[SilverEars]

,

I must insist..no treble peak on my HE-560 V2. I assert this as a result of listening to some Dixieland jazz, then switching to my Grado GH-1 with G Cush (I.e., over ear), and finding the Grados far more bright (and more pleasantly so). I find I prefer those Grados for jazz (and I presume, all acoustic music), while I prefer the HE-560 V2 for electronic or synthetic music. Still early in my journey with the HE-560s, as I only got them two days ago, but that is how it seems so far.

Ok, this tells me I shouldn't go for the Grados after all. If you don't find it bright yet then it's probably tolerable for you. I did have the 560 v1.5, the plastic yoke cracker with wood lookin finish, but I doubt that Hifiman would change the driver. Even the HE6se has the same driver housing and frame.

It maybe your music selection as well. Jazz should be easy on the treble. The genre is not revealing enough of the trble intensity.

With the 560 I immediately found the treble a bit much around 7k, and posted that it was bright. I knew it wasn't my cup of tea from the getgo. With the HE500, I hear no such peaks, and sounded balanced in comparison (probably the most even sounding of Hifimans in tonality I've heard). I can easily say, HE500 is a superior headphone.

I know you have affinity for Grados and the HD800 so I'll take it as you arn't bothered by headphones of high treble quantities. Although HEK isn't as strong in treble as HD800 or 560, I recall having a bit of peak somewhere in the 8k or so. Other than that I liked HEK, more so than the HE500 in most ways. I still like the HE500 for the value pricing used and better balance, but wouldn't say it's technically superior to HEK. HEK has linear bass that extends that expresses bass intracasies and sounds very spacious lots of depth.

 

[Kitchener]

@ruthieandjohn, did you take of the grills to see if there is a back plate on these newer versions? Here is what the original with SMC jacks looks like:

There is no backplate in the new ones (v3).

 

[bagwell359]

,

I must insist..no treble peak on my HE-560 V2. I assert this as a result of listening to some Dixieland jazz, then switching to my Grado GH-1 with G Cush (I.e., over ear), and finding the Grados far more bright (and more pleasantly so). I find I prefer those Grados for jazz (and I presume, all acoustic music), while I prefer the HE-560 V2 for electronic or synthetic music. Still early in my journey with the HE-560s, as I only got them two days ago, but that is how it seems so far.

OK. I have read the first years posts on the 560. Highly favorable - jerg said they were nearly as good as the HE-6, and better than the 500 and an alternative to the HD-800. OTOH, I've absorbed what's been written here overall (in lots of threads) the past 15 months or so. The HE-6 is a legend (can barely find them, and they go for $900+ when you do, the 500 a can that's older then the 560 almost always goes used $340-425. Then there is the 560, which goes cheap, and has a more detractors than the 1st year.

Ownership bias? Expectations of another classic HFM? Expectations that the 560 would trounce the 500?

I haven't heard a pair in 2.5 years. What I recall was a bit of missing bass under 50 Hz (could be solved with mods), a lower treble rise and an upper treble rise - very bad match w/ 1st gen pop/rock CD's. And a Senn like mid - defined, but a little chilly. EQ would probably fix any treble issues well enough.

I think that the disappointment aimed at these the past 1.5 years can be traced to high initial cost, QA issues, a notable jump in quality offerings from $500-1500 these past 3-4 years (from HFM and other outfits too) and the fact that it isn't a HE-6 or a HD-800.

So, it's time to listen to a pair again on a stack I own. I think a pair is going to be at a meet I'll attend soon.

 

[raoultrifan]

[...]If there was a harsh high-frequency peak on the HE-560 relative to the Sundara or the HE-500, I would expect it to be visible on objective measurements (see embedded links). [...]!

Another measurement here: https://diyaudioheaven.wordpress.com/headphones/measurements/hifiman/he-560/. Perhaps "elevated trebles" would be the correct term, but definitely not a bright headphone. Instead, my GRADO SR60i is a bright can indeed, also DT880 might sound a bit on the brightest side too, especially because bass is somehow notched down.

 

[bagwell359]

,

I must insist..no treble peak on my HE-560 V2. I assert this as a result of listening to some Dixieland jazz, then switching to my Grado GH-1 with G Cush (I.e., over ear), and finding the Grados far more bright (and more pleasantly so). I find I prefer those Grados for jazz (and I presume, all acoustic music), while I prefer the HE-560 V2 for electronic or synthetic music. Still early in my journey with the HE-560s, as I only got them two days ago, but that is how it seems so far.

Now more directly to your post. Grado's are bright, no doubt. What is your equipment? After two days you insist that they are not bright. Compared to just a set of Grados? Want to hear more about what you hear. Can you name a few pieces of music that are ear candy for the 560?

 

[tan.phan.vt]

Typical for HFM there is usually ringing w/ peak. HE4, HE6, HE500, Ananda, Sundara, 400i, 4XX. Several of those are annoying to me, and others are pleasing or not so bad.

Interesting that the later revs have that reputation. At the prices those are closing out on makes them very viable over the 4* and Sundara.

I think the ringing peak might have something to do with the dac amp combo. When i tried my 560 v1 with the cheap e10k+magni 3 stack, they sound wonderful. The treble peak is nowhere to be found tbh. Same with the iFi micro IDSD BL, great soundstage and very full sound. The e10k + magni 3 combo and the iFi micro sounds remarkably similar for some reason, with the iFi edging out.

But when i tried them with the Schiit multibit + magni 3, my ears freakin bleed from the treb. I've never heard sth that awful before, everything sound thin and harsh. The multibit + vali combo sounds even worse.

Those 560 are quite bassy at first for me, since im more used to the Q701 signature, but now i just prefer the 560 over the Q701, sounds more pleasant in just about every genre of music, including gaming.

 

[bagwell359]

Another measurement here: https://diyaudioheaven.wordpress.com/headphones/measurements/hifiman/he-560/. Perhaps "elevated trebles" would be the correct term, but definitely not a bright headphone. Instead, my GRADO SR60i is a bright can indeed, also DT880 might sound a bit on the brightest side too, especially because bass is somehow notched down.

DT880 & SR60i are both distinctly bright IMO - 560 not as much as those. As usual the diyaudioheaven has the story. Big dip at 2k (as big as an Audeze), rings at 3.5/4 KHz and 8 KHz, and an unmentioned 14k short peak. Those treble items seem to be in less supply than I would have plotted by memory. Maybe the suckout at 2K makes for a difficult transition - lacking overtones in one case and then a jump to nearly correct in another.

1. The HE-500 has a peak up around 10k - but it doesn't bother me. I do know that peaks/ringing between 2-9 KHz can irritate me. OTOH my 500's are driven by a good stack and have lots of mods, so I need the 560 back in my hands to re-evaluate.

 

[ruthieandjohn]

Now more directly to your post. Grado's are bright, no doubt. What is your equipment? After two days you insist that they are not bright. Compared to just a set of Grados? Want to hear more about what you hear. Can you name a few pieces of music that are ear candy for the 560?

For acoustic jazz, I used the album from the Preservation Hall Jazz Band titled “Songs of New Orleans,” using many of its songs, with attention to the song “Bill Bailey.” Cymbals were the main source of treble sounds for my listening. For synthesizer-heavy electronic, I used B. o. B.’s album “Underground Luxuries,” with particular attention to the descending bass down to the lowest C on the piano in the third verse and thereafter in “Throwback.” Both HE-560 and Grado GH-1 were driven by my Lotoo PAW Gold DAP.

Inspired by your comment “compared to just a set of Grados,” I took a quick comparative listen of “Burgundy Street Blues” from the album “Preservation Hall Jazz Band Live” with my Sennheiser HD800, driven by the Sennheiser HDVD800 amp, comparing it to the HE-560 through the same chain. I found the HD800 to be just a tad brighter than the HE-560.

I’ve not yet had the chance nor the courage to try to take off the earpiece cover to see what I sent underneath, as was requested here.

 

[raoultrifan]

I think the ringing peak might have something to do with the dac amp combo. When i tried my 560 v1 with the cheap e10k+magni 3 stack, they sound wonderful. The treble peak is nowhere to be found tbh. Same with the iFi micro IDSD BL, great soundstage and very full sound. The e10k + magni 3 combo and the iFi micro sounds remarkably similar for some reason, with the iFi edging out.

But when i tried them with the Schiit multibit + magni 3, my ears freakin bleed from the treb. I've never heard sth that awful before, everything sound thin and harsh. The multibit + vali combo sounds even worse.

Those 560 are quite bassy at first for me, since im more used to the Q701 signature, but now i just prefer the 560 over the Q701, sounds more pleasant in just about every genre of music, including gaming.

I find that a tiny repositioning of the cans on the head has a more dramatically change in the sound (especially on trebles) then the DAC or headamp. I always do direct A/B tests and never reposition my cans on the head while doing A/B critical tests.

 

[tan.phan.vt]

I find that a tiny repositioning of the cans on the head has a more dramatically change in the sound (especially on trebles) then the DAC or headamp. I always do direct A/B tests and never reposition my cans on the head while doing A/B critical tests.

Well that too!
Part of the reason why i don't like the "auto-adjust" headband of my Q701, cuz it never feels right when i just let it slide freely to my ear, i always need to adjust it myself.
But from my experience, the difference is not drastic as long as u can make sure that your ear is contained inside the cup. Even if its not centered, the sound doesn't change much.
In the HE560 test cases, i kept my headphones in perfect position from the start and let another guy plug it into different amps for me

 

[bagwell359]

I think the ringing peak might have something to do with the dac amp combo. When i tried my 560 v1 with the cheap e10k+magni 3 stack, they sound wonderful. The treble peak is nowhere to be found tbh. Same with the iFi micro IDSD BL, great soundstage and very full sound. The e10k + magni 3 combo and the iFi micro sounds remarkably similar for some reason, with the iFi edging out.

For acoustic jazz, I used the album from the Preservation Hall Jazz Band titled “Songs of New Orleans,” using many of its songs, with attention to the song “Bill Bailey.” Cymbals were the main source of treble sounds for my listening. For synthesizer-heavy electronic, I used B. o. B.’s album “Underground Luxuries,” with particular attention to the descending bass down to the lowest C on the piano in the third verse and thereafter in “Throwback.” Both HE-560 and Grado GH-1 were driven by my Lotoo PAW Gold DAP.

Inspired by your comment “compared to just a set of Grados,” I took a quick comparative listen of “Burgundy Street Blues” from the album “Preservation Hall Jazz Band Live” with my Sennheiser HD800, driven by the Sennheiser HDVD800 amp, comparing it to the HE-560 through the same chain. I found the HD800 to be just a tad brighter than the HE-560.

I’ve not yet had the chance nor the courage to try to take off the earpiece cover to see what I sent underneath, as was requested here.

I'll get those pieces.

Yesterday, Thurman Green "Dance of the Night Creatures" cuts 1-3, Patricia Barber "Cafe Blue" - cut 1, Dead Can Dance "Anywhere out of the World", and Steely Dan "Black Cow" (remastered) all caught my ear...

The HD-800 has definition and soundstage width to burn. I have heard them several times. Can be bright, like them on warmer gear than what I have (well amp since my DAC is pretty relaxed). Reference can none the less. I have a pair of 80se's - fun, lively, but, not a reference really. Never get the sense they aren't transducers - but for the price? Not too shabby.

 

[tan.phan.vt]

I'm a bit curious about the HD800s, never heard them before. I've seen there are a lot of comparisons between those and the HE560.

 

[tan.phan.vt]

That sounds like a consensus. Anybody NOT like the iFi DSD Black Label with their HE-560? I've had the latter for a full year now. No build issues at all. And they sound better than ever. But I've been using them with a DragonFly Red/Jitterbug combo streaming music from a 2017 MBP and been thinking about upgrading the amp. I need it to have USB, which I believe the iFi has.

I tested my pair on the original silver iFi and already in love! The Black Label seems to be even better.
I think those HE560 just match really well with the iFi Micro series. They do benefits Dac/amps that has a fuller and warmer sound signature. The e10k + Magni 3 works really well too.

 

[tan.phan.vt]

There is no backplate in the new ones (v3).

Oh, i thought they are the same on the inside @@
Might be the reason why the bass is heavier in the older version?

 

[SilverEars]

I'm a bit curious about the HD800s, never heard them before. I've seen there are a lot of comparisons between those and the HE560.

The comparison is in regards to treble quantity, not that they sound all that similar. I find that Sennheiser dynamic drivers have a different sound from Hifiman planars. HD6-- series further different from planars. HD800 probably has quick reaction that it responds almost like STAX SR009. Similar treble qualities, but HD800 treble seems really shove the treble air to your ears (it's not pleasant).