[wind016]

I read all of it haha.  im with you on this, but im still a little shaken O.O
 
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Man.... has anyone read my comment and article?
 
No one here is a scientist.... right. I guess I'm on my way then? Also, even though none of us here are experts, we can still find good journals and cited sources regarding this issue. 

 

[hudamanium]

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I read all of it haha.  im with you on this, but im still a little shaken O.O
 
Quote:

Man.... has anyone read my comment and article?
 
No one here is a scientist.... right. I guess I'm on my way then? Also, even though none of us here are experts, we can still find good journals and cited sources regarding this issue. 

 

Understandably. 
 
There are almost definitely unsafe sources of radiation/EMF that we occasionally come across. But in an everyday lifestyle, they should pose no heath concern. 
 
Its kind of like how everything is radioactive..... including people. However, health issues only come up when we're dealing with really high level radiation stuff. 
 
It is an understandable heath concern in general though, and due to the increasing reliance on EMF and radiation in our everyday lives we need to ensure that our everyday exposure is within safety limits. 
 
However, personally I fee that companies such as Ultrasone that try to profit off other people's fears is just not right. When it comes to heath issues and concerns, consumers should not tolerate a company that resorts to such low tactics. Thats one reason why I'm so adamant about this issue. Every single headphone that Ultrasone sells is telling them that this type of advertising works and that its ok for them to continue spreading false ideas about EMFs. 

 

[haloxt]

hudamanium, Ultrasone does not explicitly state that emf's are dangerous. Especially in some European countries, they follow a precautionary principle, meaning if something is suspected of being dangerous, but not yet proven one way or another, then don't use it. That is one of the explanations for the TCO '99's limit on emissions. I guess you could also accuse all those computer monitor manufacturers with that certification that they are fearmongering, hmm?

 

[shnitz]

What is your definition of "scientist?" There are a ton of head-fi users, including me, with a significant engineering/science background.  That would basically encompass anyone that called you out during your original post claiming the nonsense about what was causing your fatigue.  You started coming towards the light, researching the frequency that is known for causing discomfort, but then you swung right back into the realm of voodoo.  Headphones, and sound in general, is a very understood science.  It is not as subjective as many on this forum make it out to be.  You can read MANY educated responses; unfortunately they all counter your unfounded beliefs, so you have been shrugging them off.
 
If you want actual data, type in something like "emf cancer" into google before spouting nonsense.  Here are two websites to get you started:
http://www.cancer.gov/cancertopics/factsheet/Risk/magnetic-fields
http://www.epa.gov/radtown/power-lines.html
 
In a nutshell, power lines eclipse all other magnetic fields.  Note this paragraph from the second link:
EMF is commonly associated with power lines. A person standing directly under a high-voltage transmission line may feel a mild shock when touching something that conducts electricity. These sensations are caused by the strong electric fields from the high-voltage electricity in the lines. They occur only at close range because the electric fields rapidly become weaker as the distance from the line increases.
 
Do you notice that you shock yourself more when wearing headphones?  If not, then I can tell you now that the EMF is insignificant.  Even in the case of power lines, despite over 20 years of research by "scientists," a definitive correlation has not been established.  So what do we take away from all of this?  If you've never even taken a class about electricity and magnetism, or taught yourself about it in the very least, don't make nonsense claims about the harm you are receiving from them.  There is a difference between asking questions and making uneducated, unfounded, false claims.  Notice:
"Hey everyone, I was wondering if anyone ever thought about the harmful effects of radiation, could this be the cause of why my Grado are fatiguing?"
versus
"My current headphones are causing fatigue due to 'EMF fields.' I need better shielded headphones because the EMF from them is damaging my ears and brain."
 
When viewed in the context of modern medicine and science, you will notice that no one educated in "science" is worried.  Take a hint.  Notice that even in cell phones, which have to continuously broadcast a signal to nearby towers and are orders of magnitude more "dangerous" than headphones could ever be:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mobile_phone_radiation_and_health
The WHO has determined no link between fields and health.  No scientists at any serious universities see this as a concern.  You don't see any Harvard or Yale studies about cell phone damage, what does that tell you?  The best and brightest minds in America don't take issue, and neither should you.

 

[SoSpecial]

And with that I motion that this thread be closed on ground that Shnitz has posted exactly what the OP needs to hear.

 

[hudamanium]

"Some more information about electro magnetic radiation: Electronic equipment emits low/high frequency magnetic/electric radiation, which is also called Electro-Mag. Electro-Mag is assumed to be harmful to our health. This is proved by medical research all over the world.

In order to protect health of people working within an electrically surrounded environment, clear limits about the maximum radiation emissions have been occasionally defined. For example in the TCO '99 for the allowed magnetic emission of computer screens, in a distance of 30 cm, a maximum of 200 nT (nanoteslas) is the upper recommended limit. Recommendations for the low-frequency magnetic emissions in case of headsets and headphones are still pending or are not really in the focus of importance yet. This is quite surprising as every user is carrying this very emissive equipment directly on his head! Nevertheless, we note a rapidly increasing demand for shielded headphones and headsets.

Within a research of 60 current headsets (1999 - 2000) ULTRASONE found out, that the average magnetic field emission of headsets is more than 1000 nT with a peak maximum of 2100 nT - on average. This is more than four times the maximum, recommended for computer screens in TCO '99;i irresponsible cases show even more than ten times the maximum! The developed and patented ULE-technology from ULTRASONE brings magnetic field emissions of headsets and headphones down to less than 90 nT.

If you'd like to voice your opinion or talk about the introduction of recommendations for the reduction of Electro-Mag, send us your experience or opinion: E-Mail to ULTRASONE"
 
Ultrasone is smart, just like any other heath business scam. They don't directly indicate there are problems, but hell if I were an uninformed person, I would definitely read that as OMG i should buy their headphones because others might give me cancer. 
 
So the answer is.... reading head-fi has been reported to give radiation 10x the amount due to prolonged exposure. However, I have a product that can shield you from harm. It will only cost you $10 dollars. PM me if you want to buy. 

 

[wind016]

I'm currently sitting under a powerline, staring two feet from two computer monitors, listening to headphones, surrounded by speakers, and about to make a call on my iphone.
 
What's my risk level?

 

[ilia7777]

Shnitz, the reason I stated that my Grado's were causing fatique due to electromagnetic field they emit is because my ears were literally getting hot. No sweating but actually getting hot, pretty much same way like when I talk on the cellphone. Listening fatique is something different. Do I know for sure what is the cause ? No I don't. But I do suspect it may be EMF. Could it be caused solely by Grado's sound signature ? Yes possible. The truth is that even scientists don't have consesus over EMF issue.
Are there any people here that have both Ultrasones and say Beyerdynamic DT 250 ? Both of them have a drop around 6000 Hz, so lets ask these people if they feel less tired listening to Ultrasones. My own subjective expereince is that Ultrasones are indeed less tiring after using them for about a month. I'm not crazy about their sound though. I consider it acceptable.
Am I afraid to die due to EMF exposure ? No, cause I'm not afraid to die period. So I'm not going to obsess about the issue.

 

[KuKuBuKu]

try something like sennheiser hd5xx or hd6xx. They are laid-back sounding, and incredibly comfortable, so listening fatigue and discomfort are next to nil. Try those. And they have pretty beefy magnets I would say, so see if they cause you any discomfort.

 

[wind016]

Anything on your body gets hot. Just put a watch on your hand. It's not the battery getting hot... Ears emit heat. That's why we can take our temperature from just sticking something in our ears. Block it and it gets hot. One of the reasons why I can't stand IEMs after some time
 
EDIT: BTW Grados are VERY close to your ears being right on top of them, blocking more heat as opposed to over the ear options like the Ultrasones.
 
Quote:

Shnitz, the reason I stated that my Grado's were causing fatique due to electromagnetic field they emit is because my ears were literally getting hot. No sweating but actually getting hot, pretty much same way like when I talk on the cellphone. Listening fatique is something different. Do I know for sure what is the cause ? No I don't. But I do suspect it may be EMF. Could it be caused solely by Grado's sound signature ? Yes possible. The truth is that even scientists don't have consesus over EMF issue.
Are there any people here that have both Ultrasones and say Beyerdynamic DT 250 ? Both of them have a drop around 6000 Hz, so lets ask these people if they feel less tired listening to Ultrasones. My own subjective expereince is that Ultrasones are indeed less tiring after using them for about a month. I'm not crazy about their sound though. I consider it acceptable.
Am I afraid to die due to EMF exposure ? No, cause I'm not afraid to die period. So I'm not going to obsess about the issue.

 

[SoSpecial]

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He's right here guys.
It doesn't bother me with headphones, but it does with cell phones.  So I'd believe him when he says its the EMF thats doing this to him.
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Shnitz, on every forum there is a guy that considers himself smarter than everybody else. I suppose you are one of these guys. Sorry my english is not pleasing you, its my third language actually, I would like to see you writing in another language as good as I do in english Regarding EMF, its not a conincedence that your Ultrasone doesn't make you tired because it blocks 98% of EMF, I have same expereince with my HFI 780. Strong magnets do produce strong electromagnetic field, same thing happens when you talk on your cellphone for hours, your ears are getting hot because of strong electromagnetic field cause my wireless transmitter in your cellphone.

Umm Cell phones make your ears hot because of the heat produced by the circuitry not because of the EMF. Not to mention most of your bodies heat is lost through your ears so if you block your ears off then alot of your warmth is preserved. Most Cell phones produce both effects by adding  heat to your ears and compounding  the energy your body would normally lose.  You do know that all a sell phone is , is a tiny computer which will produce heat just like any computer is . I mean CPU's a re bassically  resistors with very logical paths to compute many  many equations at once which prouduces alot of heat. It's why I have water cooling my computer right now. It's a neccesity to dissapate heat on ANY electronics.
 
Now if his ears are tired on Grado's then I'd assume its due to the fact that grado's are harsher then your average headphone. Infact that's one thing some people are sensitive too, so I can totally see tha this headphone is tiring him not the EMF which your body is subjected to when ever you come in contact with anything everywhere.
 
Oh and if EMF was that big of a Deal then the T1 wouldn't be so popular now would it?

Already touched on the subject of heat escaping through your ears.
 

 
Quote:

Anything on your body gets hot. Just put a watch on your hand. It's not the battery getting hot... Ears emit heat. That's why we can take our temperature from just sticking something in our ears. Block it and it gets hot. One of the reasons why I can't stand IEMs after some time
 
EDIT: BTW Grados are VERY close to your ears being right on top of them, blocking more heat as opposed to over the ear options like the Ultrasones.
 
Quote:

Shnitz, the reason I stated that my Grado's were causing fatique due to electromagnetic field they emit is because my ears were literally getting hot. No sweating but actually getting hot, pretty much same way like when I talk on the cellphone. Listening fatique is something different. Do I know for sure what is the cause ? No I don't. But I do suspect it may be EMF. Could it be caused solely by Grado's sound signature ? Yes possible. The truth is that even scientists don't have consesus over EMF issue.
Are there any people here that have both Ultrasones and say Beyerdynamic DT 250 ? Both of them have a drop around 6000 Hz, so lets ask these people if they feel less tired listening to Ultrasones. My own subjective expereince is that Ultrasones are indeed less tiring after using them for about a month. I'm not crazy about their sound though. I consider it acceptable.
Am I afraid to die due to EMF exposure ? No, cause I'm not afraid to die period. So I'm not going to obsess about the issue.

It should be stated though, I still suspect it's the sound signature/pads/headphone type( Superaual) and the blocking of natural  and essential heat vents.

 

[hudamanium]

Shnitz.... ilia777 is right about one thing. On forums like these there certainly are people who are smarter than others.... 
 
I'm usually pretty patient with this kind of thing, but when people still refuse to change their minds in the face of overwhelming evidence. (scientific.... what more do you want from WHO studies and releases. There pretty much isn't a better organization on health.) They're just being stubborn. These people have no evidence at all except.... omg my ears get hot with Grados and not Ultrasones, ignoring all possible other factors I'm going to blame it on the one that sounds scary.... gee EMF sounds scary so it must be that. 
 
What I'm trying to get at is... this thread has already ended. Anyone with even a small amount of intelligence will understand this thread. There really isn't much else except the continuing embarrassment of the OP and people with similar arguments.
 
I suggest we end this thread here. By now, its obvious even with evidence these people will not be convinced, or admit they are wrong. 

 

[haloxt]

What's so funny about this thread is that people are so adamant in their belief that emf have been proven totally safe. I guess they also believe those countries putting regulations on emf due to health concerns are all delusional .
 
The way I see it, emf may not be as bad as some other environmental health hazards, in theory or reality. But still, these variables are like spokes on the wheel of epidemic levels of modern chronic illnesses, and since I have seen the statistics for the past century I simply avoid the potential health hazards whenever practical. How incredibly narrow minded people here are about the emf debate, makes me imagine oompa loompas singing about the virtues of the precautionary principle (you won't get it unless you've watched willy wonka and the chocolate factory).

 

[hudamanium]

Quote:

What's so funny about this thread is that people are so adamant in their belief that emf have been proven totally safe. I guess they also believe those countries putting regulations on emf due to health concerns are all delusional .
 
The way I see it, emf may not be as bad as some other environmental health hazards, in theory or reality. But still, these variables are like spokes on the wheel of epidemic levels of modern chronic illnesses, and since I have seen the statistics for the past century I simply avoid the potential health hazards whenever practical. How incredibly narrow minded people here are about the emf debate, makes me imagine oompa loompas singing about the virtues of the precautionary principle (you won't get it unless you've watched willy wonka and the chocolate factory).

1. Have you even read my post and my sources? That addresses pretty much all your points. (which are quite limited). No one is arguming about EMF exposure in general. High exposure at short times have shown health impacts on mammals. Long term exposure at varying levels also show health impacts, specifically in childhood lukemia. However, we're talking about headphones here along with safe exposure limits. Please read before you make dumb comments. WHO addresses EMF restrictions. I completely agree with their points. I agree with regulations on radiation and EMF. Your argument has has absolutely no place here. Its not relevant at all. 
 
2. Your idea of a precautionary principle is idiotic. There. I said it. We aren't talking about precaution such as wearing a radiation badge. Or making sure things are safe before using them. These things are safe. We know they are. Being precautionary about it is just flat out illogical. 
 
If we're having a logical argument here. Please please use logic and evidence. If you're saying that you feel weird about EMF and even though all the science says our current daily exposure is safe, but you just dont like that because... for whatever illogical reason. Take your arguments elsewhere. 
 
No one is being stubborn here except you (and perhaps the OP but he hasn't really commented besides 2 posts). 
 
Who is more stubborn? The person who finds journals, scientific articles, WHO statements about EMF, or the person who still holds on to his position when he has absolutely no arguments at all..... 
 
Please just stop embarrassing yourself haloxt. You obviously have no clue what you're talking about. 
 
EDIT: Reread your post. It was not as bad as I imagined. So some of the stuff above does not apply to you. However my first point still stands. No one in this thread has said that EMF is totally safe. Its kind of like stating that because low radiation exposures are safe, all radiation exposure must be ok. Thats just simply not true. There are really great articles on EMF exposure and regulations, regarding what is safe and what is not. Some of them are linked in my sources. As for headphones, I'm pretty sure we've established that headphones are safe.... 

 

[haloxt]

Right, I'm sure lots of studies have been done on the health impact of headphones.