Going fully Wireless IEMs. Too soon? Or are we there yet?
Jul 26, 2021 at 5:58 PM Post #35,521 of 37,939

CJYYZ

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I may be able to help you eliminate a couple options (based on my experience anyways).

I can speak towards the MT and AZ70 from personal experience. AZ70 I had fitting/comfort issues with, and folks have complained about battery leak issues. I would definitely recommend MT over the AZ70. AZ70 has better build and case, but MT is better for what you are looking for (great sound quality, spectacular battery life, good fitting), but the stock tips are a bit slippery. I am on the verge of ordering the epro tips, but after I get my replacement MT. Xelastec are very good, but people have had size problems with it & apparently it's very sticky in the ear (quite a few have said it picks up earwax so I am avoiding them).

Anyways, Gemini are the best of the lot, but by far the most expensive. If you have the budget for them, I think they outclass the rest. If you want to keep the cost down then I would highly recommend the MT.
Thanks for the info! The MT was second on my list because so many people on the thread recommend them for SQ and they look like the outer ear would offer some support for the buds, not just the ear canal.

Since you mentioned the Gemini were the most expensive, I double checked the price and realized they are out of my price range so I removed them from my list. Thanks for the reality check!

So far it looks like it's either going to be the Z7s or the MT. I heard that Xelastec tips deform over time, but the Crystals, not so much. But I'm desperate to get a good seal so if someone suggested drywall anchors I'd give it a shot. Let me know which tips you settle on.
 
Jul 26, 2021 at 6:02 PM Post #35,522 of 37,939

potix

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I don't really totally agree with your point. Maybe the way that Flossy reacts to the voice let us think that he is basshead. However, just look at his TW ranking.
1. Pi7
2. MTW 2
3. MW08
4. XM4
5. AZ70
In this list, just Pi7 and XM4 have rich and thick bass. In addition, he appreciates AZ70 so much, I got AZ70 and i can tell you that this pair absolutely are't made for basshead.
I've been testing PI7, XM4 and AZ70 and these three are have the best bass among those I owned. It's not a matter of tuning. It's clear when you try to eq them.
 
Jul 26, 2021 at 6:04 PM Post #35,523 of 37,939

miserybeforethemusic

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Thanks for the info! The MT was second on my list because so many people on the thread recommend them for SQ and they look like the outer ear would offer some support for the buds, not just the ear canal.

Since you mentioned the Gemini were the most expensive, I double checked the price and realized they are out of my price range so I removed them from my list. Thanks for the reality check!

So far it looks like it's either going to be the Z7s or the MT. I heard that Xelastec tips deform over time, but the Crystals, not so much. But I'm desperate to get a good seal so if someone suggested drywall anchors I'd give it a shot. Let me know which tips you settle on.
Studs are more secure, anyway. The Crystal should help. If not those, then the TW00. It's kind of a one-two solution for me regarding fit at this point. A few sets prefer the kind of shroud that's on the ADV M5, but I can usually get a fit with most sets using the two I mentioned.

My recommendation is really going to come down to what you think is more important. The MT will more likely have a sound signature you can immediately appreciate. The FITS and Technics both take sitting time; FITS for their neutrality, Technics for the treble emphasis. Get last that and feed them the right content, though, and both will definitely impress. Pass on the Technics if you plan to do any sort of physical activity with them. You won't want to drop one of these buds.
 
Jul 26, 2021 at 6:19 PM Post #35,524 of 37,939

potix

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Some interesting figures for you guys

In 2020 the tws market grew 78% year on year, over 233 million units shipped compared to 120 million the year before. In 2021 we’re on track for over 300 million units (and about half of them are us head fiers probably abusing amazon return policy)

Apple absolutely dominated the market, with 31% share (for reference Samsung had 7%) Sony I’m not sure, hard to find the data on. Surely second, but certainly not anywhere near Apple.

This got me thinking, the market is exploding and is expected to continue to do so as tws reaches users iems didnt; and Apple aren’t foolish. I expect they’re putting some big money on the table given this product has paid dividends. Wonder if it’ll bear fruit from the airpods tree. Wireless Andromeda equivalent with ANC, auto pairing and $250 plz.
With a low budget I wouldn't buy anything pricey at the moment. Hi-res codecs are a game changer but bt connection is the weak point.
 
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Jul 26, 2021 at 6:25 PM Post #35,525 of 37,939

mainguy

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With a low budget I wouldn't buy anything at the moment. Hi-res codecs are a game changer but bt connection is the weak point.
I dont think the connection is the weak point, up to a limit. The Pi7 and Nobles actually sound really good, wired or not, so they prove that even within a wireless limitation you can produce an iem that sounds great. The other sub par tws are not a sign of codecs but likely the acoustic design. Thats why its possible that Apple, who now have more money to dump into iems than likely sennheiser & campfire audio combined, owing to their absurd airpod profits, could make something special.
 
Jul 26, 2021 at 6:45 PM Post #35,526 of 37,939

potix

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I dont think the connection is the weak point, up to a limit. The Pi7 and Nobles actually sound really good, wired or not, so they prove that even within a wireless limitation you can produce an iem that sounds great. The other sub par tws are not a sign of codecs but likely the acoustic design. Thats why its possible that Apple, who now have more money to dump into iems than likely sennheiser & campfire audio combined, owing to their absurd airpod profits, could make something special.
I've been in this (hi-fi) hobby enough to say that companies' money doesn't change much when audio quality is the main point. Apple and Sony will put their efforts on features, others will aim for audio quality.
Bluetooth actually is a bottleneck, I've been having connection issues with both PI7 and XM4 (PI7 mostly).
 
Jul 26, 2021 at 6:46 PM Post #35,527 of 37,939

mainguy

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I've been in this (hi-fi) hobby enough to say that companies' money doesn't change much when audio quality is the main point. Apple and Sony will put their efforts on features, others will aim for audio quality.
Bluetooth actually is a bottleneck, I've been having connection issues with both PI7 and XM4 (PI7 mostly).
Oh right you mean in the reliability sense, for sure.

And I hear you on the money front. Im just hoping tbh, to be fair I dont think there has ever been a point in history when a company has this much profit from iems so maybe the extra money will help. lol
 
Jul 26, 2021 at 6:57 PM Post #35,528 of 37,939

scubaphish

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I've been in this (hi-fi) hobby enough to say that companies' money doesn't change much when audio quality is the main point. Apple and Sony will put their efforts on features, others will aim for audio quality.
Bluetooth actually is a bottleneck, I've been having connection issues with both PI7 and XM4 (PI7 mostly).
Yeah, now that I’m using the BT-W3, and in turn AptX and HD, the Bluetooth stutters on the PI7 are annoying. I found/find direct AAC more reliable; and the hiccups are less painful. Trying to ensure I don’t block the dongle…it doesn’t like that much.

I wonder if it's the PI7 or the Creative that doesn't like the portability/blocking line of sight
 
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Jul 26, 2021 at 7:19 PM Post #35,529 of 37,939

mainguy

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Yeah, now that I’m using the BT-W3, and in turn AptX and HD, the Bluetooth stutters on the PI7 are horrendous. I found/find direct AAC more reliable; and the hiccups are less painful. Trying to ensure I don’t block the dongle…it doesn’t like that much.
oh lord that sounds irritating af. At this point about as inconvenient as wired iems, and you can get some very good ones for £400 too…
 
Jul 26, 2021 at 7:39 PM Post #35,530 of 37,939

scubaphish

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oh lord that sounds irritating af. At this point about as inconvenient as wired iems, and you can get some very good ones for £400 too…
Ok, had a bad few minutes there. It’s not so terrible most of the time. When it happens it’s annoying. I just won’t walk as far away.
I think they sound amazing almost all the time. I shouldn’t have said “horrendous “. I’m surprised by the hiccups but the sound on these is remarkable.
 
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Jul 26, 2021 at 11:48 PM Post #35,531 of 37,939

CJYYZ

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Studs are more secure, anyway. The Crystal should help. If not those, then the TW00. It's kind of a one-two solution for me regarding fit at this point. A few sets prefer the kind of shroud that's on the ADV M5, but I can usually get a fit with most sets using the two I mentioned.

My recommendation is really going to come down to what you think is more important. The MT will more likely have a sound signature you can immediately appreciate. The FITS and Technics both take sitting time; FITS for their neutrality, Technics for the treble emphasis. Get last that and feed them the right content, though, and both will definitely impress. Pass on the Technics if you plan to do any sort of physical activity with them. You won't want to drop one of these buds.
Awesome, thanks for the (ahem) tips. I'll start checking prices for the Crystal and the TW00. I'm in Canada, so they may be a little tough to source. I can be a bit of a klutz at times, so I may be shying away from the Technics. The FITS are interesting, but the MTs are gaining ground on the Z7s. My final choice is also dependant upon which brands the store I bought the Z7s carry, since that's where I'll be doing the exchange.
 
Jul 27, 2021 at 1:20 AM Post #35,532 of 37,939

bronco1015

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Jul 27, 2021 at 1:44 AM Post #35,533 of 37,939

Dcell7

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This got me thinking, the market is exploding and is expected to continue to do so as tws reaches users iems didnt; and Apple aren’t foolish. I expect they’re putting some big money on the table given this product has paid dividends. Wonder if it’ll bear fruit from the airpods tree. Wireless Andromeda equivalent with ANC, auto pairing and $250 plz.
Apple will always do things their own way. The Airpods name is a strong marketing device and based on name alone they could sell tons of it. Sound quality or tuning will never be their main priority. I am not saying Airpods sound good or bad.

Apple gambles on the whole user experience with the Airpods for those within the Apple ecosystem. Things like easy switching between Apple devices, spatial audio etc.
 
Jul 27, 2021 at 1:57 AM Post #35,534 of 37,939

mainguy

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Apple will always do things their own way. The Airpods name is a strong marketing device and based on name alone they could sell tons of it. Sound quality or tuning will never be their main priority. I am not saying Airpods sound good or bad.

Apple gambles on the whole user experience with the Airpods for those within the Apple ecosystem. Things like easy switching between Apple devices, spatial audio etc.
I think always is a strong word for a 2nd gen product. They could do anything, especially after recently hiring a slew of Bowers & Wilkins senior engineers (which they have).
 
Jul 27, 2021 at 3:20 AM Post #35,535 of 37,939

Ultrainferno

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Put the Lypertek Pureplay Z7's on your list too. They are very very good. Highly recommend.

Agreed! The Lypertek PurePlay Z7 delivers audiophile quality for on the go. Find out why we're recommending this TWS IEM, now on Headfonia!

https://www.headfonia.com/lypertek-pureplay-z7-review/
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