[haejuk]

I have the 400 and the 400i. will be sending the 400i back. Now looking at the audeze. So the model is LCD-2.. But ive seen the word Fazor and 2.2 and others. A little confusing on their model ect. So which is a good one to google thx.. I prefer a good bass. Prefer one than can be driven by the asgard 2 and maybe a fiio e12.

 
All the revisions can be confusing if you are just starting to look at them now.  The first major change to LCD2 was the second revision drivers.  These are referred to as LCD-2.2 or LCD-2 rev 2.  These have newer drivers than the original rev 1s that have a little more extension in the highs and the lows.  The impedance also went from 50 ohms for rev 1 to 60 ohms for rev 2.  You can't always tell a rev 2 from a rev 1 just from the looks.  The rev 1 had a foam headband that was replaced with a nicer looking, but less comfortable leather headband in the rev 2.
 
The next changes that came along were cosmetic/structural and don't affect the sound quality at all.  The wooden connectors were replaced with more sturdy metal connectors.  Around this time they also introduced the bamboo version.  All versions with wooden connectors are rosewood, as there was no bamboo options.  I have seen some people refer to these as "rev 3", but I don't think that ever really caught on since they still use the same rev 2 drivers.
 
The latest change is the fazors.  These are referred to as LCD-2.2 F, LCD-2 Fazor, or something like that.  The fazor is supposed to improve the soundstage/imaging and rolls off the extreme low frequency and improve the highs (correct me if I'm wrong here).  Don't be afraid of weak bass though, I think people say the roll-off is below audible level (once again correct me if I'm wrong, never heard the fazor version).  These drivers are now 70 ohm impedance and more sensitive than the non-fazor rev 2 drivers.
 
I hope I didn't miss anything, but these are most of the changes that I am familiar with.  There were some changes I didn't mention to the rev 1 grills, but I have never seen a pair with the original grills for sale here.

 

[SomeGuyDude]

http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/audeze-lcd-x-fazor-and-fresh-listen-current-lcd-2-and-lcd-3 has a great explanation of the Fazor. I have no clue how audible that change is, and the explanation left me with his fear that the pre-fazor model was this muddled interference-filled mess, but... nnnnope. 
 
I had to do some serial-number digging but it does seem I have the rev2, just before the metal connectors were implemented. I gotta be honest, I like the look a lot better. 

 

[thomascrown]

  Never liked the he-400 and it was one of the worst headphones I've ever had. To me they’re not even comparable to the LCD-2. 

Same here, I had them for 1/2 a day, my concerns started in the very moment I tried to connect the cable... happily replaced with the lcd2.

 

[haejuk]

I also went from HE-400 to LCD-2.  I was really bothered by the treble tizz on the HE-400.  I wasn't a fan of the connectors, but I could live with them.

 

[jjkuz]

I'm curious to know more about that, because I have an lcd2 pre fazor (from one year ago), and thats exactly how I feel about the bass. I tried the hd800s and he560 as like a counter sound signature, and they were good but too bright or hollow. but they both had way more slam and punch in the bass, so that even tho there was less quantity, and extension, music still sounded correct in the low end. where my lcd2 sounds like a drummer whose so exhausted he can hardly get any attack or punch out of the bass drum. it made these the bass light pair in comparison to those other two, which is weird to me considering all the impressions. I'm considering getting the fazor model now because I want a little bit more air, imaging, and hopefully punch. since thats what the fazors seem to do. But since you also seem to have a similar experience with that other pair, so is there like some very rare quality control thing?


Otherwise in the 1000 dollar and under price range I've run out of options that would meet what I like, and have a detachable cable so I can get a 4 pin balanced one.

The only interesting headphone is the new sony mdr z7 thats shipping within the next month, but my amp would be overkill for it, and there isnt enough info yet to know if it can match up in resolution and overall quality to an lcd2 fazor. so I dont really want to consider that as an option.

Anybody else have a similar experience with weak bass on a pre-fazor lcd2 from late 2013?

You are not probably going to like this, but I had the exact same experience. My preF LCD2s we're just blah sounding. No definition flappy base like there was a cover over the headphones. I directly compared them to a new set of fazor LCD2s and personally I saw a huge improvement. More 3-D sounding, wider soundstage, more bass, and more definition. Luckily I was able to trade in the old set for the new set for a minimum investment. And I am so glad that I did.

 

[SomeGuyDude]

You are not probably going to like this, but I had the exact same experience. My preF LCD2s we're just blah sounding. No definition flappy base like there was a cover over the headphones. I directly compared them to a new set of fazor LCD2s and personally I saw a huge improvement. More 3-D sounding, wider soundstage, more bass, and more definition. Luckily I was able to trade in the old set for the new set for a minimum investment. And I am so glad that I did.

 
Were those rev1 or rev2?

 

[jjkuz]

   
Were those rev1 or rev2?

 
The old ones were rev2 born on June 5, 2013.  
 
I did do a direct side by side comparison.  Both cables were the standard issue Audeze cables. I did not compare each set of headphones with the exact same set of standard Audeze cables, but both headphones were compared with the standard Audeze cables.

 

[SomeGuyDude]

   
The old ones were rev2 born on June 5, 2013.  
 
I did do a direct side by side comparison.  Both cables were the standard issue Audeze cables. I did not compare each set of headphones with the exact same set of standard Audeze cables, but both headphones were compared with the standard Audeze cables.

 
Huh. Must just be me then, I don't hear a single bit of flab in these. Then again, I like bassy headphones, so perhaps what you're talking about isn't "flab" so much as "more bass" versus "less bass". 

 

[jjkuz]

Here are the response curves
 
PreFazor LCD2s (06/05/13)
 
<a href="http://s240.photobucket.com/user/jjkuz/media/IMG_0942_zps560ad03a.jpg.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff205/jjkuz/IMG_0942_zps560ad03a.jpg" border="0" alt=" photo IMG_0942_zps560ad03a.jpg"/></a>
 
Fazor LCD2s (08/01/14)
 
<a href="http://s240.photobucket.com/user/jjkuz/media/IMG_0947_zpsb884cb6b.jpg.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff205/jjkuz/IMG_0947_zpsb884cb6b.jpg" border="0" alt=" photo IMG_0947_zpsb884cb6b.jpg"/></a>
 
 
Sorry for the links instead of the actual pictures.  How do you post the pictures directly here without a link from photobucket?

 

[SomeGuyDude]

That's not "flab" they just yanked out everything 30Hz and below and lifted the high end. That's why it sounds "tighter" to you. Personally I'm very, very glad they left it in on mine because I like a warmer headphone. 
 
I've said this a million times, people just interpret lifted bass as "flabby" and "loose". No one, in my years on Head-Fi, has been able to point to a headphone with pronounced bass that does it with "quality". There is a constantly claimed inverse relationship between quality and quantity on bass, where the less there is the "better" people say it sounds.
 
No, the LCD-2 does bass really damn well in all cases, they just pulled it back for the fazor model and that hits some people's ears a lot better. Which is awesome for people who like that sound. I don't. 

 

[TMRaven]

he-400.

 

[x RELIC x]

...............

EDIT: The only downside is that the damn things are exposing a lot more flaws in albums than I was ready for. :mad:

Agreed. So many nuances were hidden to me before I purchased the LCD-2 which was good, but on the flip side I had to 'clean' my library with better recordings (if I could find them) and better rips. This also sent me on a journey to listen to new music that was well mastered. I'm grateful for that as I may not have had the same desire to listen to certain music otherwise.

It doesn't stop there though. Next comes the source player, then better amps, then even better headphones, and better DACs, and amps, and so on........... Damn, I used to spend most of the money elsewhere, but then head fi comes along and BAM! empty wallet. It has slowed down for me with the XC and the rest of my gear, but I fear the day that something new catches my eye because I know I'm an addict of audio.

 

[sling5s]

I had  the very first LCD-2 rev.1 with Lyr for a long time.  Now that had bass.  Not lose or flabby but very dense and heavy bass impact.
Now I have the LCD-2 Fazor with Lyr 2.  Both the LCD-2 and Lyr being revised makes a huge difference in the way the bass in presented now.
It's a little more faster and lighter with better bass definition quality but much less bass quantity. 

 

[Lohb]

   
I hope I didn't miss anything, but these are most of the changes that I am familiar with.  There were some changes I didn't mention to the rev 1 grills, but I have never seen a pair with the original grills for sale here.

There is a pair on ebay with the original L+R grills right now. The seller was saying those were best sounding to him after owning multiple revisions...it is a pre-revision 1 (?)...first issue ?
Grill is almost like mine... Audez'e spelling but with the L+R in the center which I don't have.
 
EDIT : I also think Audirvana + on Integer Mode 1 shores up some of the 2.1 downpoints...imaging/separation/soundstage....as that is what that filter setting specifically boosts/targets according to the new A+ 2.0 manual.

 

[haejuk]

I could be wrong, but I am fairly certain that those L/R grills were changed to the current grills sometime during the rev 1 driver's lifespan.  To my knowledge there were no driver changes before rev 1.  I can't find the pair you mentioned on ebay.  I googled LCD-1 to see if it looked anything like the LCD-2, as I was curious if the L/R grill was perhaps carried over from that model, and I found a surprisingly different looking headphone!