[swarthy]

I think the DT1350 does certain things better- it sounded snappier, faster to me.  But as an overall package including more than just speed, the M50 is truer to the source.  Of course, I've only heard one pair of DT1350's. 

I don't agree with this at all. AT ALL. I don't think you are objectively reviewing these headphones at all. And I mean that.

For one thing these take a decent amp to power. We all know that. And another, what is with all this M50 love. Entirely too much rose tint for me. Maybe if you can't afford anything better I guess but you obviously can.

Truer to the source my ass. Put on some DVD audio symphonies and we will see who is truer to the source. The M50 is not the winner. My opinion obviously but if these could get a tighter seal they are pretty much among the top 3 phones I have heard for 300. Bass is deeper and louder when you press them in but I think the soundstage gets a bit worse.

Will have some detailed impressions after about 50 hours break in.

 

[swarthy]

Even if bad batches happen, why are they getting released? Yes, there are tolerances in manufacturing drivers, but if they perform outside of those tolerances they need to be binned. Beyond that it's simply a matter of closely matching drivers. Beyerdynamic has the equipment necessary to graph a driver and put two together that are similar. They shouldn't just be going off the press into a headphone without testing.

I agree with this totally.

 

[Il Mostro]

Quote:

I don't agree with this at all. AT ALL. I don't think you are objectively reviewing these headphones at all. And I mean that.
For one thing these take a decent amp to power. And another, what is with all this M50 love. Entirely too much rose tint for me. Maybe if you can't afford anything better I guess.
Truer to the source my ass. Put on some DVD audio symphonies and we will see who is truer to the source. The M50 is not the winner. My opinion obviously but if these could get a tighter seal they are pretty much among the top 3 phones I have heard for 300. I really wish they were tighter from the start. Might have to get the headband out or bend them slightly. Bass is deeper and louder when you press them in but I think the soundstage gets a bit worse.
Will have some detailed impressions after about 50 hours break in.

I concur.  I own both and the statement regarding M-50's being "truer to the source" is nothing short of ludicrous.   This claim is either a case of tin-ears or just plain ignorance.
 

 

[swarthy]

I was just going over Tyll's break in articles and I think these highly damped ones are going to be primed for break in. I bet my money these will become smoother after a good 50 hours or so but that is a guess. My ears will do most of the work. I am liking these a lot and I think that I will look for a strong and tight rubber band to get these to mold tighter at a closer level. I think it is because of the box mold somewhat that they can be a little loose so to say. Anyway, they really do sound great. No regrets here but I am going to pay attention to the driver matching. That would be awful if mine were bad but I cannot hear any devastating volume differences at the moment. Looks good so far.

These are now sounding really tight with media player classic and ffdshow equalizer. Really good stuff. I rolled the highs a bit because I am like that and did a few basic ups and downs across the board. I put the bass to the test and left it lower than the rest because I really drive these at times and the bass needs to keep up. Beck's Midnite Vultures has some fantastic bassy parts. A couple of my test cd's I used for distortion and I am pretty much golden for now. The seal has actually improved a bit or I am getting used to it. When I push them in there is more bass but it is also slightly worse soundstage and I am growing to like how they are. All in all they were spendy for little cups but I think they were well worth it.

Will try some classical and jazz more in depth after break in. I wouldn't even want to hear these without an amp, either. They are matched pretty well with my Denon so I am relieved about that.

No idea where the fit issues really come from lol. These things fit absolutely perfectly.

I have definitely needed EQ tweaking the louder I pump these but that is normal for me. The higher end on these things can be a bit crushing to me at extreme levels so I have rolled most of it off 2dB or a little more. The funny thing is I have a tiny midbass hump in my EQ and I love the sound of it mostly. Still more tweaking to do and I don't want to go deaf at those volumes so....

From the graph it looked like these were rolled off from factory but I must be highly sensitive to these regions as I find myself lowering them on every pair of phones I try. CD Audio is not the best source though. I want to try some high def files of SP's Siamese Dream to see how it compares. I have also done some extensive AB'ing with the channels with one off and the other on and cannot spot much of a difference. They appear closely matched as far as I can tell when dinking around with my eyes closed.

These are far from perfect but for my needs and 300 and under I really couldn't do much better. Wish they were a bit cheaper but what can you do. Better than my IEM's flying around and breaking all the time lol.

 

[politechnica]

Dear friends,
 
i have a question regarding the hinge mechanism on the dt1350.
 
One reason (though not the top one) to buy this headphones was their ability to rotate the arm holding the cans in a 90 degrees forward an backwards. The DJ single ear monitoring position, i guess.
 
You can see this on the second image on this review page: DT 1350 Review InnerFidelity
 
Also it's shown in this youtube review video at about 4:25 into the video: HeadFi Review
 
I bought 2 pairs (one as a gift to a friend) and first thing i tried was to see how they work (headband hinge etc.). There was a little resistance from the hinge when i tried to rotate the arm holding the cups, so i applied a little bit of pressure (really really low pressure) and guess what? The hinge broke. Luckily the dealer said BeyerDynamics will replace/repair the demaged one...
 
Now to the actual question: Am I missing something here? Is it possible to turn the arm that way or is it a non official modification of some sorts i will have to do?
 
Regards...

 

[Anathallo]

My hinge requires a significant force to turn 90 degrees, but it does so freely.  I don't have the cans with me at the moment, but if I'm not mistaken it's only the right channel that rotates.
 
 
 
Also, swarthy, do you work for Beyer?  I'm a Beyer fanboy and still I wouldn't defend Beyer's QC to date as passionately as you have haha.  You seem to be taking offense to Purrin's well-stated, never emotional posts.

 

[swarthy]

No, not at all. I appreciate very much his graphs and making the point that people should watch their pair. I still am. Thanks for that. But I know enough, and so does he from his LCD posts and beyond, that these things affect all manufacturers. I don't doubt many of these guys are cutting costs in places. But do I think Beyer is really a bad company? No, I really don't. There new stuff is the best stuff they have put out. The T1's are fantastic and they redid the T50s and we got that here. Good stuff for the price imo despite being a bit high.

They have some new tech going on and whenever that happens there are usually issues that was all that I was saying. It doesn't excuse anything. If there are problems these have a very nice 2 year warranty and I hear Beyer is actually okay with CS. I haven't heard of any serious issues with these besides the driver thing which is at least good to know. I have had plenty of other problems with IEM and other cans before.

Who knows what they tell their guys. I sure as hell would hope people are not getting 3dB or more of unmatched drivers en mass. That is insane. But I am definitely still checking on and off each channel on different types of music. So far I don't think I can tell which means it is probably closer to his second good one.

 

[mrAdrian]

I don't understand. Why do M50 lovers or Sennheiser lovers must come into this thread... Start a new thread and link it here is more than welcomed, as Beyer as well as us need to be aware of all these problems.
 
But lol. Like a MC fan running into a group of MU fans telling them they suck. Is this like a thread takeover or something?
 
I respect the graphs and the effort purrin you put into the measurements, from my heart. But M50... or those 'Sennheiser spare parts' comments... Maybe I don't get your humour, but it was a bit over. Thought we were all (mostly, and I mean no offence to our younger headfi'ers) mature grown ups.
 
Edit: I didn't have any hard feelings at all while reading your comments, as this is the internet. But it did give me a bit of shock when comments like this were actually said 

 <--- That was my face when I read it

 

[politechnica]

Quote:

My hinge requires a significant force to turn 90 degrees, but it does so freely.  I don't have the cans with me at the moment, but if I'm not mistaken it's only the right channel that rotates.

 
Thank you for your quick reply. As of now i have 3 different versions.
 
1. BeyerDynamics doesn't state anything on their DT 1350 page, that would indicate the arms rotating the way i want them to. Neither as images nor as a textual description.
2. Dealer was quite sure it would rotate on one side of the headphone. Tryed to show me but it didn't work.
3. Images and Videos (on the interwebs) indicate it's possible to rotate on both sides.
 
I'll give it one or more days and wait for a possible reply to clarify this issue. Last resort would be to call the source (BeyerDynamics) and hear what they're saying.
 
Cheers,

 

[dragoonv]

mine rotates both side
 
Quote:

My hinge requires a significant force to turn 90 degrees, but it does so freely.  I don't have the cans with me at the moment, but if I'm not mistaken it's only the right channel that rotates.
 
 
 
Also, swarthy, do you work for Beyer?  I'm a Beyer fanboy and still I wouldn't defend Beyer's QC to date as passionately as you have haha.  You seem to be taking offense to Purrin's well-stated, never emotional posts.

 

 

[Lillee]

Quote:

Also it's shown in this youtube review video at about 4:25 into the video: HeadFi Review

Mine do this as freely as in the video.
 
I got my set 2 days ago and after some bending and additional pads, I am quite satisfied with them. They aren't as good as my Shure SE535Ltd IEMs in nearly all aspects but for what they are (closed & supra aural) and being what I consider on the low end (Under $500) headphone they are pretty good.

 

[swarthy]

I too love IEMs but for the life of me I cannot seem to keep them without a break within a year and that is from about 4 different pairs. It just became too costly. I think maybe I am pushing them for volume when they can go no farther. Would like to hear the reds never have. I hear very mixed things about them in various genres.

Really, I want a pair of the JH's but I am too scared I will drop them or something when drinking or having a good time. IEMs always seem to be lying around with me lol. It is all about cost. These are 300 and if you find them for 250 and break them in and get a good set they are better than any IEM imo in their range and a bit beyond.

After massive EQ I really liked the triple fi for a cheapo but the thing broke within a month or two of amping. Not my thing and it had an AWFUL V shaped signature making it useless to me without EQ.

IEMs tend to have too weak a bass or weird highs for me unless you go high end.

My DT's also spin both ways.

 

[swarthy]

I am finding that poorly recorded material can sound really bad on these at times. And the treble on these definitely needs to tuning for it to sound fun. I hope they clear up a bit after a long break in. You can tell these are heavily damped imo.

EQ's are a serious necessity imo for anybody involved with audio. I still don't understand people who think SQ is degraded with an EQ. I mean sure a little at worst, but you know what, your SQ is heavily degraded when your headphones don't sound exactly like you want them to. I am getting too strong treble with these still but they are young.

I am definitely not a fan of past Beyer's really but their new lineup is definitely a big step up. Also, not sure about the comments saying these are designed less favorably then others. What a load of it. These things are incredibly well made and solid and come with 2 year warranty that some headphones 3x as much do not have. I have absolutely no fit issues whatsoever besides I wish they were tighter to start off with. I really wish I knew the people who had the too tight fit with these. Either Beyer changed them or you guys are nuts because these are def a bit too loose at the start for me.

HD25s are just not very accurate phones imo and the cheapness and wide availability are the only thing that make them viable in any conversation. I like them but find them too lacking. I keep getting the impression though that many on these boards do not amp their headphones properly. If you are using an ipod, for like the fifth time, these are not going to be even close to what they are amped with a proper setup. Again, I keep running across comments that say these don't improve much amped and all I can say is you have no idea what you are talking about and I suggest getting some better equipment.

I have tested this extensively. So I really try to stay out of the versus conversations unless I know if the reviewer is using decent equipment otherwise I simply don't trust their opinion. These of course are not perfect by any means but they are great phones no doubt about it. Even without an EQ I find them very very agreeable unless I am pumping concert level volume.

Too many things are subjective in audio. But what is not subjective is EQ and Amping. EQs do wonders for every headphone out there. Just make sure your whole system is clean and pure and there should be minimal degradation at worst none at best. The bass and the whole seal thing have pretty much cleared up but I think I may try to bend the metal. I sure as hell hope Beyer did not make these looser because people reported headaches as that was really a boneheaded move if so. Stretching headphones like this is much easier than getting them tighter.

 

[rhythmdevils]

Quote:

I don't agree with this at all. AT ALL. I don't think you are objectively reviewing these headphones at all. And I mean that.
For one thing these take a decent amp to power. And another, what is with all this M50 love. Entirely too much rose tint for me. Maybe if you can't afford anything better I guess.
Truer to the source my ass. Put on some DVD audio symphonies and we will see who is truer to the source. The M50 is not the winner. My opinion obviously but if these could get a tighter seal they are pretty much among the top 3 phones I have heard for 300. I really wish they were tighter from the start. Might have to get the headband out or bend them slightly. Bass is deeper and louder when you press them in but I think the soundstage gets a bit worse.
Will have some detailed impressions after about 50 hours break in.

Quote:

I concur.  I own both and the statement regarding M-50's being "truer to the source" is nothing short of ludicrous.   This claim is either a case of tin-ears or just plain ignorance.
 

Tin ears or ignorance eh?  It's funny (and sad) how offended people get when someone dislikes their precious headphones.  The Beyer is the one that sounds tinny anyways. 

 
Let me put it this way.  The M50 sounds more like my Mackie reference monitors (speakers) than the DT1350 (that I heard).  The DT1350 is still decent though imo, I liked them better than most closed phones.  So my impression compared to others, was fairly positive.  I was surprised by their smooth  upper mids combined with pretty good speed and a pretty even frequency response with nothing jabbing or piercing.  That's more than most headphones can say.  But I thought they lacked bass, had serious fit issues, sightly tinny treble, and a weird tonality about them.  These were deal breakers, and so in the end I think the M50 is the better headphone overall and I'd rather listen to them.  While they don't sound as fast, they are more well rounded with less botherome issues.  I still don't really want to listen to them though...
 
The QC issues are another matter...
 
If that gets your panties in a wad because you don't trust what you hear and you need your purchases validated by glowing reviews, maybe you should start an appreciation thread and then you can jerk each other off while wearing your tin can Beyers. 
 
Quote:

I don't understand. Why do M50 lovers or Sennheiser lovers must come into this thread... Start a new thread and link it here is more than welcomed, as Beyer as well as us need to be aware of all these problems.
 
But lol. Like a MC fan running into a group of MU fans telling them they suck. Is this like a thread takeover or something?
 

 
I'm not a "lover" of any headphone company.  And this is a discussion thread about the DT1350.  Why do you think anything negative is supposed to be posted somewhere else?  And why do you think we're all supposed to band together in little groups of fanboys deluding each other about some silly notion of perfection?  I'm not interested in that.  If that's what you want, then see above about the appreciation thread. 
 
I didn't tell anyone "they suck".  I'm the only one getting attacked personally here.  Which is fine if that's what floats your boat I could care less.  I'm talking about the DT1350.  The fact that this line is blurred here so heavily is a bit sad...

 

[swarthy]

So we can jerk each other off???

Uhh, okay man, I'll trust whatever you say from now on. The whole thing is part of the problem in reviewing headphones objectively. People simply hear a phone for 10 minutes and think they know everything about it. Other people like myself spend hours tweaking an EQ and setting up the right amp with the right material and then 50 or more hours breaking them in. From what I heard when I heard a pair of these used for about 20 hours was that I thought I could get them to sound like I wanted and they were the best choice for 300. Bass is enormous when you seal them. I have no idea what people want out of headphones but you are not going to get an IDMAX 12 in your head.

Thanks for putting (speakers) in there we had no idea what you meant.

These phones are heavily damped and no doubt in my mind require some break in. I too notice the higher and slightly piercing treble. I would not call it tinny just harsh more or less like sitting next to a real drum kit. Have you done that before because drum kits don't sound kuddly nice 5 feet away bub.

Again, I don't agree with you at all. When amped these things can tear your ears out if you are listening to treble high music like Siamese Dream or something of the sort. Piercing is exactly the word I would use but I am pretty sensitive to these frequencies more so than most. Still EQ'ing and breaking them in but I don't think the m50s are even close to what someone would call a reference monitor. That right there is just not even right. A 100 dollar headphone close to a reference monitor. Even I would never go so far as to say something so feeble.

I don't hear any weird tonality to these. Not sure what you heard but it was probably a bad pair. Mine seem perfectly matched. Fit issues are non existent as well and I just wish they were tighter which can be done manually if need be just make sure you bend the metal very slightly. In fact I just did that finally and the bass is now better. I am going to take it slowly though as I don't want to mess my soundstage up.

So again, we could without your childish forum crap I can agree with you in SOME respects and I just feel your opinion is way off base with these. The HD25 and M50 are talked way above what they really are imo.

And please with your blatant hatred of Beyer. You probably listened to a crappy pair like Purrin's first ones for ten minutes and then made all your slightly crass comments while you couldn't wait to get back to your cheapy m50s. Am I right? And what kind of music do you listen to and what amps did you use when listening to these phones. I am far from some Beyer defender lol I have never owned a set in my life.

Also, I stick by my EQ. Unless you EQ good luck finding your perfect headphones for the sub 500 dollar range.