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Audio-Technica ATH-MSR7b Impressions & Discussion Thread
- Thread starter Nikolay Vutov
- Start date
nraymond
500+ Head-Fier
Cheapest option for single ended would be to just use a quality headphone extension cable combined with the stock single ended headphone cable. There are plentiful options in that regard. If you don't want to use an extension cable for some reason, I'd recommend looking at aftermarket options (A2DC is a standard connector type, and while there aren't many A2DC aftermarket cables marketed specifically for the MSR7b, I think most A2DC cables will work - I can say personally that cables marketed for the ATH-SR9 work for instance). The only longer (3m, 9.8 ft) first-party cable I'm aware of is the AT-B1XA, which is terminated as a Neutrik XLR4 balanced connector, and retails for $349:
https://www.audio-technica.com/cms/accessories/c3a7d43af0ab0267/index.html
nraymond
500+ Head-Fier
True there don't seem to be longer length options listed on AliExpress or eBay, but Amazon has some options.
$29 NewFantasia Replacement Audio Upgrade Cable Compatible with Audio-Technica ATH-MSR7b, ATH-SR9, ATH-ESW990H, ATH-ES770H, ATH-ADX5000, ATH-AP2000Ti On-Ear and Over-Ear Headphones 2meters/6.6feet
https://www.amazon.com/NewFantasia-...hnica-ATH-ESW990H-ATH-AP2000Ti/dp/B07V1QJKMQ/
$31 NewFantasia Replacement Audio Upgrade Cable Compatible with Audio-Technica ATH-MSR7b, ATH-SR9, ATH-ESW990H, ATH-ES770H, ATH-ADX5000, ATH-AP2000Ti Headphones 3meters/9.9feet
https://www.amazon.com/NewFantasia-...hnica-ATH-ESW990H-ATH-AP2000Ti/dp/B07V3BFPTL/
And for those looking for a longer 2.5mm TRRS balanced cable, there is this 2m (6.6ft) silver plated option:
$52 NewFantasia 2.5mm Trrs Male Balanced Cable Compatible with Audio-Technica ATH-MSR7b, ATH-SR9, ATH-ESW990H, ATH-ES770H, ATH-AP2000Ti Headphones and for Astell&Kern AK240 AK380 onkyo AK320 DP-X1 FIIO
https://www.amazon.com/NewFantasia-Compatible-Audio-Technica-ATH-ESW990H-ATH-AP2000Ti/dp/B07VK46J77/
tolis626
500+ Head-Fier
So, I've been enjoying the MSR7b thoroughly for the past 2-3 months, especially now that I've upgraded to a Fiio Q5s and can use them balanced. And that's why I've been putting this off, but today was surgery time!
I've found some very interesting stuff inside these cans. On a very basic level, they are very similar in design to the MSR7, but the design of the cup has been altered a bit. It remains a sandwich of 3 plates (From top to bottom) : The driver and its baffle, a middle plate and then the back of the cup. Biggest difference here is that the space between the driver capsule and the middle plate is deeper on the MSR7b and AT used a very THICK piece of foam/felt (honestly looks more like multiple layers of felt) to fill it. See below.
Removing that sponge looking thing reveals a very familiar sight for me, as it looks a lot like the MSR7's middle section, just a tad deeper. The other difference is that the screws you need to unscrew to remove the middle plate on the MSR7 are on the driver baffle and go straight through to the back. Not the case here, there's another set of 4 screws. Remove these and the whole thing pops off, the whole assembly is detached from the back and the headband. That's an interesting design decision, but I like it more than the MSR7's design that required very careful placement of the cables that went through the whole thing (and are prone to getting caught between surfaces and damaged). Also, in the middle we can see that AT kept the same felt ring covered hole that was on the MSR7. Not shown in pictures is the fact that I removed it (can only do it from the very back).
Another interesting thing is how the A2DC connectors are handled. The connector is mounted to the back of the middle plate and screwed/glued(?) in place. The hole in the back of the headphones is much bigger than the actual connector, so they used a plastic (looks 3D printed) insert to presumably stabilize the connector and make the whole thing narrower. Which begs the question, were the A2DC connectors an afterthought? The holes without the insert are big enough to fit 3.5mm jacks with no problems.
(Left is with the insert removed and right is with it in its place)
For now, I just removed the little white felt rings like I did on the MSR7. And sure enough, as with the MSR7, the subbass improved when using the HM5 pads and got a bit muddy with the stock pads. Not as much as it did with the MSR7, I presume because of the foam disk on top. But right now, using the HM5 sheepskins and having removed the felt ring, the sound got a bit fuller/warmer, but that's about it, not a huge difference. I will try more stuff in the future, like removing the foam disk and replacing it with thinner foam/felt. It sure will be interesting to mess with the MSR7b, they really do look like a very mod friendly pair of cans. And they are way more forgiving than the MSR7, these things either sounded absolutely great or like trash, depending on what you did.
I've found some very interesting stuff inside these cans. On a very basic level, they are very similar in design to the MSR7, but the design of the cup has been altered a bit. It remains a sandwich of 3 plates (From top to bottom) : The driver and its baffle, a middle plate and then the back of the cup. Biggest difference here is that the space between the driver capsule and the middle plate is deeper on the MSR7b and AT used a very THICK piece of foam/felt (honestly looks more like multiple layers of felt) to fill it. See below.
Removing that sponge looking thing reveals a very familiar sight for me, as it looks a lot like the MSR7's middle section, just a tad deeper. The other difference is that the screws you need to unscrew to remove the middle plate on the MSR7 are on the driver baffle and go straight through to the back. Not the case here, there's another set of 4 screws. Remove these and the whole thing pops off, the whole assembly is detached from the back and the headband. That's an interesting design decision, but I like it more than the MSR7's design that required very careful placement of the cables that went through the whole thing (and are prone to getting caught between surfaces and damaged). Also, in the middle we can see that AT kept the same felt ring covered hole that was on the MSR7. Not shown in pictures is the fact that I removed it (can only do it from the very back).
Another interesting thing is how the A2DC connectors are handled. The connector is mounted to the back of the middle plate and screwed/glued(?) in place. The hole in the back of the headphones is much bigger than the actual connector, so they used a plastic (looks 3D printed) insert to presumably stabilize the connector and make the whole thing narrower. Which begs the question, were the A2DC connectors an afterthought? The holes without the insert are big enough to fit 3.5mm jacks with no problems.
(Left is with the insert removed and right is with it in its place)
For now, I just removed the little white felt rings like I did on the MSR7. And sure enough, as with the MSR7, the subbass improved when using the HM5 pads and got a bit muddy with the stock pads. Not as much as it did with the MSR7, I presume because of the foam disk on top. But right now, using the HM5 sheepskins and having removed the felt ring, the sound got a bit fuller/warmer, but that's about it, not a huge difference. I will try more stuff in the future, like removing the foam disk and replacing it with thinner foam/felt. It sure will be interesting to mess with the MSR7b, they really do look like a very mod friendly pair of cans. And they are way more forgiving than the MSR7, these things either sounded absolutely great or like trash, depending on what you did.
Attachments
Yes an extension cable is a good option.
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Yes saw those. Have used NewFantasia cables in past. From three purchased for noise cancelling headphones, two developed shorts in under six months, so reticent to try NewFantasia again.
Update: Though reticent, purchased New Fantasia non-balanced 3.5mm for ATH-MSR7b. Have used for weeks with no issues. Will update if issues develop later. The price is right in hobby of silly cable prices.
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nraymond
500+ Head-Fier
That is an unfortunate track record... can't say I've ever experienced headphone cables that developed shorts (though I do mostly baby my stuff, and use things like hard cases even for my earphones). Have had two NewFantasia cables in the stable for a couple of years, no problems, though only one has seen regular use (balanced cable for a HiFiMan HE-400i).
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There's a Fiio 4mm female->2,5mm male balanced converter plug, if you don't mind a dongle. In the range of 10 bucks or so. Works well.
zazex
Headphoneus Supremus
Another solution along similar lines is to contact Redco Audio via their website.
https://www.redco.com/
They turn out immensely high quality cables made to your order at reasonable
prices. (e.g. 10 foot Mogami, Gotham(!) and others should cost about 40 bucks.
I've bought several from them over the years; their turnaround time is about
10 days. A really fine outfit; professional through and through.
zazex
Headphoneus Supremus
Oh, forgot to add that Grado makes a very good extension cable.
A bit on the thick/heavy side - just so you know.
But SQ and build quality are excellent.
And it's buy, plug, and play from a highly regarded maker.
Price is right, IMO. They're even resellable, I've done so myself.
https://www.4ourears.net/Grado_headphone_extension_cable_p/4e-excab.htm
Cheers,
A bit on the thick/heavy side - just so you know.
But SQ and build quality are excellent.
And it's buy, plug, and play from a highly regarded maker.
Price is right, IMO. They're even resellable, I've done so myself.
https://www.4ourears.net/Grado_headphone_extension_cable_p/4e-excab.htm
Cheers,
Matez
Sponsor: Forza Audio Works
- Joined
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tolis626
500+ Head-Fier
So, because I'm stubborn like that, I'm continuing on with my previous post about disassembling and "modding" the MSR7b, in spite of the fact that people may say I'm ruining their (admittedly excellent) stock tuning. I have the deepest respect for the work of AT's engineers who created these awesome cans, but I enjoy tinkering with stuff and the MSR7 and MSR7b have proved excellent platforms to do so.
Having got that out of the way, these same enginners used a sponge (really, a sponge) internally to tune the sound, so the official, stock solutions are sometimes as ghetto looking as custom stuff. And I'm saying this as a compliment, if they managed to fix something in the sound by placing that there (I don't know what happens if it's removed), then it's an ingenious solution to what could've been a bigger problem, maybe requiring a complete retuning or redesign of the driver/cup structure.
Now, onto the sound! Having removed the felt rings, as I said before, didn't result in the drastic, night-and-day difference that it did with the original MSR7. With the old ones, HM5 (as well as most other) pads were downright unusable without further modding. After removing the felt rings, they suddenly opened up, the highs calmed down, the bass came back up and, while really close to stock in tonality, I found them much more enjoyable (mainly because of the stronger bass, bigger sound and, of course, comfort, which was the first thing that mattered to me when I started messing with them). The MSR7b were totally different in that regard. Putting HM5 pads on them was painless. Remove the old ones, put on the HM5s, enjoy. Lose a bit of bass here, add a bit of soundstage there, lose a bit of intimacy in the mids, add quite a bit of comfort... It was different, rather than plain better or worse. And I did enjoy them like that, that's why I've held out 'til now. You can absolutely just slap a pair of HM5s on the b and call it a day (maybe add a piece of felt between the driver and the pad if you find the highs a bit hot, like I've done for now). However, removing the felt rings does change things up. First up, you get more bass, especially subbass. That can be seen as good or bad, depending on what you like. Some may consider them boomy/bassy like this, but I like them. Taming this should be easy though, without putting the felt rings back on (maybe lining the back with felt would do the trick to reduce reflections?). What I like most with them like this is that they sound BIGGER. Not necessarily wider, I can't put my finger on width. No, they sound physically bigger, like the difference you get when going from an IEM to a full size can, or from a normal size dynamic driver headphone to a huge planar. Now there's a certain sense of scale about the sound that they lacked before. Things sound tall, and heavy, and they fill the space around me instead of just occupying points. Imaging is still as excellent as ever too, I can pinpoint where every single thing comes from. It's a very very good sound. I can understand why AT didn't go for this tuning, as I still enjoy the stock one a lot and that doesn't require comically huge (but stupidly comfy) pads, but what I'm hearing now is an experience. I highly recommend it.
Notes :
1) Disassembly and modding of the MSR7b is quite a bit easier than the MSR7, due to the wires not running the entire depth of the phones. If you're good with electronics, it's almost fool proof. Just don't yank anything too hard.
2) Tip on using the HM5 pads with the MSR7 and MSR7b (and other similarly shaped/sized headphones) : The pads are bigger than the cups, so they will "spill" over the sides, deform and become much shallower and uncomfortable over time, as the foam crushes. To combat that, you can put a piece of foam backer rod or even a cut wire (a somewhat stiff, medium thickness one, preferably) in the shape of the pad below the pad (but above the fabric on the back). Push it to the edges and it will keep the pad on the phones without deforming. Disclaimer, this is @ModiHiFi 's idea, not mine, but it's worked wonders so far.
3) Sheepskin pads are so much nicer than the stock pads or pleather HM5. Do yourself a favor and get those, both for sound and comfort.
4) If you do all this and decide to put a piece of felt on there too to calm them down a bit, be prepared to lose a bit of efficiency. As with the MSR7, the MSR7b are stupid efficient, but they require more and more power the more of this stuff you do to them. It's not a huge difference, but e.g when using them with my Q1 I would run them at a 5.5-6 on low gain at stock, but it quickly went to a 6-6.5 or even 7 (out of 9) with the mods on.
5) This is linked to 4. Don't mistake efficiency for no need of power. These things love a powerful amp. They will play loudly off of a potato if needed, but give them some juice and they sound a lot better. Also, they're a bit picky about your amp, they don't play nicely with everything. Oh, and the MSR7 (Dunno about the b) love tubes, strangely. Note to self : I wanna get a tube amp at some point...
Having got that out of the way, these same enginners used a sponge (really, a sponge) internally to tune the sound, so the official, stock solutions are sometimes as ghetto looking as custom stuff. And I'm saying this as a compliment, if they managed to fix something in the sound by placing that there (I don't know what happens if it's removed), then it's an ingenious solution to what could've been a bigger problem, maybe requiring a complete retuning or redesign of the driver/cup structure.
Now, onto the sound! Having removed the felt rings, as I said before, didn't result in the drastic, night-and-day difference that it did with the original MSR7. With the old ones, HM5 (as well as most other) pads were downright unusable without further modding. After removing the felt rings, they suddenly opened up, the highs calmed down, the bass came back up and, while really close to stock in tonality, I found them much more enjoyable (mainly because of the stronger bass, bigger sound and, of course, comfort, which was the first thing that mattered to me when I started messing with them). The MSR7b were totally different in that regard. Putting HM5 pads on them was painless. Remove the old ones, put on the HM5s, enjoy. Lose a bit of bass here, add a bit of soundstage there, lose a bit of intimacy in the mids, add quite a bit of comfort... It was different, rather than plain better or worse. And I did enjoy them like that, that's why I've held out 'til now. You can absolutely just slap a pair of HM5s on the b and call it a day (maybe add a piece of felt between the driver and the pad if you find the highs a bit hot, like I've done for now). However, removing the felt rings does change things up. First up, you get more bass, especially subbass. That can be seen as good or bad, depending on what you like. Some may consider them boomy/bassy like this, but I like them. Taming this should be easy though, without putting the felt rings back on (maybe lining the back with felt would do the trick to reduce reflections?). What I like most with them like this is that they sound BIGGER. Not necessarily wider, I can't put my finger on width. No, they sound physically bigger, like the difference you get when going from an IEM to a full size can, or from a normal size dynamic driver headphone to a huge planar. Now there's a certain sense of scale about the sound that they lacked before. Things sound tall, and heavy, and they fill the space around me instead of just occupying points. Imaging is still as excellent as ever too, I can pinpoint where every single thing comes from. It's a very very good sound. I can understand why AT didn't go for this tuning, as I still enjoy the stock one a lot and that doesn't require comically huge (but stupidly comfy) pads, but what I'm hearing now is an experience. I highly recommend it.
Notes :
1) Disassembly and modding of the MSR7b is quite a bit easier than the MSR7, due to the wires not running the entire depth of the phones. If you're good with electronics, it's almost fool proof. Just don't yank anything too hard.
2) Tip on using the HM5 pads with the MSR7 and MSR7b (and other similarly shaped/sized headphones) : The pads are bigger than the cups, so they will "spill" over the sides, deform and become much shallower and uncomfortable over time, as the foam crushes. To combat that, you can put a piece of foam backer rod or even a cut wire (a somewhat stiff, medium thickness one, preferably) in the shape of the pad below the pad (but above the fabric on the back). Push it to the edges and it will keep the pad on the phones without deforming. Disclaimer, this is @ModiHiFi 's idea, not mine, but it's worked wonders so far.
3) Sheepskin pads are so much nicer than the stock pads or pleather HM5. Do yourself a favor and get those, both for sound and comfort.
4) If you do all this and decide to put a piece of felt on there too to calm them down a bit, be prepared to lose a bit of efficiency. As with the MSR7, the MSR7b are stupid efficient, but they require more and more power the more of this stuff you do to them. It's not a huge difference, but e.g when using them with my Q1 I would run them at a 5.5-6 on low gain at stock, but it quickly went to a 6-6.5 or even 7 (out of 9) with the mods on.
5) This is linked to 4. Don't mistake efficiency for no need of power. These things love a powerful amp. They will play loudly off of a potato if needed, but give them some juice and they sound a lot better. Also, they're a bit picky about your amp, they don't play nicely with everything. Oh, and the MSR7 (Dunno about the b) love tubes, strangely. Note to self : I wanna get a tube amp at some point...
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tolis626
500+ Head-Fier
Calming the treble down is relatively easy and doesn't need EQ. You can try using a piece of felt or foam between the driver and your ear. Just cut an oval the shape and size of the pad and stuff it below the cushion. For these AT headphones it works wonders and doesn't mess with the sound too much.
As for pads, the MSR7b aren't as picky as the MSR7. You can try the pads you have, it's the easiest mod to do. Maybe you'll like them with the other pads, who knows? I'm using HM5 sheepskin pads on mine and can't go back to stock.
dadracer2
500+ Head-Fier
Well I tried the 4.4mm to 2.5mm balanced adapter cable from Amazon. Its already on its way back. Right hand channel kept dropping. I tried the usual taking the jack in and out or turning it around in the socket.....nope.
So now I got a hold of the Fiio LB 4.4M which is their version of the same thing. This works and with a satisfying click when you put the 4.4mm jack in.
I'd say the improvements are a bit more bass presence. Not warmth or extension just a bit more emphasis if that makes sense. Also the individual instruments or vocals are given more space and with better image depth.
These are just my impressions so not necessarily how you will hear it. Anyway I am happy with this adapter cable and it gives the MSRs a chance to work at their full potential. Oh and the tracks I listened to were plain old Red Book from my Cayin DAP.
So now I got a hold of the Fiio LB 4.4M which is their version of the same thing. This works and with a satisfying click when you put the 4.4mm jack in.
I'd say the improvements are a bit more bass presence. Not warmth or extension just a bit more emphasis if that makes sense. Also the individual instruments or vocals are given more space and with better image depth.
These are just my impressions so not necessarily how you will hear it. Anyway I am happy with this adapter cable and it gives the MSRs a chance to work at their full potential. Oh and the tracks I listened to were plain old Red Book from my Cayin DAP.
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