[Focker]

The low end on the Denons rolls off pretty significantly once you get down around 30hz, whereas the 1350s keep it flat way, way down past 10hz....so using the fruit example, if grapes represent sub bass, you'll have a nice balanced amount of them in the salad just like all the other fruits. But in the Denon salad, you'll only have one...maybe two

 

[mrAdrian]

Sorry to semi-disagree - given 20hz is like the most you can listen to, even if the denons roll of 'significantly' (I must stress, this is at most ONLY the case when compared to the dT1350) after 30hz, your not missing much.
 
So even if true, your missing one whole grape out of two from the whole salad bowl, limited by your ears and arguably the music. And then even if your music and ears have that capability, the amount of air you feel with a below 20Hz headphone is also very limited given the size of the drivers and the area of the coverage. Your heart will not feel the bass thump with headphones as compared to speakers unless you place the cups over your... chest

 

[Focker]

Quote:

Sorry to semi-disagree - given 20hz is like the most you can listen to, even if the denons roll of 'significantly' (I must stress, this is at most ONLY the case when compared to the dT1350) after 30hz, your not missing much.
 
So even if true, your missing one whole grape out of two from the whole salad bowl, limited by your ears and arguably the music. And then even if your music and ears have that capability, the amount of air you feel with a below 20Hz headphone is also very limited given the size of the drivers and the area of the coverage. Your heart will not feel the bass thump with headphones as compared to speakers unless you place the cups over your... chest

 
There's not really anything to agree or disagree with. The Denon's roll off at 30hz and the 1350s are flat to below 10hz. Not putting a value judgment on it, just making sure the fruit salad is as accurately prepared as possible

 

[dragoonv]

Quote:

 
There's not really anything to agree or disagree with. The Denon's roll off at 30hz and the 1350s are flat to below 10hz. Not putting a value judgment on it, just making sure the fruit salad is as accurately prepared as possible

 
Its not really that noticable to be honest. The frequencies below 10Hz can hardly be heard. Like what Adrian is saying, the driver is too small to give us the thump. That being said, I still love my DT1350.  

 

[Focker]

Quote:

 
Its not really that noticable to be honest. The frequencies below 10Hz can hardly be heard. Like what Adrian is saying, the driver is too small to give us the thump. That being said, I still love my DT1350.  

I agree. Wasn't trying to say it was a positive or negative about either headphone...mostly just wanted to use the fruit salad analogy haha
 
I had a great experirence with my 1350s last night...watched The Hunter on netflix streaming...usually I'd use my T1s for that, but they are out of commission for a bit, so the 1350s stepped in and did a great job. 

 

[Deviltooth]

While I love the bass in my 1350s I love it because it's accurate, textured and full of musical information.  I have yet to encounter any headphone that hits you with a visceral sense of bass.
 
It's just basic physics; if you want to feel the bass you need a full sized speaker system and a serious subwoofer.  Portable audio is great but it's strengths are different than what you can get from a room filling rig.

 

[autoexec]

Quote:

 
No problem at all with vocals...appreciate the heads up, though. I've been using mainly my iPhone output directly, my Fiio E11, or the Meier Jazz to drive the 1350s. I do find some very subtle differences among them, with the Jazz being able to just completely take over and make them sing. Also want to spend more time with my ZO2 amp driving these things...it seems like a nice pairing, as well. 
 
Haven't heard the E17 but a few audio friends have told me it's one of Fiio's best offerings. 

 
I don't even know if I'm driving them decently out of my E17 lol! But it sure is way better than my portables, (J3 / N2) Btw, heard the song I was talking about yet?

 

[dragoonv]

Quote:

I agree. Wasn't trying to say it was a positive or negative about either headphone...mostly just wanted to use the fruit salad analogy haha
 
I had a great experirence with my 1350s last night...watched The Hunter on netflix streaming...usually I'd use my T1s for that, but they are out of commission for a bit, so the 1350s stepped in and did a great job. 

Ya, lucky your dog didnt chew on the headphone

 

[Focker]

Quote:

Ya, lucky your dog didnt chew on the headphone

 
No doubt! That would have been much harder to forgive lol. 

 

[Focker]

Quote:

 
I don't even know if I'm driving them decently out of my E17 lol! But it sure is way better than my portables, (J3 / N2) Btw, heard the song I was talking about yet?

 
I seem to notice a SLIGHT improvement when I'm driving them with the Meier, but that's compared to just using my iPhone headphone out jack. I would guess the difference between the Fiio and the Meier would be so small that it would be unnoticeable since these phones are so easy to drive. 
 
I totally forgot about the song...going to do it tonight for sure! lol  At 1130p EST, the NASA channel is going to show the live landing of the mars rover that they launched back in November. Pretty amazing stuff! Here is a link in case you or anyone else is interested: http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2408054,00.asp

 

[roadcykler]

Quote:

What do you mean by a rush post?
Yhe denon and the beyer both jave very low reaching bass, I kid you not. If bass is the aspect that you rank the most important, the denon would be more suitable dare I say.
If a balanced frequency response is what you are after, the beyer is a better choice. On the other side, the denon is very enjoyable in a guilty way, the bass is certainly NOT of high fidelity, it is accentuated in a very tasteful way.
So think of a fruit salad, both has the freshest fruits toy could ever find, both very nicely blended. The denon is like as if the chef knew you liked apples the most and put in an extra serve. It is not as well blended anymore, but for an apple lover, he would love it because the sacrifices are well worth it in his opinion.

 
Thanks for that analogy. The "rush post" is you had post number 2112 in this thread and that is the most well known album by the band Rush. 

 

[OrbitingCow]

I am surprised people don't notice the difference. On a Denon amp or anything like that these things are pretty different in bass and overall tone from iphone. Like majorly different lol. One can't drive the deep notes worth anything plus the DAC's are vastly superior and easily noticeable in clarity of guitar and timbres from being amped properly. Not sure if it headroom or what but there is a huge difference to me.
 
I mean really now slight difference wit iphone out jack compared to a real amp? What I guess I don't know that amp you are using. Just because it easy to drive means nothing if DACs are crap. Plus easy to drive? These are still 80 ohm and not THAT easy to drive to full potential. Definitely not like Ety's which are very easily driven.
 

 

[mrAdrian]

Quote:

 
I seem to notice a SLIGHT improvement when I'm driving them with the Meier, but that's compared to just using my iPhone headphone out jack. I would guess the difference between the Fiio and the Meier would be so small that it would be unnoticeable since these phones are so easy to drive. 
 
I totally forgot about the song...going to do it tonight for sure! lol  At 1130p EST, the NASA channel is going to show the live landing of the mars rover that they launched back in November. Pretty amazing stuff! Here is a link in case you or anyone else is interested: http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2408054,00.asp

I have a Meier (FS!!) Arietta which should be the previous model of your Swing, and I do notice quite a bit difference when compared to driving them out from my iPod 3G - the one with buttons yes. In fact I am starting to only lug the DT1350s out if I am to bring my E17 with me, and I do see some differences
 
But I have applied replay gain on all of my songs so the iPod struggles to deliver enough volume. That might be the reason for my obvious improvements.
Quote:

 
Thanks for that analogy. The "rush post" is you had post number 2112 in this thread and that is the most well known album by the band Rush. 

Ohh gotta check them out!

 

[bmou]

just ordered mine. looking forward to receiving them and hopefully making them my go to headphone.

 

[Focker]

Quote:

I am surprised people don't notice the difference. On a Denon amp or anything like that these things are pretty different in bass and overall tone from iphone. Like majorly different lol. One can't drive the deep notes worth anything plus the DAC's are vastly superior and easily noticeable in clarity of guitar and timbres from being amped properly. Not sure if it headroom or what but there is a huge difference to me.
 
I mean really now slight difference wit iphone out jack compared to a real amp? What I guess I don't know that amp you are using. Just because it easy to drive means nothing if DACs are crap. Plus easy to drive? These are still 80 ohm and not THAT easy to drive to full potential. Definitely not like Ety's which are very easily driven.
 

I have yet to hear any properly matched SS amp make a "major difference" with any of my headphones. I hear more differences with tube gear, but with solid state gear the gains are minimal to my ears. My 1350s sound really good from just my iPhone, so my baseline in terms of sonics is already at a nice level. With the Meier Jazz there is an improvement that I clearly notice, and it sounds even better, but I can't classify it as "huge" by any means. Now if I put my 600ohm T1s on my Little Dot hybrid amp, which I've done, the sound improves significantly when I switch to my Jazz, but the Jazz is meant to power 600 ohm headphones whereas the LD really isn't. Also, the 1350s are 80ohms but they have a very high sensitivity rating, which contributes to something like an iPhone to be able to drive them to pretty loud levels.