An exploration of Chord DAVE, MScaler, Qutest, and Holo May, HQPlayer
Mar 30, 2022 at 8:17 PM Post #1,111 of 1,492
Hey @Roasty, sorry I read this when you posted a couple of week, then one of my darling kids gave me COVID, which was fun but if you are still interested: After finally settling back on the May KTE, after excursions with the Mola Mola and musetec, i've been furiously demo'ing preamps of colours and sizes some with headamp stages and some without. Long story short i concur with Goldensounds review, the serene is astonishing in performance and consequently value for money. Technically i've not heard better without getting up to the £15K, the bass definition is stunning, stereo image, placement, layering all exceptional. I would say it has a hint of warmth which gives it a much more natural sound than the surgical and comparitively compressed HPA4, but its not warmth like you get with PASS, which for my preference is a bit much.

I'm listening via my 2 channel set up quite a bit at the moment, but i have to make mention of how good the Utopia's sound with it. Prior to the serene i spent a happy 6 weeks with the OOR/Hypsos, the highlight of which, was the extra width they added to the Utopia's stage, as good as any tube amp i've tried, but the serene is on another level. You get the same wide staging, but its a fair more neutral linear affair than the ferrum which has the odd bump here and there, but the detail retrieval is improved as is tonal clarity is amazing, making tone almost three dimensional.

God, i love the Utopias, no matter how high i raise the bar with partnering kit, they just show me they have 6th and 7th then etc gear. The bass quantity and definition, driving dynamism and speed, listening the Focals with with Serene is hands down best i've heard. I've been listening to this slightly retro but beautifully produced IDM/ techno album by itallian producer Passarani...



and this analogue IDM 80s synth-fest by Biosphere



And just WOW, the May-Serene-Utopia combo, is just well WOW says it.

As for May v Mola Mola v Musetec. The Tambaqui isnt even at races and looks with hindsight a poor value proposition and i preferred that to bartok and DAVE (each for different reasons). The Musetec is now in my workshop and technically its superb in terms, but it cant match the all round peformance of the May which is better technically and has the natural yet holographic staging and natural realism that i've not heard elsewhere. I've read people say it can be a bit soft, but i dont hear this at all, i find driving, dynamic, with a real snap and thwack when the recording calls for it.

This is me done for a while at least it is on the preamp/headamp, DAC, HP'front.. that is until Focal make the announcement we're all waiting for!

So there's my rambling stream of consciousness attempt to answer to your questions :):)


hey dude thanks for taking the time to reply! appreciate all the information you offered. from how you've described the Serene, it kind of makes me regret not getting it when i had the chance to. i'm now using a tube pre (and i love it!) but it cost almost double the Serene, so chances are, I wont be blind buying the Serene and hoping it bests the current pre i'm using. Will be looking into sourcing a local unit for demo before i decide to commit.

i've only tried the Pass Labs INT60 amp, but yes you're right, perhaps the Pass labs house sound, but it is indeed a warm sounding amp; it was really pleasant, alluring and romantic during the initial listen, but as time went on, it sounded just a bit over the top in smoothening things out, to the point of some boredom creeping in. the HPA4 was a bit of a disappointment for me; it was my first "TOTL" headphone amp, and it felt like i paid top dollar for a supposed feat of engineering, but somehow i felt there was a massive discordance between the neutral/clinical delivery and enjoyment that i was hoping to get out of it.

The Ferrum Oor/Hypsos combo is actually on my radar. I managed to find a really good deal for the combo and all that is left is just going down to pay for it. I'm thinking, between the Ferrum stack and the Serene, the Ferrum stack may be a better overall use for the money (?). It'll be able to drive everything I own, as opposed to the Serene which would require a power amp for the more demanding hps (and then desktop/rack real estate takes another big hit). Did you end up selling the Ferrum stack then?

The May KTE is end game for me (for now).. the only other dac i really want to try is the Rockna Wavedream. based on what Goldensounds has said about it, i'm thinking it may be right up my alley. My only issue with the May KTE is that I cant use both XLR and RCA out at the same time; i've tried it with a few components, and whenever I have both XLR and RCA connections in use at the same time, SQ takes a hit, and i get some audible distortion and sibilance which is really noticeable with vocals and quieter music.
 
Mar 31, 2022 at 4:29 AM Post #1,112 of 1,492
hey dude thanks for taking the time to reply! appreciate all the information you offered. from how you've described the Serene, it kind of makes me regret not getting it when i had the chance to. i'm now using a tube pre (and i love it!) but it cost almost double the Serene, so chances are, I wont be blind buying the Serene and hoping it bests the current pre i'm using. Will be looking into sourcing a local unit for demo before i decide to commit.

i've only tried the Pass Labs INT60 amp, but yes you're right, perhaps the Pass labs house sound, but it is indeed a warm sounding amp; it was really pleasant, alluring and romantic during the initial listen, but as time went on, it sounded just a bit over the top in smoothening things out, to the point of some boredom creeping in. the HPA4 was a bit of a disappointment for me; it was my first "TOTL" headphone amp, and it felt like i paid top dollar for a supposed feat of engineering, but somehow i felt there was a massive discordance between the neutral/clinical delivery and enjoyment that i was hoping to get out of it.

The Ferrum Oor/Hypsos combo is actually on my radar. I managed to find a really good deal for the combo and all that is left is just going down to pay for it. I'm thinking, between the Ferrum stack and the Serene, the Ferrum stack may be a better overall use for the money (?). It'll be able to drive everything I own, as opposed to the Serene which would require a power amp for the more demanding hps (and then desktop/rack real estate takes another big hit). Did you end up selling the Ferrum stack then?

The May KTE is end game for me (for now).. the only other dac i really want to try is the Rockna Wavedream. based on what Goldensounds has said about it, i'm thinking it may be right up my alley. My only issue with the May KTE is that I cant use both XLR and RCA out at the same time; i've tried it with a few components, and whenever I have both XLR and RCA connections in use at the same time, SQ takes a hit, and i get some audible distortion and sibilance which is really noticeable with vocals and quieter music.
That issue when using both outputs should not be occurring.

Are all your components properly grounded? (And do your cables have the ground and shield properly terminated at both ends? Some 'audiophile' cables unfortunately only terminate at one side and even some just leave them floating!)
 
Mar 31, 2022 at 4:50 AM Post #1,113 of 1,492
That issue when using both outputs should not be occurring.

Are all your components properly grounded? (And do your cables have the ground and shield properly terminated at both ends? Some 'audiophile' cables unfortunately only terminate at one side and even some just leave them floating!)

i had a suspicion it was due to grounding. have tried it with different cords, interconnects, and amps but the issue does not go away. anyways i have pretty much stopped using both outputs together, mainly because i've used up my rack space with larger gear and i dont have room for a second amp anymore, so i guess the issue is indirectly "solved"..
 
Mar 31, 2022 at 7:13 AM Post #1,114 of 1,492
My only issue with the May KTE is that I cant use both XLR and RCA out at the same time; i've tried it with a few components, and whenever I have both XLR and RCA connections in use at the same time, SQ takes a hit, and i get some audible distortion and sibilance which is really noticeable with vocals and quieter music.
Sibilance with added distortions indicate oscilations of the output stage triggered by the added capacitance. It wouldn't happen if the May had non-feedback output buffers instead of standard opamps. It is abnormal and dangerous, can damage tweeters in speakers. This unit definitely needs a service, over the time it can get worse.
 
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Mar 31, 2022 at 8:53 AM Post #1,115 of 1,492
Sibilance with added distortions indicate oscilations of the output stage triggered by the added capacitance. It wouldn't happen if the May had non-feedback output buffers instead of standard opamps. It is abnormal and dangerous, can damage tweeters in speakers. This unit definitely needs a service, over the time it can get worse.
We're well aware of how much you despise the holo products.
But this is not true, and they do not have an opamp based output stage
 
Mar 31, 2022 at 9:40 AM Post #1,116 of 1,492
We're well aware of how much you despise the holo products.
But this is not true, and they do not have an opamp based output stage
You always take a bite when you have an occasion to make derogatory comments in support of your absolute wisdom.

Discrete output stage (even if advertised no opamps which I doubt) can also oscilate if open loop gain is extensive. I prefer non-feedback output stage, it is true and a reason of mentioning opamps in first place. Your comment is nothing more than another smearing campain we have seen over and over again. This is because what you say specifically doesn't change a fact that this particular unit is defective. Now, while the user knows about, I have no pleasure to continue discussion with you.
 
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Mar 31, 2022 at 9:56 AM Post #1,117 of 1,492
i had a suspicion it was due to grounding. have tried it with different cords, interconnects, and amps but the issue does not go away. anyways i have pretty much stopped using both outputs together, mainly because i've used up my rack space with larger gear and i dont have room for a second amp anymore, so i guess the issue is indirectly "solved"..
Does it occur when you're using two solid state devices or only when using the evo400?

It could potentially be due to one of the devices being a tube amp and potentially having transformer coupled inputs?
 
Mar 31, 2022 at 9:57 AM Post #1,118 of 1,492
You always take a bite when you have an occasion to make derogatory comments in support of your absolute wisdom.

Discrete output stage (even if advertised no opamps which I doubt) can also oscilate if open loop gain is extensive. I prefer non-feedback output stage, it is true and a reason of mentioning opamps in first place. Your comment is nothing more than another smearing campain we have seen over and over again. This is because what you say specifically doesn't change a fact that this particular unit is defective. Now, while the user knows about, I have no pleasure to continue discussion with you.
Look in the mirror... the gall... you have been "smearing" Holo audio from day one...
 
Mar 31, 2022 at 10:41 AM Post #1,119 of 1,492
Look in the mirror... the gall... you have been "smearing" Holo audio from day one...
Not a mirror pal, I am different. I am not a person who is unable to start discussion without making derogative comments on others.

Regarding Holo Audio, I am posting the truth. They lie about NOS, it can be more lies. Oscilations are bad things. In such expensive equipment I expect no-feedback amp. It would be no oscilations, even if defective, no way.
 
Mar 31, 2022 at 3:42 PM Post #1,120 of 1,492
Src-dx could definitely help.

I had all sorts of problems with hqplayer + qutest.

I have an src-dx on the way and a Dave/mscaler here currently so will see if it helps things
It looks like it's a Roon problem (used as server and client on the same gaming pc). I'm getting much worse on both optical and usb, with no HQplayer in use. I'll test some more when i get back home. And yes, i travel with my Dave :p
 
Apr 2, 2022 at 4:20 PM Post #1,121 of 1,492
It looks like it's a Roon problem (used as server and client on the same gaming pc). I'm getting much worse on both optical and usb, with no HQplayer in use. I'll test some more when i get back home. And yes, i travel with my Dave :p
I have no idea what's happening, but i just got home and my core Roon will just crash on startup after lagging terribly for a few seconds. Reinstalled it and it's even worse. Running it on another gaming pc with a 12700k cpu. I thought maybe it doesn't like the E-cores so i used process lasso to only use the P-cores, but no change. I was going to upgrade to windows 11 but i fear it might be even worse.
At least i got a solid 3 months out of my lifetime subscription :beyersmile:
 
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Apr 2, 2022 at 9:03 PM Post #1,122 of 1,492
hey dude thanks for taking the time to reply! appreciate all the information you offered. from how you've described the Serene, it kind of makes me regret not getting it when i had the chance to. i'm now using a tube pre (and i love it!) but it cost almost double the Serene, so chances are, I wont be blind buying the Serene and hoping it bests the current pre i'm using. Will be looking into sourcing a local unit for demo before i decide to commit.

i've only tried the Pass Labs INT60 amp, but yes you're right, perhaps the Pass labs house sound, but it is indeed a warm sounding amp; it was really pleasant, alluring and romantic during the initial listen, but as time went on, it sounded just a bit over the top in smoothening things out, to the point of some boredom creeping in. the HPA4 was a bit of a disappointment for me; it was my first "TOTL" headphone amp, and it felt like i paid top dollar for a supposed feat of engineering, but somehow i felt there was a massive discordance between the neutral/clinical delivery and enjoyment that i was hoping to get out of it.

The Ferrum Oor/Hypsos combo is actually on my radar. I managed to find a really good deal for the combo and all that is left is just going down to pay for it. I'm thinking, between the Ferrum stack and the Serene, the Ferrum stack may be a better overall use for the money (?). It'll be able to drive everything I own, as opposed to the Serene which would require a power amp for the more demanding hps (and then desktop/rack real estate takes another big hit). Did you end up selling the Ferrum stack then?

The May KTE is end game for me (for now).. the only other dac i really want to try is the Rockna Wavedream. based on what Goldensounds has said about it, i'm thinking it may be right up my alley. My only issue with the May KTE is that I cant use both XLR and RCA out at the same time; i've tried it with a few components, and whenever I have both XLR and RCA connections in use at the same time, SQ takes a hit, and i get some audible distortion and sibilance which is really noticeable with vocals and quieter music.
Hi. You mentioned the may kte is your current end game.

am i right to remember that you also demoed the sonnet morpheus If so, how would you compare the two.
if not, my mistake
cheers
 
Apr 3, 2022 at 9:54 AM Post #1,123 of 1,492
Hi. You mentioned the may kte is your current end game.

am i right to remember that you also demoed the sonnet morpheus If so, how would you compare the two.
if not, my mistake
cheers

Yep I did have the sonnet morpheus with me for a while. it sounded a bit soft and flat via USB input, but was much much better with i2s and aes/ebu via a Singxer su-6. overall it is an enjoyable listen, and what really stands out is its really clean and black background. but I still think the May KTE is hard to beat; seemed a bit more immediate and I felt it bested the Morpheus in macrodynamics and staging. Morpheus comes a bit closer to my Rockna Wavelight; slight low end looseness and bloom and a bit less sharpness in the highs. perhaps more of a r2r sound than what the May offers.

Pasithea is still on my want to try list. but tbh unlikely to purchase either Pasithea/Morpheus as I'm not a big fan of the aesthetic.. (sorry a bit shallow there).
 
Apr 3, 2022 at 10:01 AM Post #1,124 of 1,492
Yep I did have the sonnet morpheus with me for a while. it sounded a bit soft and flat via USB input, but was much much better with i2s and aes/ebu via a Singxer su-6. overall it is an enjoyable listen, and what really stands out is its really clean and black background. but I still think the May KTE is hard to beat; seemed a bit more immediate and I felt it bested the Morpheus in macrodynamics and staging. Morpheus comes a bit closer to my Rockna Wavelight; slight low end looseness and bloom and a bit less sharpness in the highs. perhaps more of a r2r sound than what the May offers.

Pasithea is still on my want to try list. but tbh unlikely to purchase either Pasithea/Morpheus as I'm not a big fan of the aesthetic.. (sorry a bit shallow there).
I have the may kte and have found the stage width one of its best points. Wide (not overly so) and well/evenly spread

thanks
 
Apr 3, 2022 at 1:42 PM Post #1,125 of 1,492
I have no idea what's happening, but i just got home and my core Roon will just crash on startup after lagging terribly for a few seconds. Reinstalled it and it's even worse. Running it on another gaming pc with a 12700k cpu. I thought maybe it doesn't like the E-cores so i used process lasso to only use the P-cores, but no change. I was going to upgrade to windows 11 but i fear it might be even worse.
At least i got a solid 3 months out of my lifetime subscription :beyersmile:
It looks like it was the Chord Asio 1.05 driver that is totaling Roon and it's only fixed with a restart. All is good now and Hqplayer actually sounds pretty good. I wouldn't say it bests the M-scaler just yet though, but @GoldenOne 's suggestion of using 18 bits as a setting has helped.
Any suggestions for USB streamer/DDC or filter? I am also curios, do USB reclockers even make sense? So many people swear by the Innuos Phoenix, but I just can't find the reason why it would help.
 

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