[borrego]

So the preference is now towards the pre-2021 version. As I said one year ago, reducing magnets to save weight would hurt dynamics. After all, Audeze themselves has been emphasizing the importance of strong magnetic flux for years. Like reducing car engine cylinders/displacement, the 2021 models might have thinner and lighter diaphragms (lighter weight) to keep the same sensitivities (top speed), but dynamics (acceleration) still suffers.

I just wonder if using the 2021 pads on pre-2021 models would result to a flatter FR curve, making the combos the perfect LCD-X and XC.

Actually I want to try some LCD-5 style pads on my 2019 LCD-XC to see if the perceived soundstage will expand. Hopefully some aftemarket LCD-5 pads will be available soon.

 

[carlcamper]

I think people have been sleeping on the 2021 XC's. They're sweet for the price as Movie/Music headphones, but would recommend others for all day use, because they may give you back/neck pain if you're sensitive to that sort of thing as I was. I didn't really enjoy them until I tuned them with EQ, which they took well to, then they were really enjoyable and sounded much more natural to me.

Could you share your EQ profile? Hope its PEQ

 

[Giru]

So the preference is now towards the pre-2021 version. As I said one year ago, reducing magnets to save weight would hurt dynamics. After all, Audeze themselves has been emphasizing the importance of strong magnetic flux for years. Like reducing car engine cylinders/displacement, the 2021 models might have thinner and lighter diaphragms (lighter weight) to keep the same sensitivities (top speed), but dynamics (acceleration) still suffers.

Yeah I think that sounds about right. Although it's not like the difference is night and day but it's defintely audible and apparent once you listen to them side by side. The Older X sounds like an upgraded model

I just wonder if using the 2021 pads on pre-2021 models would result to a flatter FR curve, making the combos the perfect LCD-X and XC.

Interesting idea. Maybe people who own the older models can test this. The new pads are comfier too (or atleast that's what I felt).

 

[Andrew_WOT]

Why pre 2021 models are sold for peanuts then?

 

[Giru]

Why pre 2021 models are sold for peanuts then?

Welcome to the world of marketing my friend

 

[headband]

Practically every review I've seen covering the LCD-X 2021 regards it as an across the board improvement over the older model. Even this thread in the earlier pages is chock full of ppl saying the new revision sounds better. I have my doubts the old model is a "sleeper" hit, otherwise... just as someone pointed out, the older one would be selling for more. I know I don't have first hand knowledge though.

 

[headband]

Even these reviews of the older LCD-X when it was released compared to the 2021 when it was released... the old LCD-X review is full of compromise and mentions of better headphones. The new review 7 years later of the new revision is glowing (I'm biased because I agree)

Old Review from back in 2013:
https://www.kenrockwell.com/audio/audeze/lcd-x-2013.htm#perf

Review of newer version LCD-X:
https://www.kenrockwell.com/audio/audeze/lcd-x.htm#perf

 

[Giru]

Practically every review I've seen covering the LCD-X 2021 regards it as an across the board improvement over the older model. Even this thread in the earlier pages is chock full of ppl saying the new revision sounds better. I have my doubts the old model is a "sleeper" hit, otherwise... just as someone pointed out, the older one would be selling for more. I know I don't have first hand knowledge though.

I'm not doubting what you're seeing in the reviews and it's something that confuses me too, besides almost none of them seem to be comparing the units side by side and all comparisons are from memory.
Having heard both side by side, the differences are readily apparent. I'd like to reiterate though: the older model has an accentuated bass and treble, no question. But it also has better detail, dynamics and resolution; something that the new X lacks. This is almost immediately apparent when you listen to them side by side. Infact I would imagine that if I changed the older X cups to wood, etc one would mistake it for a completely different headphone. The newer X sounds more tame, flat and rather inoffensive while the older one is more flamboyant and rich, throwing out more details and better dynamics (a bit hot to handle sometimes but not outright sibilant like the hd800 or T1 gen1). The major difference though is the bass: the older one just trounces the newer X completely with it's amazing texture and viscerality; something that is lacking in the new X (although it has no deficiency of bass on it's own).

Anyway, I don't know why we're even still debating this. The old driver is gone and people are happy with the new one.
As for the older model going for peanuts: grab em cheap! One of the best bargains if you can find one in decent condition!

 

[pofofo]

I’m sure I’ve read either in this thread or in the classified that the pads are the main reason for the tonality change. One user said he couldn’t hear a difference between them when both had the new open cell foam pads on.

 

[Giru]

I’m sure I’ve read either in this thread or in the classified that the pads are the main reason for the tonality change. One user said he couldn’t hear a difference between them when both had the new open cell foam pads on.

That's interesting coz I really believe that pad change affect the tonailty quite a bit. However knowing that the driver has been pretty much changed completely; I guess the changes are not due to the pads alone.

 

[szore]

I'm not doubting what you're seeing in the reviews and it's something that confuses me too, besides almost none of them seem to be comparing the units side by side and all comparisons are from memory.
Having heard both side by side, the differences are readily apparent. I'd like to reiterate though: the older model has an accentuated bass and treble, no question. But it also has better detail, dynamics and resolution; something that the new X lacks. This is almost immediately apparent when you listen to them side by side. Infact I would imagine that if I changed the older X cups to wood, etc one would mistake it for a completely different headphone. The newer X sounds more tame, flat and rather inoffensive while the older one is more flamboyant and rich, throwing out more details and better dynamics (a bit hot to handle sometimes but not outright sibilant like the hd800 or T1 gen1). The major difference though is the bass: the older one just trounces the newer X completely with it's amazing texture and viscerality; something that is lacking in the new X (although it has no deficiency of bass on it's own).

Anyway, I don't know why we're even still debating this. The old driver is gone and people are happy with the new one.
As for the older model going for peanuts: grab em cheap! One of the best bargains if you can find one in decent condition!

Maybe the new one you heard was no burned in fully? How many hours were on it?

 

[Strat1117]

Hmmmm. I had a different experience.

The newer version does sound more flat but that's about it. The older sounded more capable in almost every department. Especially detail and dynamics. It was more punchy, transients handled well, amazing lusture in the treble and great viscerality in the bass. (Absolutely disagree that the older lacks in the treble BTW. AAMOF, the original is a bit bright overall. Especially compared to its more expensive brothers from the audeze lineup). The new version lacks all of this. It is defintely not bad but not as "magical" as the older model.

Infact having owned the LCD-4, I think the LCD-X (Older) was a better tuning IMO. It's tight and dynamic as opposed to the lcd-4 which is a bit syrupy and charming (with marginally more detail ofcourse).

Anyway, as I've said before; this debate is moot as the older driver has been discontinued. The new LCD-X is a great all rounder headphone if you're in the market for a decent pair of cans.

PS: Completely agree on the comfort btw. Never found any audeze to be uncomfortable. I guess people just blow the weight thing out of proportion.

Horses for courses. As I’ve said before, some people like Ben and Jerry’s New York Super Fudge Chunk, others prefer Carvel soft vanilla - it’s not for me to say one is right or the other is wrong. I can only say whether or not I’m happy with my own choices, and I’m very happy with the new tuning. If you agree with me, great, and if not, I’m happy if you are happy. Hopefully, I’m at least consistent enough in my personal opinions (and they are nothing more than personal opinions) that whoever is foolish enough to read my long-winded posts can glean some useful information, one way or the other, pro or con. I refer you to my Koetsu cartridge example in my prior post - there are as many who prefer the old musical tuning as there are who prefer the newer, more accurate tuning, and the argument is identical to the one you raise about the new LCD-X tuning. Supposedly the older ones have ‘more magic.’ I get it, and while I am firmly a ‘dark side of neutral’ guy, I do prefer slightly less coloration than the old Koetsu or the old lcd-x, both of which are known primarily for their ‘Stygian bass magic’, but lack the cleaner, more pellucid treble (among other things) of the newer models, imho. Of course, pads, amps, sources, etc., etc., will all affect how you hear any particular set. My OG lcd-x were awesome in what they did, but they were dark, and had no high end to speak of. Not as bad as the LCD-2 in that regard (which I found to be mush), but my old lcd-x were still lacking in my setup - and yes, I’m going by memory, I don’t still have both in the house.

That said, they both have much musical pleasure on offer and I wouldn’t kick either out of bed for eating crackers. In fact, I only bought the new ones because I regretted having sold my old ones. As is often the case, one must exaggerate the differences in order to render them comprehensible.

One more thing and then I’ll shut up - most people around here say they prefer the Sennheiser HD600 to the HD650 for exactly the OPPOSITE reason. I think what folks really dislike is change. ‘Nuff said.

Enjoy!

 

[Giru]

Maybe the new one you heard was no burned in fully? How many hours were on it?

Nope on the contrary the older X was less "burnt in" in comparison. The older unit belongs to a friend here who just keeps buying stuff, never really listens that much so I'm sure this unit might not have had the same hours.

Horses for courses. As I’ve said before, some people like Ben and Jerry’s New York Super Fudge Chunk, others prefer Carvel soft vanilla - it’s not for me to say one is right or the other is wrong. I can only say whether or not I’m happy with my own choices, and I’m very happy with the new tuning. If you agree with me, great, and if not, I’m happy if you are happy. Hopefully, I’m at least consistent enough in my personal opinions (and they are nothing more than personal opinions) that whoever is foolish enough to read my long-winded posts can glean some useful information, one way or the other, pro or con. I refer you to my Koetsu cartridge example in my prior post - there are as many who prefer the old musical tuning as there are who prefer the newer, more accurate tuning, and the argument is identical to the one you raise about the new LCD-X tuning. Supposedly the older ones have ‘more magic.’ I get it, and while I am firmly a ‘dark side of neutral’ guy, I do prefer slightly less coloration than the old Koetsu or the old lcd-x, both of which are known primarily for their ‘Stygian bass magic’, but lack the cleaner, more pellucid treble (among other things) of the newer models, imho. Of course, pads, amps, sources, etc., etc., will all affect how you hear any particular set. My OG lcd-x were awesome in what they did, but they were dark, and had no high end to speak of. Not as bad as the LCD-2 in that regard (which I found to be mush), but my old lcd-x were still lacking in my setup - and yes, I’m going by memory, I don’t still have both in the house.

That said, they both have much musical pleasure on offer and I wouldn’t kick either out of bed for eating crackers. In fact, I only bought the new ones because I regretted having sold my old ones. As is often the case, one must exaggerate the differences in order to render them comprehensible.

One more thing and then I’ll shut up - most people around here say they prefer the Sennheiser HD600 to the HD650 for exactly the OPPOSITE reason. I think what folks really dislike is change. ‘Nuff said.

Enjoy!

Nicely put. However; while tuning and tonality might be a personal preference, detail, dynamics and resolution are not. And from what I heard; these are on different tiers of performance especially when heard side by side.

I don't think I have anything of value to add further to this discussion here. The X (old or new)(eq or no eq) is a great headphone and you'll be rewarded regardless.

Cheers and hope yall have a great week ahead!

 

[Strat1117]

Nope on the contrary the older X was less "burnt in" in comparison. The older unit belongs to a friend here who just keeps buying stuff, never really listens that much so I'm sure this unit might not have had the same hours.


Nicely put. However; while tuning and tonality might be a personal preference, detail, dynamics and resolution are not. And from what I heard; these are on different tiers of performance especially when heard side by side.

I don't think I have anything of value to add further to this discussion here. The X (old or new)(eq or no eq) is a great headphone and you'll be rewarded regardless.

Cheers and hope yall have a great week ahead!

Lol! Agree to disagree. Listen to a Hifiman Ananda - a lovely headphone which many people enjoy and which was originally in the same price range as the LCD-X - and tell me the 2021 LCD-X is comparatively lacking in detail, dynamics or resolution. Everything is relative, my friend. Once you get past gross anomalies, there are no absolutes in this hobby, only personal preferences. You enjoy yours and, please, allow me to enjoy mine.

Best,

Neil

 

[adeadcrab]

So the preference is now towards the pre-2021 version. As I said one year ago, reducing magnets to save weight would hurt dynamics. After all, Audeze themselves has been emphasizing the importance of strong magnetic flux for years. Like reducing car engine cylinders/displacement, the 2021 models might have thinner and lighter diaphragms (lighter weight) to keep the same sensitivities (top speed), but dynamics (acceleration) still suffers.

Compared to the headphones I own, LCD-X (2021) is slightly behind Focal Clear in terms of dynamics and far ahead of Sennheiser HD800S, Koss ESP 95X etc.