[Twinster]

Wow amazing review Eddie. The best informative review I have read for a long time.
thank you.
 
Regarding the comfort I have mine for quite a while now and used them every day at work and the pads seems to shape to my ears now and do not ave discomfort from over 90 minutes session.
 
 
 
Quote:

[size=10pt][size=10pt]I bought the DT1350 off a fellow head-fier on the classifieds and have had them now for 24 hours or so listening with the Sansa Clip + and no external amp, so these are first impressions and not necessarily with them working at their maximum potential (although I do tend to find most talk of efficient headphones “needing” an amp to be overhyped), and a lot of this is probably identical to other impressions already posted, but in case anyone is interested, here are my first impressions which I might update later.[/size][/size]
[size=10pt] [/size]
[size=10pt][size=10pt]Preface[/size][/size]
[size=10pt] [/size]
[size=10pt][size=10pt]When it comes to listening at home, I’m pretty much satisfied. Yes I intend to upgrade amp and DAC at some point and still hanker after an LCD-2 at some point, but the Stax SR-303, on any gear, sounds amazing to my ears. I’ve honestly felt no serious upgraditus at all since getting those. On the road though, I’ve had considerably less luck. I started with IEMs and I still have them, but can only wear them for short periods of time before my inner ears start to get sore. I got the M50s which I really like but got bored of, borrowed the HD25-1-II for a spell but didn’t fall for them even though I liked them, tried the Ultrasone HFI-780 and didn’t hate them but was underwhelmed by them in general, the AiAiAi TMA-1 were completely inappropriate for 90% of my music, gave the Creative Aurvana Live a go but they were too small for my ears and have auditioned dozens of contenders at meets without really falling for anything in a serious way. There is a sense I am being way too fussy, that I am comparing portable headphones to home headphones and marking them down which is not really fair, and I recognise I maybe need to lower my standards, but the search for a great portable headphone has become a major mission for me.[/size][/size]
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[size=10pt][size=10pt]Build[/size][/size]
[size=10pt] [/size]
[size=10pt][size=10pt]These are not only exceptionally beautiful but also very sturdily built headphones. From the aluminium headband assembly and forks to the (magnesium??) back plates of the cups and even the thick and smooth-to-the-touch plastic of the cups themselves it has all the hallmarks of a quality “made in Germany” product. The ear pads can swivel 90degrees to comfortably sit on the head one-eared (a useful feature for DJing and broadcast use not so much for me) and the twin headbands can split which some people find useful getting the right secure fit. The cups rotate to allow them to sit flat in their carry case or around your neck and on the whole they are a well aesthetically designed product. [/size][/size]
[size=10pt] [/size]
[size=10pt][size=10pt]The cable itself is practical for portable use in length, thinness and flexibility but it’s over sized straight plug is not. Since the cable is also a bit microphonic so a re-cable might be in order if I decide these are keepers. Good isolation and microphonics in the cable tend to go hand in hand and these certainly have admirable isolation, when the music is playing the isolation is pretty near to perfect and I would say they do as good a job as some noise cancelling headphones I’ve heard with none of the drawbacks.[/size][/size]
[size=10pt] [/size]
[size=10pt][size=10pt]Aesthetically on the head as opposed to on the table, they still look good but a bit silly as well, having a slightly “Frankenstein’s monster” look to them. The cups are not much deeper than the HD-25-1-II but as the headband is so close to the sides of your head on the DT1350 it’s accentuated. The proximity of all those metal sliding parts to the hair is also the source of my biggest problem with these headphones to date: their tendency to take a few of my hairs with them when coming off my head. To be fair I was warned by countless impressions that this was a risk with long curly haired people like me and took that risk, but it is a shame and whether or not I keep these in the long term might come down to whether I can figures out a method for removing them that avoids this.[/size][/size]
[size=10pt] [/size]
[size=10pt][size=10pt]As far as fit itself goes, I haven’t had any of the issues which have been reported. I don’t need to split the headband to any kind of extreme degree or even at all to have it sit securely or to find a seal (I do split it a bit though), and finding that seal and correct position which so many have reported as difficult has been no challenge at all. Perhaps I am being complacent and I just happen to have the right shaped head and ears for these phones, but the first time I put them on they sealed perfectly and there was no difference between the sound quality when I pressed against the cups with my hands or didn’t. The precise fit position, for me, is the only logical position and exactly how I’ve always put supra-aural headphones on – with the opening in the pad directly facing the opening to my ear. It seems logical to me and it’s also the most comfortable placement as well.[/size][/size]
[size=10pt] [/size]
[size=10pt][size=10pt]Comfort has not been an issue for me. No supra-aural phone is comfy for long listening sessions unless you have ears of steel, but these aren’t at all bad for short-mid term sessions. The first half an hour I put on them left my ears a little sore, but tightening the headband another click on each side so they were more solidly held in one place and I’ve worn them for an hour and a half session without any discomfort at all. As my intended use for these is the hourly commute each day, that’s more than fine for me.[/size][/size]
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[size=10pt][size=10pt]Sound[/size][/size]
[size=10pt] [/size]
[size=10pt][size=10pt]The sound on the whole is extremely enjoyable although not without flaws. As my preface said, I really need to accept that closed portable headphones are just never going to sound as good as open home listening phones. For a set of headphones this size and of this price, it really punches above its weight and does some things few dynamic cans have managed before, at least any I have tried. I’ll break it down in the usual way.[/size][/size]
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[size=10pt][size=10pt]Bass[/size][/size]
[size=10pt][size=10pt]These little cans have among the best bass response I have yet encountered. You have to get into LCD-2 territory and expense to best them. There are three main things about the 1350 bass that makes it so special 1. Depth. The bass remains even extremely deep and this underlying foundation of solid, warm sub-bass supports the entire frequency range adding a sense of realism to the presentation. 2. Control. The bass is so effortlessly controlled, even at the very low frequencies that it is possible to hear the kind of subtle contours and textures in the lower levels I normally only expect to find in electrostatic headphones, add to this the fact that it has impact most electrostatic headphones can only dream of and you have something very special on your hands. 3. Quantity. I am a person who takes extreme issue with over-done exaggerated bass and it’s very important to me that the bass never cloud the rest of the frequency response, and the DT1350 ticks this box as well with full, powerful bass in quality that never oversteps its natural boundaries in quantity. Incredible.[/size][/size]
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[size=10pt][size=10pt]Mids[/size][/size]
[size=10pt][size=10pt]For me the mids are even and well controlled and merge naturally with the bass, there is a very naturalistic smoothness and richness to them but they are also very clear. It’s kind of similar to the bass in that you just don’t expect small portable headphones to be able to present such a big authoritative and rich sound. They are response and solid and have an almost planar magnetic sort of weight behind them. The presentation is only marred by them dipping a bit soon at the mid-treble level. This is certainly a matter of taste thing and a week from now I may have completely adapted to them but for my pre-existing preferences I would like that flat line to hold out a bit longer and give that boost of energy at the top end of the mids. It’s a trade off though. You lose a bit of electricity and energy and gain a seductive velvety smoothness in return. [/size][/size]
[size=10pt] [/size]
[size=10pt][size=10pt]Treble[/size][/size]
[size=10pt][size=10pt]This is where my sonic bug-bears raise their heads. From my reference Stax SR-303 I really love a prominent, well extended treble presentation, at the same time I really did fall in love with the laid back, attenuated treble of the LCD-2 as well and have enjoyed the HD650 in the past so am pretty open minded in that sense – so long as the treble is clear, smooth and of a great quality it can be shelved up and shelved down and still sound good to me… When it comes to shelving down the DT1350 can sound really good at times but on certain tracks at certain points it can seem to go a bit far and the treble can sometimes just sort of disappear a bit into a rich soup of bass and mids. But at the same time a region of the upper treble is always loud, clear and strangely at odds with the rest of the presentation which can make a slightly jarring listening experience at times. The bass and mids can be characterised as rich, velvety, naturalistic or even “moist” while parts of the treble are decidedly “dry” and flat with little to no shimmer or sparkle. If you’ve heard the phenomena some call “one note bass” I would characterise this as “one note treble” another very good term I found for this in the Inner Fidelity review was “papery”. It’s a good metaphor for the sound. [/size][/size]

[size=10pt][size=10pt]Reading this back, it sounds like a major criticism, but it really is a minor issue in practice I’m just being as descriptive as I can about it. After ten or fifteen minutes of listening it kind of “naturalises” and my mind starts to adapt to it. I think I need to accept that a £240 headphone is simply never going to perform like one worth many much more than that amount, and is going to have its flaws.[/size][/size]
[size=10pt] [/size]
[size=10pt][size=10pt]I’ve actually experienced this exact effect in the treble of headphones before – it happens when you put too much micropore on the back of the drivers of orthodynamic headphones. This leads me to take a guess that the very reason this headphone is so much more controlled through most of the frequency range is the same reason it falls down a bit when it comes to treble – damping. Perhaps they have damped the phone so much that they have killed off some of the natural, positive reberberations which make treble sweet and smooth and left it a little hollow. It would make sense if these did have to be over-damped to sound this way – the Tesla driver principle has a hole behind the point in the diaphragm the most back-firing sound would be coming from which is a reason it sounds so clear in an open headphone but that’s a lot more back-firing sound going without obstruction into the cups to have to deal with in a closed headphone as well. If I decide to keep these I’ll have to open them up and see what’s going on with the backs of the drivers (have seen the damping material on the back of the cup already, but are there any pictures of the driver back itself?).[/size][/size]
[size=10pt] [/size]
[size=10pt][size=10pt]Soundstage and Separation[/size][/size]
[size=10pt][size=10pt]Soundstage is what you expect from a closed supra-aural headphone – small and boxy – but separation is good and therefore the presentation avoids being cluttered even if it is a little constrained. Bring on a beyer circum-aural portable that is tuned for the same flavour of sound and watch the money fly out of my wallet! Oh and beyer? Portable circum-aural headphones need to fold, at least flat if not properly folding up. T5P? T70P? Not really portable if you can’t fold them.[/size][/size]
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[size=10pt][size=10pt]Conclusion[/size][/size]
[size=10pt] [/size]
[size=10pt][size=10pt]I won’t say I am 100% certain I will keep these, the hair pulling alone might be enough for me to get impatient with them, but I am astonished by their quality and enjoy them every time they are on my ears. Little quirks with the treble do occasionally draw my attention but on the whole I do find myself wondering if I’ll ever find better than this for a portable set of cans.[/size][/size]
[size=10pt] [/size]
[size=10pt][size=10pt]Pros:[/size][/size]

1. [size=10pt][size=10pt]Extremely enjoyable listening experience;[/size][/size]
2. [size=10pt][size=10pt]Amazing performance for a headphone of this price, I only criticise it in comparison to much more expensive headphones;[/size][/size]
3. [size=10pt][size=10pt]Deep, extremely well controlled bass with no unnatural over-emphasis;[/size][/size]
4. [size=10pt][size=10pt]Rich, warm and extremely clear mid range;[/size][/size]
5. [size=10pt][size=10pt]Great clarity and separation;[/size][/size]
6. [size=10pt][size=10pt]Very smooth presentation (below upper treble) with no sibilance at all;[/size][/size]
7. [size=10pt][size=10pt]Generally a classy and sturdy design and build with quality durable materials, well packaged with the carry case and adapter and all.[/size][/size]

[size=10pt] [/size]
[size=10pt][size=10pt]Cons:[/size][/size]

1. [size=10pt][size=10pt]Boxy supra-sural soundstage;[/size][/size]
2. [size=10pt][size=10pt]Missing a little energy from mid-treble region;[/size][/size]
3. [size=10pt][size=10pt]Missing information from treble region;[/size][/size]
4. [size=10pt][size=10pt]“One note” dry upper treble with little reverberation or shimmer;[/size][/size]
5. [size=10pt][size=10pt]Pulls out hair (if long haired) when taking off;[/size][/size]
6. [size=10pt][size=10pt]Oversized plug;[/size][/size]
7. [size=10pt][size=10pt]Slightly microphonic cable.[/size][/size]

 
 

 

[rasmushorn]

Quote:

Wow amazing review Eddie. The best informative review I have read for a long time.
thank you.
 

x2!
 
I agree with everything except I would like DT-1350 to have less bass impact than they have - if I could change something about the DT-1350.
 

 

[sperandeo]

I'm not happy with Beyerdynamic's customer service. 
 
Today I received my 3rd pair of 1350's.  My first pair had a rattle in the left channel. My second pair lost 80% of volume only from the left channel. 
 
Thanks god these have a 2 year warranty. 
 
I wrote to Beyerdynamic's to let them know that I had 2 pair fail me. This was over 2 weeks ago and I have yet to receive a reply from them. 
 
Long & McQuade is the store I purchased them from and they have been wonderful regarding the warranty. 
 
I have written many times about how much I love the 1350's, but I get a little worried when something fails twice and the manufacturer doesn't have the time to reply to a customers concerns. 
 

 

[MayaTlab]

Quote:

I'm not happy with Beyerdynamic's customer service. 
 
Today I received my 3rd pair of 1350's.  My first pair had a rattle in the left channel. My second pair lost 80% of volume only from the left channel. 
 
Thanks god these have a 2 year warranty. 
 
I wrote to Beyerdynamic's to let them know that I had 2 pair fail me. This was over 2 weeks ago and I have yet to receive a reply from them. 
 
Long & McQuade is the store I purchased them from and they have been wonderful regarding the warranty. 
 
I have written many times about how much I love the 1350's, but I get a little worried when something fails twice and the manufacturer doesn't have the time to reply to a customers concerns. 
 

I've had a similar rattle problem with my first T50p pair.
 
And given all the tiny inconsequential build quality flaws I've seen on the five Beyers I've come across (two T50ps, three DT 1350), and Tyll Hertsen's measurements (which show quite wild variations across all their models and random polarity reversals), I'm quite concerned about control quality with Beyer products. This isn't something I see from Sennheiser products in general as a contrasting example. 
 
It's too bad, I feel their drivers really are something special (and I own a DT 1350, which I do appreciate despite its flaws).
 
On the other hand, they've always responded my mails in a very timely manner.
 

 

[roma101]

Hey has anyone tried these with a TTVJ Slim yet? Wonder if the timbre quality gets better when amped by a TTVJ. 

 

[DigitalFreak]

Quote:

Hey has anyone tried these with a TTVJ Slim yet? Wonder if the timbre quality gets better when amped by a TTVJ. 

If you're going to invest in an amp you don't need to go 100's of dollars for the DT1350. A cMoy with bass boost or UHA-4 or a ZO2 would be more then enough for what you want. There are better price options out there then the TTVJ Slim. A little warning about the ZO2. If you decide to go the ZO route wait a little while before buying it. The first batch is plagued by hiss and to much loudness when using a LOD. Digizoid has found a fix for it so wait until the second batch comes out before you grab one.

 

[MayaTlab]

Quote:

Hey has anyone tried these with a TTVJ Slim yet? Wonder if the timbre quality gets better when amped by a TTVJ. 

No matter what, I found the DT 1350 timber to be problematic.
I own both though, and the TTVJ certainly is a substantial improvement as far as timber goes. But the TTVJ already is excellent timber-wise.
 

 

[aamefford]

Quote:

Hey has anyone tried these with a TTVJ Slim yet? Wonder if the timbre quality gets better when amped by a TTVJ. 

I found it an excellent pairing.  Currently using a Pico Slim because it works so well with my iems.  The TTVJ was excellent with the DT1350 for sure.
 
An amp isn't going to fix a headphone for you though.  If you have timbre issues with the DT1350, the TTVJ will not fix them.  I like the DT1350, and I like it better amped, but the amp doesn't change the characteristic sound or voice of the headphone, at least in my opinion.
 

 

[roma101]

Quote:

If you're going to invest in an amp you don't need to go 100's of dollars for the DT1350. A cMoy with bass boost or UHA-4 or a ZO2 would be more then enough for what you want. There are better price options out there then the TTVJ Slim. A little warning about the ZO2. If you decide to go the ZO route wait a little while before buying it. The first batch is plagued by hiss and to much loudness when using a LOD. Digizoid has found a fix for it so wait until the second batch comes out before you grab one.

Thanks for the response my friend, but I actually already have the TTVJ Slim so that's why I was wondering if the pairing might maybe fix some timbre issues of the DT1350. Appreciate the info though
 


Quote:

No matter what, I found the DT 1350 timber to be problematic.
I own both though, and the TTVJ certainly is a substantial improvement as far as timber goes. But the TTVJ already is excellent timber-wise.
 

Yeah that's why I love the TTVJ. I just got it and it has blown me away with how analog it sounds. It improved the timbre, imaging and widened the soundstage a bit on my HD-25s. I'm glad to hear that it is a good improvement - maybe when I have the cash I'll take a walk on the wild side and get a DT1350 already.  
 


Quote:

I found it an excellent pairing.  Currently using a Pico Slim because it works so well with my iems.  The TTVJ was excellent with the DT1350 for sure.
 
An amp isn't going to fix a headphone for you though.  If you have timbre issues with the DT1350, the TTVJ will not fix them.  I like the DT1350, and I like it better amped, but the amp doesn't change the characteristic sound or voice of the headphone, at least in my opinion.
 

 
Well, I hope it can improve the timbre at least a little bit, since I've read that the DT1350 is very transparent to source and the sound gets a bit altered depending on whatever source you're using. That's what I read here at one point anyway. Do you feel like that soundstage and imaging improve on the DT1350 when paired with a TTVJ?
 
 

 

[MayaTlab]

Actually the main reason why the DT 1350 isn't good with timber is because of the white plastic cover at the back of the driver. I've tried to remove it and timber accuracy increased - but at so much cost (wooly sound, lack of bass extension, bad damping, cup resonance) that it isn't a practical solution. On the other hand I'm sure a better cup design would have allowed for exploiting the driver to a higher potential. So no amp is going to definitely fix that, but I think the TTVJ Slim did a good job at making it tolerable.

 

[EddieE]

I'm not sure I understand what you guys mean when you refer to timbre like that. I thought timbre was just a word to describe the sound of a thing, so in reference to headphones it would just mean sound signature as a whole?
 
P.S. Thanks for the kind words on the review Twinster and Rasmashorn.

 

[MayaTlab]

Quote:

I'm not sure I understand what you guys mean when you refer to timbre like that. I thought timbre was just a word to describe the sound of a thing, so in reference to headphones it would just mean sound signature as a whole?
 
P.S. Thanks for the kind words on the review Twinster and Rasmashorn.

You're right, maybe should we say instead "timber accuracy". Basically, does this pair of headphones reproduce the timber of a piano, a violin, etc. well or not ?
I agree it's rather impossible thing to reliably assess as it requires some objective reference to be tested. Yet in general I find headphones to be rather poor at it, so in the same way that it's easier to distinguish a rubbish wine from a very good one than to distinguish a decent wine from a very good one, I think it's still fairly easy to agree that, for example, the Sony Z1000 is quite a bit better at reproducing timber in general than the DT 1350, or that Ultrasones in general aren't made for timber accuracy (and I'd dare to say accuracy in the first place), While the Sennheisers HD 600 and HD 650 seem to be rather good.
I don't know what matters in reproducing timbers accurately, I suppose it's a combination of damping, driver material, and probably many other elements.
 

 

[Twinster]

It's all a matter of personal preferences. To me the DT-1350 sound very good and they reproduce piano and cello very well IMO. But to someonelse ears it could be different. I have also read that the Z1000 were very balanced and good sounding headphone but almost double in price. 
 
And on the subject of wine, what is going on with the wine from France? I'm from Canada, Québec (salut cousin) and in the pass couple years the quality we are getting is not to the level we were use to from France. We have to almost pay double ($30) for something good while wine from South Africa & California can be bought for half the price for very good quality. ( Sorry for the rant )
Quote:

You're right, maybe should we say instead "timber accuracy". Basically, does this pair of headphones reproduce the timber of a piano, a violin, etc. well or not ?
I agree it's rather impossible thing to reliably assess as it requires some objective reference to be tested. Yet in general I find headphones to be rather poor at it, so in the same way that it's easier to distinguish a rubbish wine from a very good one than to distinguish a decent wine from a very good one, I think it's still fairly easy to agree that, for example, the Sony Z1000 is quite a bit better at reproducing timber in general than the DT 1350, or that Ultrasones in general aren't made for timber accuracy (and I'd dare to say accuracy in the first place), While the Sennheisers HD 600 and HD 650 seem to be rather good.
I don't know what matters in reproducing timbers accurately, I suppose it's a combination of damping, driver material, and probably many other elements.
 

 
 

 

[Twinster]

( sorry for the double post)
It's all a matter of personal preferences. To me the DT-1350 sound very good and they reproduce piano and cello very well IMO. But to someonelse ears it could be different. I have also read that the Z1000 were very balanced and good sounding headphone. 
 
And on the subject of wine, what is going on with the wine from France? I'm from Canada, Québec (salut cousin) and in the pass couple years the quality we are getting is not to the level we were use to from France. We have to almost pay double ($30) for something good while wine from South Africa & California can be bought for half the price for very good quality. ( Sorry for the rant )
Quote:

You're right, maybe should we say instead "timber accuracy". Basically, does this pair of headphones reproduce the timber of a piano, a violin, etc. well or not ?
I agree it's rather impossible thing to reliably assess as it requires some objective reference to be tested. Yet in general I find headphones to be rather poor at it, so in the same way that it's easier to distinguish a rubbish wine from a very good one than to distinguish a decent wine from a very good one, I think it's still fairly easy to agree that, for example, the Sony Z1000 is quite a bit better at reproducing timber in general than the DT 1350, or that Ultrasones in general aren't made for timber accuracy (and I'd dare to say accuracy in the first place), While the Sennheisers HD 600 and HD 650 seem to be rather good.
I don't know what matters in reproducing timbers accurately, I suppose it's a combination of damping, driver material, and probably many other elements.
 

 
 

 

[MayaTlab]

Quote:

 
And on the subject of wine, what is going on with the wine from France? I'm from Canada, Québec (salut cousin) and in the pass couple years the quality we are getting is not to the level we were use to from France. We have to almost pay double ($30) for something good while wine from South Africa & California can be bought for half the price for very good quality. ( Sorry for the rant )

Actually I used to live in Canada for two years and I agree with you that good French wine is bloody expensive there - to very unrealistic levels. I don't think the overall quality of French wine has decreased (but I think Californian and Australian wines I can buy now in France are getting better and better), so I suspect it's more a question of distribution (for some strange reasons, as I did not find myself in difficulties trying to buy decent French wine in NYC at an affordable price). Or maybe a simple matter of competitiveness - I don't think it's worth buying nice cheap French wine in Canada as it's something much better done IMHO buy Australian / Californian producers ?
 
Back to headphones - actually I think a glass of wine makes any headphones sound better than they deserve.