  I started with the Monster Turbines, but returned them.  The IE8s are just too bloated in the lower end for my tastes, though I kept these for reference.  I was going to write a comparison of the SE215s to the IE8s, but after some quick listening to the IE8s, I decided there wasn't any point.  Similarly, I wrote a comparison of the W3s to the IE8s a year back but never posted it since it was just too negative on the IE8s, and I know a lot of people like them.  I found the MTPC and MTPG to be a step up in the dynamic driver department.  I'm happy to find the SE215s an incremental improvement on top of those.
 
I'm sure there are better dynamic IEMs out there--I just haven't tried them yet.
 
One last point, it would be great if an IEM company took cost reduction with improved functionality as seriously as the electronics industry focuses on ever higher levels of integration and performance at lower costs.  With the market for IEMs growing, more automated production techniques should be able to produce higher performance at lower prices.  It would be nice to see IEMs following a "Moore's Law" of their own.  Look at the complexity of a hard disk drive compared to the complexity of the balanced armature drivers in an IEM.  The drivers are far less complex, yet cost more.  My netbook cost $350 with 2Gb of RAM and 250GB of hard drive space, roughly 20-30 billion transistors, multilayer PCBs, LED lit display, WiFi, BlueTooth, USB, VGA, graphics, an operating system, etc.  Many of the components use a 45nm process requiring 3 billion dollar wafer fabs.  My SM3s cost $350 with 6 balanced armature drivers, some resistor and capacitors.  There are about 5 billion cell phone subscribers world wide, with each cell phone mostly capable of playing some music.  The high volume market is there.

 

[ericp10]

Hello ipodHappy,
 
Some excellent points, and thanks for explaining in detail why you were making those comparisons. I agree with what you said about the IE8. For me, it was just the veil over the sound of that Senn (and all Senns that I have heard) that I just couldn't get with. I do agree that IEM prices should come more, but all of these listeners of cell phones with music players are content to listen to cheap i-buds for the most part. I have tried to give audiophile IEMs to my sister and some friends, and they don't get don't the big deal. To them it's just a fancy looking i-bud, and they even complain about having to insert deeper in their ears than say a bud.  So us audiophile listeners have created a smaller market, and the higher-end manufacturers know we will pay for a technology that gets a little better and better with each release. But I do feel that this hobby will level out eventually and prices may start decreasing. We'll see. Oh, have you heard or thought about trying the JVC FX700? For the money, it's the best dynamic universal IEM I have ever heard, and it is my favorite universal period (although I don't own anymore because I wasn't really listening to it after I bought my first custom). I think if you ever get a chance to hear it you will know how good a dynamic IEM can be. I actually preferred it over the SM3.
 
Quote:

Ericp10, thanks for your comparison to the HJE900s.  You've asked a good question why I'm comparing a $100 IEM to a $350 IEM.  There are a number of reasons.  The primary goal was to see how close a state of the art dynamic might be to approaching a multi-driver balanced armature, or even a dynamic driver purchased at a much higher price point.  Flavio's premise at the start of this thread was that the SE215 will shake up the $100 dollar market.  In my opinion, he's right in that the SE215s are better than my UE700s, and marginally better than my MTPCs (almost a toss up).  Still, the comparison showed they're not what I would consider close to the W3s or the SM3s.  Additionally, I had read very little about the SE215s before purchasing them and starting the comparisons, so I'm hoping my impressions are unbiased compared to what they might have been with a lot of research before the purchase.
 
I've been a bit disappointed with my dynamic driver IEM explorations.  I started with the Monster Turbines, but returned them.  The IE8s are just too bloated in the lower end for my tastes, though I kept these for reference.  I was going to write a comparison of the SE215s to the IE8s, but after some quick listening to the IE8s, I decided there wasn't any point.  Similarly, I wrote a comparison of the W3s to the IE8s a year back but never posted it since it was just too negative on the IE8s, and I know a lot of people like them.  I found the MTPC and MTPG to be a step up in the dynamic driver department.  I'm happy to find the SE215s an incremental improvement on top of those.
 
I'm sure there are better dynamic IEMs out there--I just haven't tried them yet.
 
One last point, it would be great if an IEM company took cost reduction with improved functionality as seriously as the electronics industry focuses on ever higher levels of integration and performance at lower costs.  With the market for IEMs growing, more automated production techniques should be able to produce higher performance at lower prices.  It would be nice to see IEMs following a "Moore's Law" of their own.  Look at the complexity of a hard disk drive compared to the complexity of the balanced armature drivers in an IEM.  The drivers are far less complex, yet cost more.  My netbook cost $350 with 2Gb of RAM and 250GB of hard drive space, roughly 20-30 billion transistors, multilayer PCBs, LED lit display, WiFi, BlueTooth, USB, VGA, graphics, an operating system, etc.  Many of the components use a 45nm process requiring 3 billion dollar wafer fabs.  My SM3s cost $350 with 6 balanced armature drivers, some resistor and capacitors.  There are about 5 billion cell phone subscribers world wide, with each cell phone mostly capable of playing some music.  The high volume market is there.

 

 

[munkyballz]

^ Ditto with ericP's suggestions on the FX700 for a really nice dynamic based IEM.  Also might check out the Sony EX1000, which is also suppose to be magnificent, although I have not had a chance to listen to it yet.  And also seems like the VSonic GR7 is starting to make some positive waves in the IEM circuit from Joker's review...
 
BTW:  Thanks for all the reviews IpodHappy;  Even though the comparisons might seem a bit out of place at first (price brackets), they are nevertheless very enjoyable to read and also nice to see and view the differences between different signatures, types, and of course prices/leagues.  Cheers!

 

[ericp10]

One thing  I must say, although I am enjoying the 215's overall sound, nothing I can think of  (not even my beloved FX700) can beat the Panny HJE900 in it's reproduction of electric guitars. I've been going back and forth all night between the 215, HJE900 and TS02  wood DD IEMs, and there is something about the Panny's that make electric guitars love them. Again, it's a mixed bag otherwise (love the 215's mids over all; the TS02 has natural sound and wide soundstage; HJE900 has a nice soundstage and very good clarity for a DD - fast too). The market is great for 2nd tier IEMs (pushing hard on the top tier door).

 

[stavs16]

looking for my first expensive pair of IEM's, would you recommend these to someone who likes house, trance, dubstep, rock and metal?

 

[Soaa-]

I bought a pair of these only to return them a few hours later.

Treble performance was absolutely abysmal: not much extension, and a spike at around 5kHz that sounded like an old badly tuned TV. I just couldn't listen to them. Shame, 'cause I really liked the detachable cable.

 

[ericp10]

A few hours of listening reveals nothing of what a dynamic driver is capable of.

 

[Soaa-]

Perhaps it doesn't reveal what it can do, but I certainly heard what it does wrong. I'm sure it has redeeming qualities, but that treble spike was just offensive to my ears. That's all I needed to bring them back to the store.

 

[seanmo]

soaa, totally agree on the treble performance...I sold mine. I'm not saying they stink, since a lot of people seem to really like them. The build quality is great and the bass is very good...I just didn't care for the sound sig at all...the treble just drove me crazy  I much prefer my phonak pfe 012 for a gym/walking/active iem...much more balanced sound (to my ears) and more comfortable