Beyerdynamic DT 770 Pro - Limited Edition, 32 Ohms
I love my LEs with velour pads. Less boomy and an airier sound IMO.
Dripsack
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ide get the 80ohm, period
They sound nearly identical from my microstreamer. The 80 just has a bit more bass, and doesn't sound as good from portable sources; it may scale better but I haven't tested it that extensively.
kelunkeles
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They've been selling them in Norway for years. I have been in touch with beyerdynamic and it has been confirmed to me that they sell the 32 Ohm pros on "special request".
Dripsack
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is the bit more bass noticable to a significance if bass is important?
Dripsack
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the portability is nice without an amp, but the sacrifice once sourced if noticeable would make me choose the higher ohms
Not from my Microstreamer or Android phone. Haven't tried the 80 ohm from a proper amp, but the 32s do improve noticeably in control and soundstage depth with more power, so I would be surprised if the difference was large.
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soundslikebliss
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They are more alike than different, don't waste your money; I'd say spend it on a portable amp instead, and it will make your 80s sound better than 32s plugged straight into a portable source (assuming that's why you want the 32s).
Indicative
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A few pages back, Gilly87 was asking if anyone had tried a DT250 against a DT 770 Pro LE.
I have been trying out a DT 250/80 against the 770 now for a couple of weeks (relying on a certain German musician's retailer's 30-day return policy), and to cut to the chase.. prefer the DT250s.
I have found this thread to be helpful in narrowing down to these two pairs, and was also interested in the question when asked... and not finding the answer thought I'll just get both to try. As most people say here: worth doing anyway.
I have had a pair of Sennheiser HT565 Ovations for nigh-on 25 years (two pairs actually), and I also got a pair of UE6000 from a global on-line retailer with a good returns policy (and low tax contributions in the UK), ... and a colleague brought in a pair of grade GS1000 and would like to post a rambly review of the lot, but sense this is not the place... as a newbie, any advice on the right place appreciated.
In comparing the cans, I used laptop, portable stuff, and the same sources through a Millennium HA4, which is a headphone amp with 4 outputs; each with their own gain control. This allowed me to eliminate volume differences, as a source of difference, and also try the amped experience. I can't say I noticed a huge difference at my comfortable volumes, but have not done an A/B comparison... same cans amped/un-amped. Both the Grados and the Senns need the amp tho'.
The following applies to both cans (DT770 Pro 32 LE, and the DT 250/80):
- Easily driven off PSPs and laptop: iPhone 4s, ipod Nano 2nd Gen, Macbook Pro 15" early 2008, at the volumes I want to listen. I can't really bear more than 2/3rds vol on the macbook, and I suppose that would equate to 95% on the portable stuff, but comfortable listening on the portable things is 60-80%. I cannot be bothered to carry about a portable amp, as most of the mobile environments I'm in will have some kind of background noise, which will have a much bigger effect on the noise than the amp will: what's the point of tighter bass, when it's all being drowned out anyway?
- Not enough isolation to listen to in an aeroplane or even a car on a motorway (again at my levels). Even the UE6000 would not be any good here (ANC is not great, but better than nothing) although they were better than both BDs. I think I might have to stick to the Shure e3c, or get phones with better ANC for those environments (maybe QC 15, or ATH-ANC 7b or 9s).
- Good enough isolation for listening in an office. both in terms of low leakage, and in terms of muting chatter.
- Great sound. I had the UEs for a few days longer, due to how the deliveries worked out, and had given them a fair amount of head-time. Whilst they were very pleasant (ANC turned off), the trebles (whilst quite sweet & clear) were very recessed. Both BDs when they arrived made me think: "wow: I'm going to end up a happy chap, whichever ones I go for". I have ended up getting out loads of tracks, as most people do when they have their new good phones. For instance.. on both phones you can hear the skins on the tom-toms which lay down the rhythm on "Witch Hunt" by Rush (Moving pictures).
Now to the differences:
The 770s have recessed mids compared to the 250s, but more top end treble. The effect is that on vocals, and acoustic guitar the 770s sound more like a practice guitar (i.e. no box), and you can really hear the wooden sounding box on the 250s. The extra treble is quite nice on the 770s at first... but leads to a little bit more fatigue for me. When I swap from the 770s to the 250s my first thought is "where's the treble", but within 20 secs I'm loving the 250s more. I would say that the 250s have less treble than neutral and the 770s have more. My choice for now is to go for less for reduced fatigue, and to protect my hearing for longer.
Both cans can whack out the bass, but I find the 770s to be a bit looser, to the point of being a bit un-natural on some tracks, and also creamier. The 250s have a bit more control & slam in contrast. Put on a track which has loads of bass e.g. Massive Attack, Bomb the base, Depeche Mode, and both 'phones give you the OMG response, but the 250s give you more of the transients.. i.e. you can hear the percussive parts of the notes more on the 250s. For acoustic music, e.g. Cello this means that you can hear the strings vibrate a bit more on the 250s than you can on the 770s. Many people have said that the DT250s are more linear, and I'd agree with that. The part that surprised me is that you'd think "more linear" = "more boring", but I find the DT250s more exciting.. and less tiring. So for me the DT250s win on SQ.
Part of the car and office testing involved putting the cans on with no music to see about the isolation. The 770s cut out much more white noise than the 250s, but somehow have a sea-shell effect on the rumble noise (e.g. tyre roar & engine noise)... to the extent that it was quieter in the car taking the 770s off... as far as the tyre-roar was concerned. The 250s did not have any sea-shell effect, but also let through nearly all of the heater-fan noise.
In an office with background noise, you can still hear a bit of sea-shell on the 770s with no music. In a silent room, both cans are quiet. I have a theory that some of the bass control loss in the 770s is actually resonance.
In terms of comfort, both are circumaural, though the 770s have more room: both in terms of depth, and front-back room. Compared to the 250s my fleshy ear bits (pinna/aricles) waggle happily when first put on. After a while though, the foam pads can push and make my jaw ache - easily cured if you push the 'phones a bit towards the back of the head.
The 250s do go properly around my ears, but it's snug. After a couple of weeks I don't notice though. You can't put them to far forward on your head, as they are too snug. I can't understand people who say their pinnae get trapped under the cushions. I would rather fold my ears over a bit to fit them in, than have them squashed... but I don't need to... and I'm over 6' with proportionately sized lugs.
I would say that in terms of comfort, the 250s win by a nose.
For the cables, the length and straightness of the 770s makes them lighter. I keep having to adjust move the coiled cable on the 250s so that they don't tug. Easy to do, but I don't even have to think about it on the 770s. Still the coiled cable is better than 3m+ of straight cable as I can tuck a section into the belt-loops on my trousers to relieve the weight when walking around. More of a faff with a long straight cable. Both cables have the same 3.5mm end, with the screw-on section for the supplied 6.3mm plug. This screw-on section is too big to fit into most portable cases which allow a small room for the headphone cable. So in summary the DT770s win on the cable... for now. In due course I'll be getting a new 7-pin plug for the DT250s (around £8)and soldering in a lighter cable iPhone/ipod/ipad controls (another £10). If it does not adversely affect the sound, it will be another reason for not needing/wanting an external amp when on the move.
Blimey... it's turned into war & peace again. I was trying to get down what I was interested in, when I was looking. I know there is a huuuuge DT250 appreciation thread on this forum... most of which I agree with, but not many direct comparisons to the 770 PRO LEs. I'm probably not going to bother with the 250Ohm versions, even tho' I believe that they have a bit more treble (but less than the 770s). I don't want to be forced into carrying an amp around.
So in summary, I prefer the DT250s, even though they are £20-30 cheaper.. but I can easily believe that for others it will be the other way around. Most other casual people who tried the 770 vs the 250s for a few minutes preferred the 770s. The exception was the owner of the Grados who thought that the 250s were more musical and rhythmic. Which was interesting as the Grados have even more treble than the 770s, but it is sweeter. With the Grados, you can hear the strings vibrating on violins clearly, which all other phones smoothed over. For me though, the Grados ultimately have an unnatural amount of treble, even though it is sweet, and seductive. I miss the treble when I swap to the 250s, but a minute later find the sound more relaxing. The 770s are harsher in the treble compared to the Grados, but less revealing. As for the Senn 565s... Ouch (in comparison)... but that's another story.
I have been trying out a DT 250/80 against the 770 now for a couple of weeks (relying on a certain German musician's retailer's 30-day return policy), and to cut to the chase.. prefer the DT250s.
I have found this thread to be helpful in narrowing down to these two pairs, and was also interested in the question when asked... and not finding the answer thought I'll just get both to try. As most people say here: worth doing anyway.
I have had a pair of Sennheiser HT565 Ovations for nigh-on 25 years (two pairs actually), and I also got a pair of UE6000 from a global on-line retailer with a good returns policy (and low tax contributions in the UK), ... and a colleague brought in a pair of grade GS1000 and would like to post a rambly review of the lot, but sense this is not the place... as a newbie, any advice on the right place appreciated.
In comparing the cans, I used laptop, portable stuff, and the same sources through a Millennium HA4, which is a headphone amp with 4 outputs; each with their own gain control. This allowed me to eliminate volume differences, as a source of difference, and also try the amped experience. I can't say I noticed a huge difference at my comfortable volumes, but have not done an A/B comparison... same cans amped/un-amped. Both the Grados and the Senns need the amp tho'.
The following applies to both cans (DT770 Pro 32 LE, and the DT 250/80):
- Easily driven off PSPs and laptop: iPhone 4s, ipod Nano 2nd Gen, Macbook Pro 15" early 2008, at the volumes I want to listen. I can't really bear more than 2/3rds vol on the macbook, and I suppose that would equate to 95% on the portable stuff, but comfortable listening on the portable things is 60-80%. I cannot be bothered to carry about a portable amp, as most of the mobile environments I'm in will have some kind of background noise, which will have a much bigger effect on the noise than the amp will: what's the point of tighter bass, when it's all being drowned out anyway?
- Not enough isolation to listen to in an aeroplane or even a car on a motorway (again at my levels). Even the UE6000 would not be any good here (ANC is not great, but better than nothing) although they were better than both BDs. I think I might have to stick to the Shure e3c, or get phones with better ANC for those environments (maybe QC 15, or ATH-ANC 7b or 9s).
- Good enough isolation for listening in an office. both in terms of low leakage, and in terms of muting chatter.
- Great sound. I had the UEs for a few days longer, due to how the deliveries worked out, and had given them a fair amount of head-time. Whilst they were very pleasant (ANC turned off), the trebles (whilst quite sweet & clear) were very recessed. Both BDs when they arrived made me think: "wow: I'm going to end up a happy chap, whichever ones I go for". I have ended up getting out loads of tracks, as most people do when they have their new good phones. For instance.. on both phones you can hear the skins on the tom-toms which lay down the rhythm on "Witch Hunt" by Rush (Moving pictures).
Now to the differences:
The 770s have recessed mids compared to the 250s, but more top end treble. The effect is that on vocals, and acoustic guitar the 770s sound more like a practice guitar (i.e. no box), and you can really hear the wooden sounding box on the 250s. The extra treble is quite nice on the 770s at first... but leads to a little bit more fatigue for me. When I swap from the 770s to the 250s my first thought is "where's the treble", but within 20 secs I'm loving the 250s more. I would say that the 250s have less treble than neutral and the 770s have more. My choice for now is to go for less for reduced fatigue, and to protect my hearing for longer.
Both cans can whack out the bass, but I find the 770s to be a bit looser, to the point of being a bit un-natural on some tracks, and also creamier. The 250s have a bit more control & slam in contrast. Put on a track which has loads of bass e.g. Massive Attack, Bomb the base, Depeche Mode, and both 'phones give you the OMG response, but the 250s give you more of the transients.. i.e. you can hear the percussive parts of the notes more on the 250s. For acoustic music, e.g. Cello this means that you can hear the strings vibrate a bit more on the 250s than you can on the 770s. Many people have said that the DT250s are more linear, and I'd agree with that. The part that surprised me is that you'd think "more linear" = "more boring", but I find the DT250s more exciting.. and less tiring. So for me the DT250s win on SQ.
Part of the car and office testing involved putting the cans on with no music to see about the isolation. The 770s cut out much more white noise than the 250s, but somehow have a sea-shell effect on the rumble noise (e.g. tyre roar & engine noise)... to the extent that it was quieter in the car taking the 770s off... as far as the tyre-roar was concerned. The 250s did not have any sea-shell effect, but also let through nearly all of the heater-fan noise.
In an office with background noise, you can still hear a bit of sea-shell on the 770s with no music. In a silent room, both cans are quiet. I have a theory that some of the bass control loss in the 770s is actually resonance.
In terms of comfort, both are circumaural, though the 770s have more room: both in terms of depth, and front-back room. Compared to the 250s my fleshy ear bits (pinna/aricles) waggle happily when first put on. After a while though, the foam pads can push and make my jaw ache - easily cured if you push the 'phones a bit towards the back of the head.
The 250s do go properly around my ears, but it's snug. After a couple of weeks I don't notice though. You can't put them to far forward on your head, as they are too snug. I can't understand people who say their pinnae get trapped under the cushions. I would rather fold my ears over a bit to fit them in, than have them squashed... but I don't need to... and I'm over 6' with proportionately sized lugs.
I would say that in terms of comfort, the 250s win by a nose.
For the cables, the length and straightness of the 770s makes them lighter. I keep having to adjust move the coiled cable on the 250s so that they don't tug. Easy to do, but I don't even have to think about it on the 770s. Still the coiled cable is better than 3m+ of straight cable as I can tuck a section into the belt-loops on my trousers to relieve the weight when walking around. More of a faff with a long straight cable. Both cables have the same 3.5mm end, with the screw-on section for the supplied 6.3mm plug. This screw-on section is too big to fit into most portable cases which allow a small room for the headphone cable. So in summary the DT770s win on the cable... for now. In due course I'll be getting a new 7-pin plug for the DT250s (around £8)and soldering in a lighter cable iPhone/ipod/ipad controls (another £10). If it does not adversely affect the sound, it will be another reason for not needing/wanting an external amp when on the move.
Blimey... it's turned into war & peace again. I was trying to get down what I was interested in, when I was looking. I know there is a huuuuge DT250 appreciation thread on this forum... most of which I agree with, but not many direct comparisons to the 770 PRO LEs. I'm probably not going to bother with the 250Ohm versions, even tho' I believe that they have a bit more treble (but less than the 770s). I don't want to be forced into carrying an amp around.
So in summary, I prefer the DT250s, even though they are £20-30 cheaper.. but I can easily believe that for others it will be the other way around. Most other casual people who tried the 770 vs the 250s for a few minutes preferred the 770s. The exception was the owner of the Grados who thought that the 250s were more musical and rhythmic. Which was interesting as the Grados have even more treble than the 770s, but it is sweeter. With the Grados, you can hear the strings vibrating on violins clearly, which all other phones smoothed over. For me though, the Grados ultimately have an unnatural amount of treble, even though it is sweet, and seductive. I miss the treble when I swap to the 250s, but a minute later find the sound more relaxing. The 770s are harsher in the treble compared to the Grados, but less revealing. As for the Senn 565s... Ouch (in comparison)... but that's another story.
Indicative
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OK, just before I send back the 770's to Thomann, I thought I'd do an A-B comparison with & without amping on the millennium HA4.
Just as a quicky I used Depeche Mode "welcome to my world" off Delta machine, and "Paradise Circus", GUI Borato mix (originally Heligoland). The difference is so big, that I have not bothered with any more. I thought that some of the pro-amping comments were... ahem ... well I dunno ... well I know I sometimes talk myself into a view if the difference is small
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. I still don't think I'll bother when I'm on the move, though.
Wow, the amp really tames the loose old bass on the 770s... to the extent that they sound like the 250s straight from the iPhone. Maybe a tad better. I'd need more time to know for sure.
Putting the DT250s through the amp tightens them up too, but less so. When they're both amped, the 250's sound tighter than the 770s.
On Paradise Circus, when the heavy bass guitar comes in around 6 mins... again the tightening up is really obvious on the 770s, whereas it just seems to widen the soundstage a tad on the 250s.
Still happier with the DT250s... just that now I'm really glad to be keeping the amp too. Unbelievable value at < €20, no hissing, humming or anything with nothing connected. I had been keeping it to share the music. Now I know it improves the sound too.
Just as a quicky I used Depeche Mode "welcome to my world" off Delta machine, and "Paradise Circus", GUI Borato mix (originally Heligoland). The difference is so big, that I have not bothered with any more. I thought that some of the pro-amping comments were... ahem ... well I dunno ... well I know I sometimes talk myself into a view if the difference is small
Wow, the amp really tames the loose old bass on the 770s... to the extent that they sound like the 250s straight from the iPhone. Maybe a tad better. I'd need more time to know for sure.
Putting the DT250s through the amp tightens them up too, but less so. When they're both amped, the 250's sound tighter than the 770s.
On Paradise Circus, when the heavy bass guitar comes in around 6 mins... again the tightening up is really obvious on the 770s, whereas it just seems to widen the soundstage a tad on the 250s.
Still happier with the DT250s... just that now I'm really glad to be keeping the amp too. Unbelievable value at < €20, no hissing, humming or anything with nothing connected. I had been keeping it to share the music. Now I know it improves the sound too.
musiclife
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They sound nearly identical from my microstreamer. The 80 just has a bit more bass, and doesn't sound as good from portable sources; it may scale better but I haven't tested it that extensively.
Higher impedances HP are always harder to drive on portable devices, thats a fact I believe.
Mechans1
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I own a the DT 770 Pro 32 ohm and they do come with soft pleather ear pads. Not the best for really long listening IMHO. They are easily driven by my computer but I use a dedicated tube amp for music. I think they are good but not great and am still looking for better sound. I am new to the HP world having been a full size speaker guy in a previous life.
I think it's a little bit more complicated than just ohms alone, read something here a while back on the topic, but for the most part yeah that's pretty much how it goes I think.
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