[guermantes]

Hi,
 
I am just getting started in headphones. Bascially I moved in with my girlfriend and there is a need to move away from always listening in speakers to give her some space in the small apartment too and thus I need to listen to my classical music (opera and classical piano mainly) in headphones every now and then.
 
I borrowed a pair of Denon AH-D2000 over the weekend and I think they sound great in comparison to cheap headphones, but I read here on the forum that in a recent thread that the D2000 is not to recommend for classical music. I am not an audiophile so I don't really understand why not.
 
1) Could someone please give me tips on other phones in the same price range that would be more suited for classical music?
2) And perhaps a couple of words as to why?
3) Also, I started looking at closed headphones mainly because I think they would let less sound out in the apartment, but I don't really know it it is enough to matter to someone else being in the same room, and if it impacts the quality of the sound I hear? I do notice however, that my ears get a bit hot after 45 minutes of listening or so. Is maybe open headpnes to recommend?
 
I would really like some help orienting myself in this djungle, I probably will not buy a new pair of headphones for many years so I would like to buy a pair that I will not regret.
 
My hifi setup is a computer with lossless music  >> DAC Magic >> NAD C316BEE. 
 
Thanks a lot for any help on this matter!
 
 

 

[LFF]

Welcome to head-fi!
 
I would highly recommend the Fischer Audio FA-003. It has a very neutral sound signature and a pleasant tone. The are closed headphones yet they sound like open headphones. Even though they are closed, because of the pads, your ears don't sweat. Even better - they cost under $200!

 

[RPGWiZaRD]

Denon D2000 should be fine in that price class, Classical to many people works great by a slightly V-shaped frequency response which D2000 have (well it's only gently so). Bass extension and highs resolution are important things in classical that D2000 handles very well for the price, soundstage is also quite important where D2000 isn't that shabby either (then again D2000 has like no very weak points, good allrounder).

 

[OneSec]

http://www.head-fi.org/t/529144/buying-headphones-seeking-guidance-dont-start-a-new-thread-ask-for-advice-here
 
Recommend you read some links on this thread. Also you need to set your musical preference - do you link bass extension so you can feel the chords and music mode, or you would rather have a very analytical and thin phone to show you all details... That would help you make those decision.
 
If you like D2000 the way they are, and not looking for anything extra, then settling with D2000 may not be a bad idea.

 

[MalVeauX]

Heya,

I would stick with that D2000 in that range. Nothing else will have the perceived response level at that price range (charts don't sound like what they show, but the Denon does).

Very best,

 

[LFF]

Quote:

Denon D2000 should be fine in that price class, Classical to many people works great by a slightly V-shaped frequency response which D2000 have (well it's only gently so). Bass extension and highs resolution are important things in classical that D2000 handles very well for the price, soundstage is also quite important where D2000 isn't that shabby either (then again D2000 has like no very weak points, good allrounder).

Don't mean to sound mean but while bass extension and highs are important, the most critical factor in classical music is the midrange (100Hz to 3kHz) followed by the low highs (4kHz - 8kHz) followed by the bass (16Hz - 80Hz). Why? Nature..that's why. Our ears are most sensitive to mids, then the low highs then bass, especially for women.  That being said, a V-shaped frequency response is the last thing you want for classical music because it will skew your perception of some of the most important and most difficult to reproduce instruments. The most difficult instruments to correctly record and reproduce are the piano, violin, timpani, organ and cello.
 
Thus, for classical, you ideally want a neutral sounding headphone that can reproduce good dynamic range. Consider than the softest passage in a classical piece can be played by the violin and the loudest can be the timpani. The difference just between a full orchestra playing (ff) and a soft passage by the violin (pp) can be a ratio of twenty million to one! The timpani can provide one third of the power of the entire orchestra by itself. As far as frequency ranges go, some organs can reach 16Hz, middle C is ~ 261.6Hz and some piccolos can play as high as 4,608Hz. Also consider the fact that human hearing sensitivity drops off rapidly at frequencies above 4000Hz.
 
Still think you want V-shaped headphone?

 

[TMRaven]

With the ability to EQ aside, I think you can do better soundstaging-wise out of a headphone in the D2000's price range.   So far it's the headphone I think that's the best all-arounder in that range from my own testing and experiences with other headphones, but sometimes orchestral compositions suffer from the cavernous effect that often times closed headphones have.  The D2000 is still expansive and very clear for a closed headphone, but if you listen to an open one for weeks then switch back to the D2000 you'll see what I'm talking about.

 

[Croozer]

You can't go wrong with the D2K.

 

[Wapiti]

. . . a V-shaped frequency response is the last thing you want for classical music because it will skew your perception of some of the most important and most difficult to reproduce instruments. The most difficult instruments to correctly record and reproduce are the piano, violin, timpani, organ and cello.

Excellent post, LFF.

An additional consideration is the need for accurate, proportional highs. The timbre of an instrument can only be fully captured if the overtones/harmonics are reproduced correctly.

To LFF's list I add classical trumpet. It should sound warm and full with a sparkling brilliance when loud. This is tricky to record and reproduce. One problematic aspect is that the harmonics of a trumpet can extend to nearly 50kHz in some circumstances. We are not going to hear this obviously, but we do hear those extending from the fundamental tone upward to the limits of hearing..

As opera is one of your enjoyed genres, precise reproduction is especially critical; we are very sensitive to the accurate portrayal of the unamplified human voice.

The Denon is a fine choice. Are you enjoying and relating to the sound?

Also consider the Sennheiser 600 and 650.

 

[LFF]

Quote:

Excellent post, LFF.
An additional consideration is the need for accurate, proportional highs. The timbre of an instrument can only be fully captured if the overtones/harmonics are reproduced correctly.
To LFF's list I add classical trumpet. It should sound warm and full with a sparkling brilliance when loud. This is tricky to record and reproduce. One problematic aspect is that the harmonics of a trumpet can extend to nearly 50kHz in some circumstances. We are not going to hear this obviously, but we do hear those extending from the fundamental tone upward to the limits of hearing..
As opera is one of your enjoyed genres, precise reproduction is especially critical; we are very sensitive to the accurate portrayal of the unamplified human voice.
The Denon is a fine choice. Are you enjoying and relating to the sound?
Also consider the Sennheiser 600 and 650.

Thanks. I didn't even go into overtones/harmonics. Classical trumpet is a b*tch to record and reproduce well, especially when using period instrument trumpets. They are so beautiful sounding in a good space and trying to capture that warmth and brilliance can be difficult to do. I remastered a set of Brandenburg Concertos where they used a period trumpet...no valves...and it was one of the most difficult instruments to get right.
 

 

[idletime1213]

I'd go with the mid range open ones like the K701, DT880 and the HD600/650. IMO, all are better at producing the "atmosphere" of an orchestra. Different flavors of course. I am partial to the Senns myself.

 

[Wapiti]

The Baroque trumpet is a beast to play and record. One advantage you have is that relatively few of us know what it should sound like.

 

[RPGWiZaRD]

Quote:

Still think you want V-shaped headphone?

 
Yes, I know the instruments are in the midrange but classical still benefits by a v-shaped response, you don't want to over-exaggerate the midrange and make it too warm sounding. The "classical" EQ preset you see everywhere is always like a V-shape too for a reason with the lowest point often around 400-500Hz but should already start rising quite a bit around 1~2kHz compared to the lower mids. I've spent lots of time EQing myself (probably more than 99% ppl here) so don't need to educate me about that.
 
 

 

[LFF]

Quote:

 
Yes, I know the instruments are in the midrange but classical still benefits by a v-shaped response, you don't want to over-exaggerate the midrange and make it too warm sounding. The "classical" EQ preset you see everywhere is always like a V-shape too for a reason. 
 

We audio engineers have a saying. It goes like this:
 
"The best EQ is no EQ."
 
Applying any EQ, especially the preset EQ's in most players, tends to smear the sound more than help it.
 
Classical does not benefit from a V-shape response. Trust me.

 

[RPGWiZaRD]

Look even Sennheiser HD800 which is often praised among classical listeners have a V-shaped response.