[kwkarth]

Quote:

Thanks for the kind words. I'm still pretty new to the Decware Mini-Torii, and so I'm not ready to do in-depth comparisons between it and the Meier Concerto, and they are different fish anyway.  (I don't think you can op-amp roll the Concerto, but I am not certain).
 
The Mini-torii has a lot of power on tap - and it's a tube amp designed for loads like the LCD-2.  The pairing is quite synergistic.  However, an amp like the Concerto will drive a wider variety of headphones well, and is half the price of the Mini-torii - strong considerations there!  I really think of the WooAudio WA6 as being the tube equivalent to the Concerto for driving the LCD-2 - same price range, and works with a very wide variety of cans.  The Mini-Torii is a very fine amp, but it's a speaker-amp adapted for use with a certain kind of headphone.
 
Lastly, I have to comment that I simply cannot imagine finding the Leben ugly

 
Cheers.

Just a brief comment regarding amps in the class of the Concerto...
 
Real uncompressed music is far more dynamic than most people realize.  While half a watt is far more than one needs for steady state listening, it is easy to exceed even that power level on dynamic peaks, if one truly wants a "you are there" experience.  Amps used with the LCD-2 should be able to deliver at least a solid 2 Watts on those peaks if you truly want to experience that sense of effortless ease and expansiveness in your music.
 
Many people who listen to the LCD-2s on amps like a stock WA6, hear what they misinterpret as sibilance or other very minor transient distortions, and are actually hearing the amp clip, and not at exceedingly high levels either.  Of course YMMV, but that's been my experience and my 2¢ worth.
 

 

[vilasn]

TigzStudio,
 
Are you using A-GD Ref5 with V181?
 
Thanks.
 

 

[TigzStudio]

Yep, but I also have an Antelope Audio Zodiac+ incoming....will be interesting to see which sounds better to my ears.  The Zodiac+ has been compared to some Weiss dacs, some people saying they preffered it over them.  Another guy preffered it over the w4s dac2.  We shall see, the 6moons review is taking forever to be written up as well.  
 
Quote:

TigzStudio,
 
Are you using A-GD Ref5 with V181?
 
Thanks.
 

 

[Solude]

Quote:

Just a brief comment regarding amps in the class of the Concerto...  
Real uncompressed music is far more dynamic than most people realize
 

  This depends a lot on the type of music you listen to.  Modern recordings of rock, metal, alternative have next to no dynamic range.  They are recorded as a wall of sound so an average of 80dB translate into peaks of 86dB at the most.  When I had the Concerto, with the HE-5LE, I used low gain and listened at ~11 o'clock.  Now the LCD-2 gets to 90dB with 120mV, nowhere near the cap of the WA6 or Concerto.

 

[Frank I]

 
Quote:

Just a brief comment regarding amps in the class of the Concerto...
 
Real uncompressed music is far more dynamic than most people realize.  While half a watt is far more than one needs for steady state listening, it is easy to exceed even that power level on dynamic peaks, if one truly wants a "you are there" experience.  Amps used with the LCD-2 should be able to deliver at least a solid 2 Watts on those peaks if you truly want to experience that sense of effortless ease and expansiveness in your music.
 
Many people who listen to the LCD-2s on amps like a stock WA6, hear what they misinterpret as sibilance or other very minor transient distortions, and are actually hearing the amp clip, and not at exceedingly high levels either.  Of course YMMV, but that's been my experience and my 2¢ worth.
 

So which would be the perfect amp then in your opinion. PS Audio amp puts out 1.7W

 

[kwkarth]

Quote:

  This depends a lot on the type of music you listen to.  Modern recordings of rock, metal, alternative have next to no dynamic range.  They are recorded as a wall of sound so an average of 80dB translate into peaks of 86dB at the most.  When I had the Concerto, with the HE-5LE, I used low gain and listened at ~11 o'clock.  Now the LCD-2 gets to 90dB with 120mV, nowhere near the cap of the WA6 or Concerto.

As long as that works for you!  

 

 

[Skylab]

 
Quote:

Just a brief comment regarding amps in the class of the Concerto...
 
Real uncompressed music is far more dynamic than most people realize.  While half a watt is far more than one needs for steady state listening, it is easy to exceed even that power level on dynamic peaks, if one truly wants a "you are there" experience.  Amps used with the LCD-2 should be able to deliver at least a solid 2 Watts on those peaks if you truly want to experience that sense of effortless ease and expansiveness in your music.
 
Many people who listen to the LCD-2s on amps like a stock WA6, hear what they misinterpret as sibilance or other very minor transient distortions, and are actually hearing the amp clip, and not at exceedingly high levels either.  Of course YMMV, but that's been my experience and my 2¢ worth.
 

Indeed, that may be the reason that the Leben and the Mini-torii sound better to me with the LCD-2.  Lots and lots of power.

 

[kwkarth]

Quote:

So which would be the perfect amp then in your opinion. PS Audio amp puts out 1.7W

I don't know that I've settled on the "perfect" amp yet.  Still looking.  Like the Cavali Liquids so far...  
 

 

[vilasn]

Quote:

Yep, but I also have an Antelope Audio Zodiac+ incoming....will be interesting to see which sounds better to my ears.  The Zodiac+ has been compared to some Weiss dacs, some people saying they preffered it over them.  Another guy preffered it over the w4s dac2.  We shall see, the 6moons review is taking forever to be written up as well.  
 

 

Hey,
 
Another question, which do you recommend A-GD Roc or V181?
 
Thanks.

 

[grokit]

 
Quote:

Many people who listen to the LCD-2s on amps like a stock WA6, hear what they misinterpret as sibilance or other very minor transient distortions, and are actually hearing the amp clip, and not at exceedingly high levels either.  Of course YMMV, but that's been my experience and my 2¢ worth.

I agree and would say that the complaints of sibilance with the original HE-5 could be attributed to the same factor, as the HE-5 is even harder to drive properly than the LCD2.

 

[TigzStudio]

With the LCD-2's and my Ref5 I chose the v181 over the Roc.  The Roc is still excellent as you can tweak the bias settings to your liking....I basically tweaked it to get the most natural vocals and instruments I could.   For some reason the v181 was able to give me that "magic", where you can listen forever without analyzing every single song.  Some people might think this leads to a belief that the v181 is imparting some kind of signature to everything, but I don't really feel this way.  I can immediately tell the exact recording quality of everything I listen to, yet, the crappy stuff still has that bit of music magic to enjoy it.  Everything just sounds so real and lifelike, you still hear all the nuance and detail as well.  It has a dead quiet background, you will hear every last decay in the recording.  All my impressions are based from balanced acss ref5->Roc->4-pin balanced lcd-2s vs. balanced xlr->v181->4-pin balanced lcd-2s.  One other amp I am interested in hearing is the Goldpoint Headphone Pro, supposed to sound "like reality" w/lcd-2's according to a head-fier.  I was going to order it to compare to the v181, but I went for a different source to play with first.  I am completely satisfied with my v181.  
 

Hey,
 
Another question, which do you recommend A-GD Roc or V181?
 
Thanks.

 

[Bojamijams]

Well another big difference is that you're also comparing ACSS to XLR with your setup.  You should try XLR Roc vs XLR v181 for a true comparison.  ACSS is more 'neutral' then XLR.
 
Quote:

With the LCD-2's and my Ref5 I chose the v181 over the Roc.  The Roc is still excellent as you can tweak the bias settings to your liking....I basically tweaked it to get the most natural vocals and instruments I could.   For some reason the v181 was able to give me that "magic", where you can listen forever without analyzing every single song.  Some people might think this leads to a belief that the v181 is imparting some kind of signature to everything, but I don't really feel this way.  I can immediately tell the exact recording quality of everything I listen to, yet, the crappy stuff still has that bit of music magic to enjoy it.  Everything just sounds so real and lifelike, you still hear all the nuance and detail as well.  It has a dead quiet background, you will hear every last decay in the recording.  All my impressions are based from balanced acss ref5->Roc->4-pin balanced lcd-2s vs. balanced xlr->v181->4-pin balanced lcd-2s.  One other amp I am interested in hearing is the Goldpoint Headphone Pro, supposed to sound "like reality" w/lcd-2's according to a head-fier.  I was going to order it to compare to the v181, but I went for a different source to play with first.  I am completely satisfied with my v181.  
 

 

 

[Nigel Goddard]

Quote:

Well...of the amps I own, the best was the Leben CS300X.  The Leben and the LCD-2 together are HEAVENLY.
Next best was the Meier Concerto - which was also excellent with the LCD-2 (and is solid state, unlike the Leben...and also 1/4 the price of the Leben...)

Quote:

Indeed, that may be the reason that the Leben and the Mini-torii sound better to me with the LCD-2.  Lots and lots of power.

 
Sorry to dwell on this, Skylab, but could you please express the way(s) in which the Mini Torii has displaced the Concerto for second place?
 
Would you say it's a tube vs SS presentation thing - where, blindfolded, one could identify which is which?
Would you say one's more truthful, or more tasteful? - I can see why head-fiers have such large inventories!
 
Perhaps I should just ask Mr Hyodo for a silver faceplate
 
Many thanks in advance, to you all.
Nigel


 

 

[dallan]

Quote:

 I am completely satisfied with my v181.  
 

 

Glad that you are enjoying the v181 but I am a bit confused.  Unless you are stuck on balanced systems, why did you get the V181 which is based on a lower model(v100) instead of the reference model V200?  I read earlier in this thread that the LCD2 is more dependent on the actual amp than whether or not that it is balanced.  Many people who ordered the V100 upgraded because of the significant difference between models.  In addition, I have heard that there is a V200 balanced model that will eventually(key word) be released too.  
 
Violectric did surprise me and i understand from your posts that  the v181 is a good amp as well.  The only reason i bring it up is because I was going to get the v100 originally and did extensive research on it.  The specs put the two amps(100/200) close but the actual sound difference is supposed to be dramatic.  When i saw the v181 considered it until i found out that it was just a balanced version of the lower tier amp that I had just decided against.
 
When i saw you got this i bit my tongue but maybe i missed something and there was an upgrade in the v181 or you just really wanted balance, which is good too.

 
If i go balanced I intend on doing the Violectric route with the next release, i really love the sound signature- not as stark as my Zana Duex with higher impedance phones but more tolerable and sweet, some would call it more musical and it works well with all headphones.

 

[grokit]

Once you go balanced you never go back lol