[Parafeed]

Quote:

Originally Posted by dlrkdnjs /img/forum/go_quote.gif Anyone knows What the benefit using 6-wire instead of 4-wire in T1 is? I want to recable my T1 with 7N pure silver cable, but it's too expensive. If the difference is not so big I want to recable the headphone using 4-wire. Thanks.

Well, the left and right hand channel cable pairs are individually shielded with the stock SOMMER CABLE - SC-PEACOCK MKII, so you could argue less "crosstalk". Personally I wouldn't worry about using / re-cabling with a 4 wire cable, especially if you're running single-ended. It's nice, (at least psychologically), to have the individually shielded pairs in a balanced configuration.

 

[bizkid]

Quote:

Originally Posted by donthuang /img/forum/go_quote.gif According fkclo says, his low gain beta22 not very suit T1

This makes sense as the ß22 power output is geared torwards low impedance headphones:

0.75Wrms into 300Ω
5.6Wrms into 32Ω
18Wrms into 8Ω

The Auditor/Phonitor is the only solid state amp i know of that has the balls for 600 Ohm headphones (on paper).

1,7W (+32,2dBm) @ 1 kHz and 600 Ohms connection
360mW (+25,6dBm) @ 1 kHz and 30 Ohms connection

 

[dlrkdnjs]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Parafeed /img/forum/go_quote.gif Well, the left and right hand channel cable pairs are individually shielded with the stock SOMMER CABLE - SC-PEACOCK MKII, so you could argue less "crosstalk". Personally I wouldn't worry about using re-cabling with a 4 wire cable, especially if you're running single-ended. It's nice, (at least psychologically), to have the individually shielded pairs in a balanced configuration.

Thanks Parafeed.

 

[b0dhi]

Quote:

Originally Posted by bizkid /img/forum/go_quote.gif This makes sense as the ß22 power output is geared torwards low impedance headphones: 0.75Wrms into 300Ω 5.6Wrms into 32Ω 18Wrms into 8Ω The Auditor/Phonitor is the only solid state amp i know of that has the balls for 600 Ohm headphones (on paper). 1,7W (+32,2dBm) @ 1 kHz and 600 Ohms connection 360mW (+25,6dBm) @ 1 kHz and 30 Ohms connection

You're comparing watts with wattsRMS there. Driving a 600ohm load is easier than driving a 300ohm load so long as you've got the voltage swing. A b22, which has about 35vpp swing, will be able to drive about 2.5W into a 600ohm load. I don't know where this idea that higher impedance = harder to drive started, but all else being equal, a higher impedance is easier on the amp. You still need to check the cans' sensitivity to make sure it'll go loud enough however.

 

[Anonanimal]

Quote:

Originally Posted by b0dhi /img/forum/go_quote.gif You're comparing watts with wattsRMS there. Driving a 600ohm load is easier than driving a 300ohm load so long as you've got the voltage swing. A b22, which has about 35vpp swing, will be able to drive about 2.5W into a 600ohm load. I don't know where this idea that higher impedance = harder to drive started, but all else being equal, a higher impedance is easier on the amp. You still need to check the cans' sensitivity to make sure it'll go loud enough however.

Thanks b0dhi, that's the impression that I was under as well.

 

[Seamaster]

Quote:

Originally Posted by b0dhi /img/forum/go_quote.gif You're comparing watts with wattsRMS there. Driving a 600ohm load is easier than driving a 300ohm load so long as you've got the voltage swing. A b22, which has about 35vpp swing, will be able to drive about 2.5W into a 600ohm load. I don't know where this idea that higher impedance = harder to drive started, but all else being equal, a higher impedance is easier on the amp. You still need to check the cans' sensitivity to make sure it'll go loud enough however.

You nail it

 

[Shahrose]

Quote:

Originally Posted by bizkid /img/forum/go_quote.gif This makes sense as the ß22 power output is geared torwards low impedance headphones: 0.75Wrms into 300Ω 5.6Wrms into 32Ω 18Wrms into 8Ω The Auditor/Phonitor is the only solid state amp i know of that has the balls for 600 Ohm headphones (on paper). 1,7W (+32,2dBm) @ 1 kHz and 600 Ohms connection 360mW (+25,6dBm) @ 1 kHz and 30 Ohms connection

The Beta22 would not have any trouble driving the T1 to eardrum-perforating levels and beyond. It just depends on gain in this case. I don't understand this obsession with amp power recently on Head-Fi, but it's not even remotely a limiting factor here.

 

[The Monkey]

MOAR POWER!

 

[peanuthead]

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Monkey /img/forum/go_quote.gif MOAR POWER!

LOL. My amp is the most powerful because I can't even turn it beyond 7 o'clock without shattering my eardrums!

 

[Helmore]

Quote:

Originally Posted by peanuthead /img/forum/go_quote.gif LOL. My amp is the most powerful because I can't even turn it beyond 7 o'clock without shattering my eardrums!

I think you need new eardrums with better power handling capabilities. I'd say, start scouring ebay right now, they are pretty hard to come by.

 

[pyramid6]

Quote:

Originally Posted by peanuthead /img/forum/go_quote.gif LOL. My amp is the most powerful because I can't even turn it beyond 7 o'clock without shattering my eardrums!

"These go to eleven."

Clearly mine is better.

 

[AtomikPi]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shahrose /img/forum/go_quote.gif The Beta22 would not have any trouble driving the T1 to eardrum-perforating levels and beyond. It just depends on gain in this case. I don't understand this obsession with amp power recently on Head-Fi, but it's not even remotely a limiting factor here.

I'm pretty confident you could drive the T1 to unhealthily loud volumes with even a Mini3.

 

[bizkid]

Quote:

Originally Posted by b0dhi /img/forum/go_quote.gif You're comparing watts with wattsRMS there. Driving a 600ohm load is easier than driving a 300ohm load so long as you've got the voltage swing. A b22, which has about 35vpp swing, will be able to drive about 2.5W into a 600ohm load. I don't know where this idea that higher impedance = harder to drive started, but all else being equal, a higher impedance is easier on the amp. You still need to check the cans' sensitivity to make sure it'll go loud enough however.

Thanks for clearing that up, i do have some questions but these might be too OT here. So we got 35vpp and 0.75wRMS into 300 Ohm. Maybe could you elaborate what math is involved to get a value of 2.5W peak into 600 Ohm from that? Is it possible to measure the max voltage swing or is this only given away by the circuit? If yes how? Is there a standard to measure wRMS?

 

[b0dhi]

Bizkid, go to The β22 Stereo Amplifier and go to "Specifications". Where it says "Maximum output voltage at 1KHz, prior to onset of clipping" gives an idea of how the amp performs into various loads.

In this case we can assume that the amp will be able to drive at least 38Vpp into 600ohm since it can do so for 300ohms. Using Power = Voltage^2/Resistance
= 38Vpp^2/600
= at least 2.4W into 600 ohms.

If you know the measurement was done with a sine wave (it usually is), you can roughly convert Vrms to V by dividing by 0.3535.

By the way, the assumption regarding drive voltage only applies to easier loads. You can't say that it can drive 40Vpp into 600 ohms, then assume it can drive 40Vpp into 8 ohms. Also things change when you start dealing with different types of amps, like electrostats, since capacitance and complex impedance comes into play.

 

[Seamaster]

Me:
The new Beyerdynamic T1 use 6 wire system, means 3 wires on each driver. Are you able to rewire this headphone and keep their 6 wire system? Thanks.

Warren Audio:

Yes I can. Their 6-wire system is 2 wires to signal, 1 to ground. My cables are normally two, or four, to each signal and ground, however I can surely make a custom cable leaving out 1 of the ground conductors for each channel making it a 6 wire cable.

Alright, the only difference is, double helix is a 16 wire cable geometry. You will benefit from it drastically over the 6 wire, and at any rate, 6 wire cannot be "balanced" as it has uneven conductors for signal and return and would cause a phase shift.

6 wire can only work for unbalanced, and if wanting the quality of the double helix, the 16 wire is a large part of that as it uses multi-gauged conductors per signal.