[AnakChan]

I don’t find the Utopia closed sounding at all, the headstage (headphones do not have soundstage at all), it is actually more natural sounding than a HD 800 for example.

Headphones generally sound way too wide. I shouldn’t be hearing some hitting a cymbal -90 degrees next to my ears. If you got a live jazz performance, you also do not hear that. A real soundstage is much narrower than the headstage headphones present.

I wsn’t really impressed by the “soundstage” of the Susvara. It just an other headphone in tterms of “soundstage” to me.

Hifiman really tends to make their “soundstage” really ultra wide. Their $50.000 electrostatic headphone has a “soundstage” so wide, that it sounds exclusively left or right almost with very little in the centre.

[OT]
In general whilst I wouldn't say that we hear differently (* one exception which I'll mention later), I would say we have different expectations and different desires/preferences. I would agree on one point though that I do agree the HD800 is unrealistically wide for my tastes. The HD800S was better however was un-involving for me.

Susvara's strengths isn't so much of its soundstage but in other areas but I would say it's generous.

For the Shangri-La, I definitely don't hear what you've described.
[/OT]

About presentation, for me the Utopia is more "in the performance" than listening a performance in front of you. And at least to me, the width of a sound is different from the direction of the sound.

 

[jlbrach]

I disagree,the abyss Phi and LCD-4 have much more natural soundstage than the Utopia....I speak as one lucky enough to own all 3.....the principal advantage the Utopia has for me and the reason I keep it is its efficiency which allows me to use it with pretty much source and use it on a portable basis when I travel with my hugo 2,,,,they are incredibly dynamic and right up front and i can see how many would like that....listening to the Utopia i feel like I am in the front row where a lot of sound floats above me but what i hear is dynamic....with the LCD-4 it is like i am in the 10th row....the abyss Phi puts me in the 20th row.....it is just a matter of subjective opinion no right or wrong....personally I think the Phi is the best headphone available short of perhaps the crazy 50K offerings

 

[Thaudiophile]

I disagree,the abyss Phi and LCD-4 have much more natural soundstage than the Utopia....I speak as one lucky enough to own all 3.....the principal advantage the Utopia has for me and the reason I keep it is its efficiency which allows me to use it with pretty much source and use it on a portable basis when I travel with my hugo 2,,,,they are incredibly dynamic and right up front and i can see how many would like that....listening to the Utopia i feel like I am in the front row where a lot of sound floats above me but what i hear is dynamic....with the LCD-4 it is like i am in the 10th row....the abyss Phi puts me in the 20th row.....it is just a matter of subjective opinion no right or wrong....personally I think the Phi is the best headphone available short of perhaps the crazy 50K offerings

Off topic, but it looks the 50k offerings are a bit overhyped, spritzer and some other people on the other forum did a comparison between the Stax 007/009 to the HE-1 and the stax headphones came out on top.

 

[ubs28]

I listened to most of the top line offerings such as the SR-009, HE-1, LCD-4 and you name it. To me the “soundstage” of all these headphone just sounds like regular headphones to me to be honest. I don’t see anyone winning here in this area.

 

[MikeRight]

Yesterday I had the opportunity to test some of the best headphones, dacs and amps in the market.

• 800s
• LCD-4
• LCD-X
• Focal Utopia
  
• Zeus XR
• AK300
• Simaudio Moon 430HA
• Chord Hugo2

If you want to discover my conclusions please check this:
https://www.head-fi.org/threads/cho...official-thread.831345/page-713#post-14019908

 

[musicday]

I am considering to trade my speakers for Utopia in UK if anyone is interested. From my understanding the warranty is not transferable even if you are the first owner?

 

[Tassie Devil]

Well, 7 months later my Focal Utopias have been repaired and returned, and, as reported 3 months ago (when I thought their return was imminent) , no charge for the repair.

Sigh. Yes they ARE good and even better with a VERO Ref headphone cable. I've been very skeptical about the MIT claims of "opening up" the sound field but have to admit they are right. The Utopias are now just as good using the Vero Ref at offering a wide and impressive soundstage as are my Sennheiser HD800S. And that was previously the one negative I had previously against the Utopias. And of course the advantages over the Sennies still apply which I'll summarise as a more immersive musical experience.

I have a second new MIT VeroRef cable (which I had intended to change for the Sennies), currently set up for Audeze cans but could be changed for Utopias if anyone is interested. I have them up here FS to Audeze owners but if that does not work I could silver solder in Utopia plugs if any Utopia owner is interested.

Out rather large feline liked the box the Focals arrived back in so I'll upload his pic in it for your amusement. How he managed to get inside at all still amazes me

!

 

[Whitigir]

I like it ! Cat instinctively loves box challenges, and it seems that box was no challenge at all. His face is all but a satisfactory of a victorious gaze

 

[Sonic Defender]

@Tassie Devil , you had to wait 7 months? That is beyond insane, nuts, crazy, horrible. Why on earth would it take 7 months? A bridge can be built in that time. Did they offer you any compensation at all? Was this a defect repaired under warranty? Man, that would be a huge red flag and stop me from buying from Focal if the turn around time is that long. Sorry not to be so negative, and perhaps there is a back story here, but I can't imagine anything taking that long. $4000 headphones that you couldn't use for more than half a year, just stunning.

 

[TSAVJason]

@Tassie Devil , you had to wait 7 months? That is beyond insane, nuts, crazy, horrible. Why on earth would it take 7 months? A bridge can be built in that time. Did they offer you any compensation at all? Was this a defect repaired under warranty? Man, that would be a huge red flag and stop me from buying from Focal if the turn around time is that long. Sorry not to be so negative, and perhaps there is a back story here, but I can't imagine anything taking that long. $4000 headphones that you couldn't use for more than half a year, just stunning.

That delay had nothing to do with Focal. The delay was entirely on the distributor. Focal is in France not Australia. Each territory handles its own repairs and warranties. To immediately blame Focal is very short sided.

 

[Sonic Defender]

That delay had nothing to do with Focal. The delay was entirely on the distributor. Focal is in France not Australia. Each territory handles its own repairs and warranties. To immediately blame Focal is very short sided.

That is why I said there may be a back story involved. Regardless, that is nuts. Your point is however well taken, but perhaps Focal needs to make sure that their various distributors are able to meet the quality of service required. 7 months is as I said completely unacceptable. After 4 months I would think they should just send a new unit if it was a defect rather than make the customer accept the burden for a warranty failure (assuming it was a warranty issue) combined with distribution issues. That is just my opinion, nothing more, nothing less.

This is after all in the world of headphones, a high end luxury vehicle, not a stock domestic car and you can bet if your exotic, under warranty vehicle had an issue, the customer would never be treated like that. They would at least be provided a loaner which I think might have been a courtesy that could have been extended this individual. So Jason, may I ask you, would you have ever let a client of yours go through such a timely delay in getting their item back, or would you step in and get them taken care of in some fashion? I suspect you would have found someway to help this person.

 

[TSAVJason]

That is why I said there may be a back story involved. Regardless, that is nuts. Your point is however well taken, but perhaps Focal needs to make sure that their various distributors are able to meet the quality of service required. 7 months is as I said completely unacceptable. After 4 months I would think they should just send a new unit if it was a defect rather than make the customer accept the burden for a warranty failure (assuming it was a warranty issue) combined with distribution issues. That is just my opinion, nothing more, nothing less.

This is after all in the world of headphones, a high end luxury vehicle, not a stock domestic car and you can bet if your exotic, under warranty vehicle had an issue, the customer would never be treated like that. They would at least be provided a loaner which I think might have been a courtesy that could have been extended this individual. So Jason, may I ask you, would you have ever let a client of yours go through such a timely delay in getting their item back, or would you step in and get them taken care of in some fashion? I suspect you would have found someway to help this person.

There is no doubt Focal should police their distributors better. However, that said, in certain territories it’s nearly impossible. Australia is definitely one of those territories.

No I would never let my client go through an inconvenience like that. I’d be up the distributors back side to the point they might wish they never knew me. That’s me, I don’t believe other dealers or distributors see the consumer in the same light I do. It’s a simple policy, just keep in mind that without the customer you have no business. If you have no business ...I guess you didn’t treat your customers well.

 

[Sonic Defender]

There is no doubt Focal should police their distributors better. However, that said, in certain territories it’s nearly impossible. Australia is definitely one of those territories.

Not surprising, but nonetheless disappointing to think that Australia is under-served. Still, if I'm Focal, I am really interested in taking a hands-on approach in such extreme cases. Ultimately it is their name that is out there so if their distributor is dropping the ball, ideally you want the company to step in and say, no, our customers deserve better treatment, send a new unit to the customer and work things out with the distributor. That may be an unrealistic expectation, but I can't help but think that the Utopia is quite reliable so Focal shouldn't be getting killed with numerous failures. If that is the case, given the resources of this company, and the fact that in the big scheme of things the cost of taking care of a customer in such extreme circumstances is a good PR investment. He may not be saying it, and perhaps not even feeling this way, but I would not be surprised if after this experience it would make the person a little more hesitant in plunking down big money if the concerns over service are that significant. So that remains my point, Focal, regardless of distribution is ultimately responsible for brand image and management, and in my opinion allowing this to go on for seven months (again assuming Focal even knew about it) was not the best tactic.

I have a feeling Jason that you got to where you are because you realized that your brand and image was important, and sometimes I'll bet you took it on the chin financially to look after a client because that was your name and reputation on the line. I'm a huge advocate of customers rights, and I expect a lot to be fair, but I think in this type of situation, it calls for extra attention. Personally after 3 months I would have been expecting a loaner or some kind, anything, not just being told I was responsible to keep waiting. Part of the big price tag is an expectation that the service/warranty network that supports the product is also up to snuff anywhere. If it can't be, then that market shouldn't be served if the standard of service is not going to be there. So in the end, and as you essentially agree, ultimately the company is responsible and there is only so much that can be put on the distributor as nothing prevents the company from interceding on behalf of a customer in extreme situations such as this one.

 

[TSAVJason]

Not surprising, but nonetheless disappointing to think that Australia is under-served. Still, if I'm Focal, I am really interested in taking a hands-on approach in such extreme cases. Ultimately it is their name that is out there so if their distributor is dropping the ball, ideally you want the company to step in and say, no, our customers deserve better treatment, send a new unit to the customer and work things out with the distributor. That may be an unrealistic expectation, but I can't help but think that the Utopia is quite reliable so Focal shouldn't be getting killed with numerous failures. If that is the case, given the resources of this company, and the fact that in the big scheme of things the cost of taking care of a customer in such extreme circumstances is a good PR investment. He may not be saying it, and perhaps not even feeling this way, but I would not be surprised if after this experience it would make the person a little more hesitant in plunking down big money if the concerns over service are that significant. So that remains my point, Focal, regardless of distribution is ultimately responsible for brand image and management, and in my opinion allowing this to go on for seven months (again assuming Focal even knew about it) was not the best tactic.

I have a feeling Jason that you got to where you are because you realized that your brand and image was important, and sometimes I'll bet you took it on the chin financially to look after a client because that was your name and reputation on the line. I'm a huge advocate of customers rights, and I expect a lot to be fair, but I think in this type of situation, it calls for extra attention. Personally after 3 months I would have been expecting a loaner or some kind, anything, not just being told I was responsible to keep waiting. Part of the big price tag is an expectation that the service/warranty network that supports the product is also up to snuff anywhere. If it can't be, then that market shouldn't be served if the standard of service is not going to be there. So in the end, and as you essentially agree, ultimately the company is responsible and there is only so much that can be put on the distributor as nothing prevents the company from interceding on behalf of a customer in extreme situations such as this one.

You’d be surprised at how some distributors do everything they can to avoid giving up any profit dollars. It’s not Focal that’s the problem. The problem is greed and the lack of customer care at that level.

The distributor isn’t making the lions share. It’s the dealer and as such, the dealer should be pounding the distributor to get service for their customer

 

[Sonic Defender]

You’d be surprised at how some distributors do everything they can to avoid giving up any profit dollars. It’s not Focal that’s the problem. The problem is greed and the lack of customer care at that level.

The distributor isn’t making the lions share. It’s the dealer and as such, the dealer should be pounding the distributor to get service for their customer

Agreed. Are distributorships structured so that extending warranty service eats into the profit for the distributor?