[musicmaker]

Hi folks,

I need some advice on sourcing parts for a headphone recable project -

I love the jena labs cryo 24awg wire for its flexibility and sonics. Made a HD6xx cable a few years ago and love it. However, I'm also looking to try some nice litz wire.

I saw some nice wire from Toxic cables UK but was wondering if there are good sources in the US for litz occ wire. Looks like Norne and DHC used to have DIY wire but I cant find it on their site anymore. DHC has a 18AWG but that's too thick for a headphone recable IMO. Any other pointers for good occ litz wire ?

With litz wire, realized I'll need to get a solder pot. Amazon has some nice economical options. I use mundorf supreme solver usually. What a good bar to use for the solder pot ? Again any pointers would be appreciated.

I already have the connectors and splitter, so set there.

thanks !

 

[Paladin79]

I generally use Kester bar solder, I will have to check numbers on it tomorrow. I know of litz wire and plenty of occ but litz occ I am not so familiar with.

Digikey has solder pots for around $25 that are fairly decent. I tried a couple cheaper ones from them and got tired of stopping to repair the electronics. I use Kester liquid flux myself.

 

[musicmaker]

Thank you, please let me know which litz wire you recommend.

 

[kingkikapu]

Thank you, please let me know which litz wire you recommend.

I've been eyeing up this stuff myself: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Hak...id=9777d227-4b4a-4135-a9bd-26dd2b893cd0&tpp=1

Hi core count, 7N OCC copper, a few colour choices for interesting braiding. About the only downside is the shipping timeline.

 

[HiGHFLYiN9]

Kester makes some ultra low dross solder bars which are pretty ideal for a solder pot, 63/37 is a good ratio. I personally use an American Beauty MP-9 solder pot, works incredibly well... a little expensive though. Cardas makes some fantastic litz wire, not occ though.

 

[kingkikapu]

This is my preferred silver OCC litz option. I'm ordering the silver and copper high thread count OCC options and will report back in a month or two.

 

[musicmaker]

I've been eyeing up this stuff myself: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Hak...id=9777d227-4b4a-4135-a9bd-26dd2b893cd0&tpp=1

Hi core count, 7N OCC copper, a few colour choices for interesting braiding. About the only downside is the shipping timeline.

Thanks.Will look into it but hoping to find something in the US

Kester makes some ultra low dross solder bars which are pretty ideal for a solder pot, 63/37 is a good ratio. I personally use an American Beauty MP-9 solder pot, works incredibly well... a little expensive though. Cardas makes some fantastic litz wire, not occ though.

Thanks ! I'll look into those. Is the cardas wire flexible enough for headphone recabling ?

 

[Paladin79]

If Cardas says they have OCC litz I would believe them. Dr. Ohno patented his process of continuous casting and I would be skeptical of some of the Chinese wire being made with that same process. Some of the litz is 40 AWG and smaller I am not sure occ can be made that small. Caveat emptor.

I have purchased some Russian Litz wire from Ebay and have had good success with it. It is not super expensive.

I work with such things professionally and unless I have proper certifications I have to be very careful what I buy unless it is for my own usage so my situation is probably different than most DIY folks. When you purchase some of the purported OCC wire from some venders all you get is a zip lock bag with a label showing very little info. I have had customers calling when they see a cable on Ebay that goes from hdmi to vga with no electronics involved, free shipping, thousands sold. HDMI uses a digital signal and around 19 wires, VGA is analog and you only need 8 or 9 wires (RGBHV and associated grounds.) People buy those cables thinking they can go from an HDMI source to VGA or vice versa. When you try to return such a cable, you find out that shipping from your location might be $8-$10 when the cable cost you $4.95 with free shipping. (shipping costs from some countries can be 20 or 30 cents). Thus you see thousands sold and very few returned when they do not work for your particular application. When you buy OCC or Litz OCC or gold plated silver wire or whatever from an unknown source are you really getting what you pay for? It might look pretty and since sound can be pretty subjective you might even convince yourself it sounds better than other cables but does it really? Personally I am more apt to trust companies that have an online presence and who stand behind products they sell. I am guessing that to set up the equipment to produce real OCC wire and to be a certified producer of such product the costs are very high. I have in excess of $10,000 in test equipment at home but I have nothing that will tell me if a piece of wire is 7N or 5N or even real OCC wire. I have seen companies go around the laws to produce $5.00 non-certified HDMI cables. Do you think they might not do that to sell $5.00 worth of wire for $50?

I do buy such wire and I test it against OFC wire from known manufacturers, rarely can I detect any kind of sonic improvement and I get similar results using local people with much younger and more trained ears than my own. I am more apt to trust a Moon Audio or Cardas, or Plus Sound or anyone who has their name out there and stands behind the product. When I first got into this I found a company out of the Philippines that sold OCC wire of all types and gave you a long list of specs and certifications. Some of the wire was $80 a foot for OCC wire and it was probably the real thing.

 

[HiGHFLYiN9]

Thanks ! I'll look into those. Is the cardas wire flexible enough for headphone recabling ?

Absolutely. I've used the 20.5 gauge, 21.5 gauge, 23.5 gauge and 24 gauge internally litzed wire for headphone cable. All work well. I personally burn off the enamel with the soldering iron and a blob of solder. You only really need the solder pot for thicker wire (16 or lower in my experience).

Cardas also makes a 4x24 cable specifically for headphones. It's twice the price it used to be so you may be better off just braiding the 24 gauge wire. http://www.soniccraft.com/product_info.php/cardas-4x24-awg-shielded-p-1911 ... I've used it for plenty of headphone recables though and it works well.

 

[kn0ppers]

If a am not mistaken all the quad-cables are made for microphones, not specifically headphones as you say.

I also would not pay crazy amounts of money for aliexpress wire, never more than 10€/meter. If you buy that pure silver stuff someone linked above, you would need like 6m for a cable which would be 300 bucks just for wire and you haven't got any proof of the purity claims. Same thing goes for most of the small headphone cable shops in the US&EU, they also don't show certificates on their websites. Maybe you can get one when you ask for it, but I highly doubt it tbh.

If Furutech claims alpha-OCC copper in the FHD-35, I believe them. If some Aliexpress seller posts the same identical "analysis screenshot" for like 10 different wires, you can guess how likely it is that the wire you buy is the one tested.

 

[Paladin79]

Star quad is a type of cable well suited to microphones and it has a specific twist pattern. The cable shown has four wires therefore it is quad but they could well be using two twisted pairs which is not exactly the same thing but well shielded none the less. In balanced headphone cables, you do need four conductors and having a braid shield increases the shielding factor. It would most likely work well for microphones too. I know in some applications if one twisted pair is next to another, they try to twist at a different rate so the existing twists do not line up with the adjoining ones. Often times the cloth or paper filler is used so that they can maintain the round shape of the cable as well as uniformity of twists I would think.

Many folks on here disassemble Mogami star quad cables because they use 24 and 26 awg ofc, and it is not easy to go out and buy spools of such wire. There is labor involved but in some countries, that is one of the few reliable sources for good wire. I was shocked the first time I learned of folks doing this and re-braiding it because it is such a well shielded cable as it is manufactured. Once I knew the back story, I realized that they were ending up with an aesthetically more pleasing looking cable as well as a sense of satisfaction in braiding the cable themselves. I admire those who take the time to learn such things and I try to help where I can.

 

[musicmaker]

I'm looking at the cardas 4x24 and the Furutech FHD-35. The cardas is a litz. I know litz is technically better but wondering if I'm going to hear a difference in the headphone cable. I love the jena ul;trawire (looks and sounds great) but isnt litz. Do you guys hear a difference between litz and non litz ?

 

[Paladin79]

it depends on the makeup of the non-litz wire IMHO. I have some litz that sounds every bit as good as other wires, better is a little hard to differentiate. Some materials can sound a bit different, silver compared to copper, but better..... that is hard to say.

Listen to a good tube amp and a good solid state amp, there is a difference in sound but some prefer the tube, some like the solid state more.

I can own most any wire I wish but I am more apt to spend money on amps and headphones because that is where you can hear a bigger difference and get more bang for the buck. That being said if you have spent $2,000 on a pair of headphones and $5,000 on an amp/dac, you might hear a bit more difference in your headphone cables I would think.

 

[HiGHFLYiN9]

If a am not mistaken all the quad-cables are made for microphones, not specifically headphones as you say.

It's listed as a headphone cable on PartsConnexion, Soniccraft, and Moon audio. Headroom also had a grey jacketed version that was specifically for headphones. I agree that every other starquad cable, at least in pro-catalogs, are considered microphone cable, but in this case I think it's safe to call it a headphone cable and agree I'm not misleading anyone. Cardas does have a 2x24M cable that is specifically designed for microphones FWIW.



Re: Litz vs. non-litz, it's just a preference, just like solid core vs stranded in interconnects, or coax vs twisted pair. The Cardas litz wire sounds warmer to me than other competing products. I actually use it to recable Beyerdynamic headphones to tame the forward upper midrange. A number of people in the recording industry find them fatiguing over time, thus it helps. I haven't tried the Furutech headphone cable. Much of Furutech's DIY cable line doesn't seem like a great value to me compared to other brands when you are looking at materials and dielectrics, although I have used their speaker, balanced cables and USB cables in the past with good results. Really the best thing about Furutech is the breadth of connectors they offer, many of which are very well built.

 

[Paladin79]

I know of few companies that list cable as headphone cable per se unless they are selling DIY headphone products. Some industries have governing bodies that insure standards are met. Some audio is like that but not so much headphone cables.

Values can be a little tricky on some cable but I tend to stick with companies like Amphenol, Neutrik, Switchcraft etc. for connectors. Occasionally I will need to get specific headphone connectors.