[Roller]

Quote:

tell me about it, but honestly the amount of money wouldn`t be as even close to the amount of money one would spend on automobile.

Think of the following, if you want to get a truly high quality home cinema installed, you can spend over a million dollars

 

[headoncollision]

apparently the asgard model I found was a 110v model and I needed 220v, order a volatage transformer with it cost alot of money to have it shipped here so I can requested a cancellation. I will try without an amp and then see if I needed one or not.

 

[headoncollision]

Quote:

Think of the following, if you want to get a truly high quality home cinema installed, you can spend over a million dollars

these kind of stuff are endless, you can even find a full silver and gold audio wiring that cost a fortune while gives only a 5-10% probably better performance than normal enhanced copper wiring with gold plating. I have been studying this concept alot lately and noticed that at some point there after high-end equipment you get  a very low benefit vs value, its more like paying 4x the price for only a 3 or 5% improvement,
its really complicated but you can notice it in almost everywhere in consumer and professional products.
 

 

[headoncollision]

so now I kind of understand alittle bit about how low impedance headphones heed and amp to better function, since power =voltage x current. in order for the low amp headphones to perform will they need more current which in turns means more power, thats why low impedance headphones are sufficient for portable use its because a portable mp3 player outputs a max voltage of 1.5v while current is dependent upon the amount of power stored on the batter hence low impedance headphones drain batteries faster in return of producing more volume. now that I do understand!
 
what I do not understand is how low impedance headphones benefit much from a desktop amplifier.
is it cuz the amplifier offers more current when the headphone demand more?
is a computer sound card have limited current which in turns limit the headphone frequency response?
 
I have searched the internet for answers but I couldn`t find anything that could make me understand this question, and above all how can I calculate the source maximum Miliwatt so I can match it with the headphones miliwatt to determine if it is enough to drive them or not.
 
I really want to understand this and wrap my head around it.

 

[headoncollision]

based on all this I just made a simple experiment, on the recon3d pcie sound card, using the ah-d1100 headphones which are rated at 35impedance, while I was listening to a song that has lots of bass I went to the equalizer and turned up the bass frequencies bellow 70 I have noticed that the recon3d card failed to produce a full bass and started to roll and miss the full feeling of the bass even though it is rated up to 600impedance meaning that the headphones demanded more current when I turned the bass frequencies up and the soundcard failed to provide. I have even did that on low volume just to make sure that it isn`t the headphones fault.
 
please anyone correct me if I am wrong!

 

[headoncollision]

so I finally installed the titanium HD yesterday along with the ah-d5000 and I gotta admit its sounds really different, and the thing is huge compared to the recon3d pcie, its more like a graphic card than a sound card, the recon is tiny and stripped next to it.

 

[headoncollision]

and yes it definitelly needs an amp to drive them properly, especially the ah-d1100, 35omp, they sounded really not that great with the titanium HD but the 5000 sounded much better, so am still waiting for the amplifier to arrive so I can properly see the difference,

 

[Roller]

I'm glad to read you're finding good improvements over your previous card. Despite being from the same manufacturer, they are entirely different soundcards.

 

[headoncollision]

Quote:

I'm glad to read you're finding good improvements over your previous card. Despite being from the same manufacturer, they are entirely different soundcards.

well obviously your the only one who is interested in replying to posts!, I am really new to this and I find it kinda difficult to distinguish between high quality and average quality, but what I am diffnetly sure of is the quality improvement between the d1100 and the d5000, I mean wow!, the d5000 has way deeper base than the 1100, you actually get to feel the bass not just hear it!, despite all that I am a little concerned when it comes to gaming, I feel like the recon3D has a better 3d positioning than the titanium HD judging from the same old games I play on the recon3d, although I am not certain, could this be due to the fact that the recon3D has an intergated amp even though its low quality but it still has an effect right?, I really don`t know, the titanium HD really sound better in everything else, but in games am not really sure.
 
do you have any thoughts or insight about this, giving your experience with audio and sound cards ?

 

[Roller]

Quote:

well obviously your the only one who is interested in replying to posts!, I am really new to this and I find it kinda difficult to distinguish between high quality and average quality, but what I am diffnetly sure of is the quality improvement between the d1100 and the d5000, I mean wow!, the d5000 has way deeper base than the 1100, you actually get to feel the bass not just hear it!, despite all that I am a little concerned when it comes to gaming, I feel like the recon3D has a better 3d positioning than the titanium HD judging from the same old games I play on the recon3d, although I am not certain, could this be due to the fact that the recon3D has an intergated amp even though its low quality but it still has an effect right?, I really don`t know, the titanium HD really sound better in everything else, but in games am not really sure.
 
do you have any thoughts or insight about this, giving your experience with audio and sound cards ?

Hehe, it's understandable that you notice audible differences between D1100 and D5000
 
About gaming, make no mistakes, the Recon 3D is vastly inferior in sound quality (mainly due to being an onboard audio chip implemented on a dedicated card), the headphone amp isn't going to bring better quality due to the low quality DAC present, no hardware support for any features (gaming included), like OpenAL, EAX (both gaming and multimedia versions), DirectSound3D, among a few other things.
 
Just so you have a better understanding of this, both a first gen X-Fi and a second gen X-Fi Titanium outperform all Recon 3D offerings due to having hardware support based on both better DACs and complete feature sets. So, considering the X-Fi Titanium HD has the complete gaming feature set and has better components than any previous X-Fi card, it is indeed superior to the Recon 3D is just about any scenario.
 
There was some discussion over microphone handling between the Titanium HD and the Recon 3D, with rumors of Recon 3D having more options than the Titanium HD, but that proved to be fake since once the drivers (and following software package) are installed, they have the same options for microphone usage.
 
The only thing you might be noticing is a louder output, which enters the realm of psychoacoustics, and that can skew performance perceptions. Be assured that once you get your Asgard, you will never look back at the Recon 3D. My advice is for you to sell it and pocket the money to make up for the purchases you've done.

 

[headoncollision]

psychoacoustics this is the term I was looking for I guess, I am really thankful for your long reply and explaining, I don`t really care about mic cuz I don`t competitive game alot since we have limited internet bandwidth here, so if am using the mic then only for voice chats on yahoo or skype, I was planning to sell it once I received the titanium HD but then the psychoacoustic thing you mentioned kicked in and I started having doubts when it came to gaming. now I don`t have this psycho thing with anything else except gaming audio, I am completely satisfied with my reg ( going to finish building it in few days waiting for the motherboard and processor) the thing is everyone witness how the x-fi is superior in every way but then again I start having doubts, I think am gonna wrap the recon3D in its box and offer it for sale and never look back, you know when these kind of psycho stuff kick in you loose the whole joy of the experience and you start thinking and doubting its really exhausting!, now after reading your post I just realized how I was comparing the recon3D with the onboard audio and not seeing much of a difference in sound quality, and your absolutely right about the recon being a onboard chip on discrete pcie card, cuz seriously putting them both next to each other you can see how tiny,small and stripped the recon3d looked next to the titanium HD, I mean I never imagined the titanium HD being this huge it looks more like a graphic card!, so when I open the box of the titanium HD and saw all the accessories and thought to my self this thing is worth what I paid for, unlike the time when I opened the recon3d box, tiny card in a HUGE box and a cd installation guide!, I was like really this costs 100$, even processor and graphic terchonology didn`t evolve that much in the past 10 years in terms of size ?_? !, well thanks again for your help, I will definitely post some pics after I get the asgard, I will post everything together and do a small comparision based on the knowledge you gave me and the thing I learned from research

 

[headoncollision]

ok so I got the asgard yesterday! and everything worked well, I gotta admit it really made a difference!, I can`t really explain it much, but it kinda sounded like the sounds and music is closer to my ears, did I loose any audio quality? not at all everything sounded the same in means of details if not even better, the best feeling is the external volume control nod, you kinda feel the power in volume, unlike when not connected to the schiit, so what about 3d effects in games?, same effects nothing lost and I think it sounded really better in games, it simply AMPLIFY the audio signal and make it less power hungry.
 
so what have I gained ?
-broader audio in games, music and movies
-same audio quality no loss what so ever.
- tight sound, no muddiness more punshiness on high volume you kinda FEEL the sound rather than just hear it.
-RCA and 3.5 sound quality is the same.
-peace of mind if I ever though of buying a high impedance headphones.
- external volume nod and a better looking desktop.
I will take pics of the setup and post them here thank you all for your advice and help especially Mr Roller who answer all my question and concerns with no delays or hesitation and who also adviced me about the asgard.

 

[PurpleAngel]

 
Quote:

ok so I got the asgard yesterday! and everything worked well, I gotta admit it really made a difference!, I can`t really explain it much, but it kinda sounded like the sounds and music is closer to my ears, did I loose any audio quality? not at all everything sounded the same in means of details if not even better, the best feeling is the external volume control nod, you kinda feel the power in volume, unlike when not connected to the schiit, so what about 3d effects in games?, same effects nothing lost and I think it sounded really better in games, it simply AMPLIFY the audio signal and make it less power hungry.
 
so what have I gained ?
-broader audio in games, music and movies
-same audio quality no loss what so ever.
- tight sound, no muddiness more punshiness on high volume you kinda FEEL the sound rather than just hear it.
-RCA and 3.5 sound quality is the same.
-peace of mind if I ever though of buying a high impedance headphones.
- external volume nod and a better looking desktop.
I will take pics of the setup and post them here thank you all for your advice and help especially Mr Roller who answer all my question and concerns with no delays or hesitation and who also adviced me about the asgard.

You have to understand that Roller is the Head-Fi resident Creative Labs sound card fanatic, so he is better at answering questions in that area.
 
 

 

[headoncollision]

I didn`t know that, no wonder he has such knowldge, well I am greatful for his help and everyone here ,

 

[Roller]

Quote:

ok so I got the asgard yesterday! and everything worked well, I gotta admit it really made a difference!, I can`t really explain it much, but it kinda sounded like the sounds and music is closer to my ears, did I loose any audio quality? not at all everything sounded the same in means of details if not even better, the best feeling is the external volume control nod, you kinda feel the power in volume, unlike when not connected to the schiit, so what about 3d effects in games?, same effects nothing lost and I think it sounded really better in games, it simply AMPLIFY the audio signal and make it less power hungry.
 
so what have I gained ?
-broader audio in games, music and movies
-same audio quality no loss what so ever.
- tight sound, no muddiness more punshiness on high volume you kinda FEEL the sound rather than just hear it.
-RCA and 3.5 sound quality is the same.
-peace of mind if I ever though of buying a high impedance headphones.
- external volume nod and a better looking desktop.
I will take pics of the setup and post them here thank you all for your advice and help especially Mr Roller who answer all my question and concerns with no delays or hesitation and who also adviced me about the asgard.

 
 
I'm glad you did find the whole setup to your liking. That current setup is objectively (and from your feedback, subjectively as well) superior in every way to your previous setup.
 
You have the same 3D audio support, only processed through hardware, which has a higher quality output in both sound quality and audio accuracy terms.
 
And I certainly understand what you mean about feeling sound rather than just hearing it, and it's a very satisfying experience

 
Now, I advise you to enjoy your setup plenty, and try to keep a bit away from here unless you want a subrepticious upgraditis to attack you when you least expect

 
Quote:

 
You have to understand that Roller is the Head-Fi resident Creative Labs sound card fanatic, so he is better at answering questions in that area.
 

 
 
What? Please, don't go on a labeling spree like that

 
I just happen to be one of the several users around here that have handled Creative hardware for a rather long time.