[Theogenes]

Impressive. Thanks HC!

 

[CDWMcInSpots]

Quote:

I have heard better amps as well but for the convenience, it's not bad with the few I've tried. They do a very good job with the HE-500s. I've been running the monitor outs to my speaker rig and am considering a XLR/RCA converter for that purpose. The line out to my headphone rig is killer so I'd like to hear the imaging on my stats. I'm not as intent as I once was to just listen to headphones.
[...]

 
Quote:

Quote:

Regarding the headphone amplifier:

I like it as I've described earlier.

What amplifiers are you two comparing it to? Is this more a question of taste than quality? It wouldn't necessarily surprise me that it's not for everyone, especially those that listen at high loudness levels and are treble sensitive.

Well for me, the new GS-X II, Singlepower maxxed Extreme, Bryston HPA, Zana Deux, to name a few. All of which cost as much as or more than the DAC itself.

 
Thank you for your clarification and expansion.
 
There's a big difference between saying the Hilo headphone amplifier is so so or (just) a convenience vs. there are more expensive headphone amplifiers that are better (they should be to defend their price).
 
I regard your two posts combined as fair, but at least the first was insufficient and/or misleading. Mr.Sneis was worse though.
 
It would be interesting to get a grip on which headphone amplifiers the Hilo headphone amplifier is equal to reagarding (level of) sound quality. Maybe it's equal to SPL Auditor, Lehmannaudio Linear and similar products, maybe even more expensive products.

 

[grunter72]

Hi, finally yesterday I had the opportunity to make a comparison between my Lynx Hilo and Forsell Mdac-2 with integrated dlna/ethernet controller.
 
First of all excuse me for my English.
 
My friend Roberto and I have listened to theese two dac with his stereo system : Synology NAS DS212J -> ABC-PCB DLNA/Ethernet + Forssell MDAC-2 -> Marantz SC-11S1 preamplifier -> ATC SCM50ASL PRO active loudspeaker.
 
I also have to say that he has done a very good acoustic treatment of his room: many and different type of bass traps. So the first thing I've noticed yesterday it's that I'm not accustomed to hear "no sound reflections" and I must say that it's a wonderful sensation: everything is more clear.
I think that acoustic treatment is the more important hifi component and, at the same time, the most underrated.
Obviously not everyone could put bass trap everywhere (waf is an important aspect here

) but if it's possible to do I encourage everyone to try.
 
Regarding the listening of the Hilo we have used Hilo usb input with my Dell laptop (dual core, 8gb ram, Windows 8) and Jplay 5.1 (xtream engine, hibernate mode, kernel streaming).
My friend considered Audirvana for Mac OSX the best player around... till yesterday.
We have tried Audirvana with Hilo but Jplay is in another league: more instrument separation, more frequency extension, more clarity, deeper bass. Even Roberto (an ICT professor who uses mostly Linux and Mac Osx) had to admit that Jplay is superior to Audirvana.
 
So let's talk about the match: I start from the conclusion, for my taste Forsell mdac-2 is the best of the two dacs but not by much. I could say that they are about in the same league.
The aspect in which Forsell is clearly superior is in the bass section, Forsell has the deeper bass I've ever listened to.
I think Forsell bass goes so deep that reaches the center of the earth.
Note that Hilo has very good bass section: tight, deep, articulate.. and, as my friend told me yesterday, when you listen to Hilo's bass you could be very pleased.
Simply Forsell goes deeper than Hilo.
 
Apart from the bass section the main differences are, imho, in the sound signatures.
Theese differences are very subtle, so take what I'm going to write with a grain of salt.
I thought that people who are not accustomed to listen to hifi system probably couldn't hear them.
Globally Forsell is more warm than Hilo while Hilo is more neutral and airy.
I think Forsell has a little colouration in his sound but a very pleasant colouration: mids are little warmer and mids-highs are more aggressive then Hilo.
Hilo is more correct maybe, more precise, its highs are a little more extended and this aspect drives to a better instrument separation.
 
So I think (bass aside) that mainly it's a matter of tastes: Forsell a little more engaging and Hilo a little more precise and neutral.
 
After the match

we had listened to some dsd with Hilo and we thought that dsd sound very very good, from my experience dsd are more natural sound than pcm, more 3d.
These song in dsf format "Chris Jones - No Sanctuary Here" from Stockfish Recors is the most wonderful recording I've listen to: an "eargasm" experience

 
I had to say that I'm satisfied of my purchase.
I like Forsell a little more than Hilo but here in Italy Forsell costs more than Hilo, is less versatile (no dsd support) and doesn't come with an integrated good usb inout.

 

[Theogenes]

Thanks for sharing your impressions, Grunter! This might be the first time somebody has preferred another DAC to the Hilo around here . 
 
It would be interesting to see a comparison between the Hilo and something like the Resonessence Invicta, as it has also had a consensus of superlative reviews. Can't wait until I get a few more things sold, I'm eying the Hilo as my next major purchase...

 

[preproman]

I would say the headphone amp in the Hilo "IS NOT" on par with dedicated headphone amps.  Price being no object or regardless of price.  The Hilo is a DAC first - A good one at that.  However, the headphone amp is there for convenience IMO.  
 
The R&D dedicated headphone amp makers put into these headphone amps are far and beyond the R&D DAC makes put into the headphone outs on their DACs - again IMO.

 

[Mr.Sneis]

Quote:

I would say the headphone amp in the Hilo "IS NOT" on par with dedicated headphone amps.  Price being no object or regardless of price.  The Hilo is a DAC first - A good one at that.  However, the headphone amp is there for convenience IMO.  
 
The R&D dedicated headphone amp makers put into these headphone amps are far and beyond the R&D DAC makes put into the headphone outs on their DACs - again IMO.

 

 

[Happy Camper]

As I've come to learn, price does not work for a performance barometer. It's more of a marketing tool. So to say that the headphone amp flies with $1500 amps, I read that as marketing. I can find $1500 amps that sound worse and better. Again, of all I've heard off of the hp amp of the Hilo, I only had problems with the HE-4 & 6 not having enough power to play to the volume I desired. But at full output there was no strain and sound was clear. I still prefer the line out through the headphone rig I've assembled to the single DAC output of the monitor.

The thing that's the greatest value for audiophiles is the versatility this little box offers. For the audio purist, it uses current technologies like xmos and reclocks the data before hitting the DACs. It's sonic performance at it's price ($1850 us) deserves a listen. To be able to feed several data streams without suffering any degradation of quality says it's power supply is robust. I'm not a fan of chip amps but the headphone amp does do a yeoman's job with a variety of headphones. If you want to have the most perfectly implemented amp performance, there are options that do better but for a price. The A/D side I've yet to experience but giving you 192/24 conversion for analog rips isn't 384/32 but I bet I'd not be able to hear a difference though I've lost enough to know not to bet on it. The digital pre functions offer so much flexibility in managing several digital sources both in and out. The DSD capability offers current technology support for those that have need of it. The lack of leds, buttons, dials, etc makes for a pedestrian and simple presentation yet performs like a complex box of it's nature requires. Future upgrading offers a strong consideration for a long term purchase. The size of the unit offers a unique footprint that aids in desktop use. And a personal opinion of it's looks is it's pleasing to the eye. I love my analog meters.

 

[Theogenes]

Nice summary, HC. Maybe you do know a bit about marketing!

 

[grunter72]

Quote:

Thanks for sharing your impressions, Grunter! This might be the first time somebody has preferred another DAC to the Hilo around here . 
 
It would be interesting to see a comparison between the Hilo and something like the Resonessence Invicta, as it has also had a consensus of superlative reviews. Can't wait until I get a few more things sold, I'm eying the Hilo as my next major purchase...

 
Yes, I prefer Forsell but not by much, so in conclusion I'm happy, very happy whith Hilo.
Next Monday I have a meeting with another friend Marco who has got Meitner ma-1 and Lavry da-11, so I'll tell you something more.
 
 
For my expierence I think that Hilo does a very good job as headphone amp.
I'm listening with it with Hifiman he-500, Sennheiser hd800 and Shure 1840 (probably I have to sell some headphones

) and I think it sounds very well.

 

[burnspbesq]

Had a brief chat with the Lynx rep at T.H.E. Show yesterday. I asked whether they were working on a Thunderbolt interface card. He said, "I can't really talk about that right now." I take that to mean "yes, but be patient."

 

[hekeli]

If I knew for sure they are going to implement crossover function (hpf tops and run subs from monitor outs), I would jump on it right now! Running headphones and monitors+sub from the same small box would be awesome and flexible.

 

[Happy Camper]

If I knew for sure they are going to implement crossover function (hpf tops and run subs from monitor outs), I would jump on it right now! Running headphones and monitors+sub from the same small box would be awesome and flexible.

That would be a handy function.

 

[mrcasey]

I currently use this to integrate my dual subs:
 
http://www.minidsp.com/products/minidsp-in-a-box/minidsp-2x4
 
parametric equalizer and high and low pass digital control.
 
The Mini DSP works great but to have this functionality built/programmed into the Hilo would be over the top.  I suppose DSD 128 and DXD would be nice too but the chipset cant do it.  Perhaps there will be a Hilo II?
 
Regardless, I am still very pleased with my Hilo.

 

[hekeli]

Yeah I just use Behringer DCX2496.. I guess Hilo would need parametric EQ also to be fully usable as room eq.
 
But reading about the firmware history and gearslutz etc comments, probably a stretch to assume any major features are going to appear soon, if ever.

 

[burnspbesq]

Not online yet, but the current dead-tree issue of TAS has a Mytek/Benchmark/Lynx comparative review.  Short version: they're all good, but the more robust feature set of the Hilo amply justifies the price premium.