[Oscar-HiFi]

Just briefly but I’ve compared E2000 to E3000 at Yodobashi Camera today.
First time for me to directly listen to the both at once. (Have heard E2000 at final showroom and bought E3000 online)

E2000: Focused on vocals and mid-bass. Bit brighter than E3000 and slimmer sound. Younger sound maybe targeted for mass (non-audiophile) users.
E3000: Vocals goes bit distant compared to E2000, which means it might sound more spacious. Maybe more sub-bass and dense overall sound. Much modest warmer vocal but has somewhat more resolution in treble. Sound signature more like expensive audio system or TOTL headphones. Well balanced but still having final house sound transparent mids. I think it is a nice entry for audiophile sound signature taste in really affordable price (5,480 yen and 548 point (yen equivalent coupon given after purchase) in many shops, which means virtually under 5,000 yen.)

Before comparing them, I thought I might buy E2000, but after comparison audition I didn’t. Just wasn’t my taste.

From my memory difference between E3000 and E2000 is bigger than that of Sonorous III and Sonorous II (I auditioned them for ten days at my house).

Short comparison done using following tunes in ALAC by HF Player on iPhone 6 Plus + Mojo.
Masahiro Arita: Bach flute sonata in C BWV1033 1st mov. (His 3rd recording played by modern flute "Helmuth Hammig" in grey jacket album)
BABYMETAL: Akatsuki (heavy metal with female vocal starting with electric guitar solo)

I definitely preferred E3000 over E2000 for both tunes.
Really well balanced sound.

As I wrote before, sound signature of E3000 is like a mini-mini ETHER Flow. (yes, quality is apparently different but overall feeling reminds me of ETHER Flow compared on Mjolnir 2)


You can see many reviews retweeted by final staff’s twitter though they are in Japanese.
https://twitter.com/final_staff

I completely agree with your comparison between the two, and also preferred the E3000.

 

[nogi replicant]

I just ordered the last set of Lab 2's in Australia. I should have them delivered on Tuesday. I look forward to hearing their sound, I want something to compliment my Zeus XR Adel and not replace it, which I think the Lab 2 should achieve. I previously owned the Lab 1 and thought they were incredible so hopefully it's younger sibling has a similar impression on me. I love the fit of the PF's and nearly bought the PF IX a while back.

 

[jwbrent]

I just ordered the last set of Lab 2's in Australia. I should have them delivered on Tuesday. I look forward to hearing their sound, I want something to compliment my Zeus XR Adel and not replace it, which I think the Lab 2 should achieve. I previously owned the Lab 1 and thought they were incredible so hopefully it's younger sibling has a similar impression on me. I love the fit of the PF's and nearly bought the PF IX a while back.

Congratulations on your acquisition, I'm envious.

 

[VoodooSamurai]

What kind of plug do the sonorous line of headphones use? I want to get a cheap replacement cable.

 

[ninaraduga]

I just ordered the last set of Lab 2's in Australia. I should have them delivered on Tuesday. I look forward to hearing their sound, I want something to compliment my Zeus XR Adel and not replace it, which I think the Lab 2 should achieve. I previously owned the Lab 1 and thought they were incredible so hopefully it's younger sibling has a similar impression on me. I love the fit of the PF's and nearly bought the PF IX a while back.

Do not forget to give them a long burn!

 

[bidn]

hi bidn

the final audio is a copper cable (ofc) that is silver coated, the one i mentioned has a solid silver core (norne therium). the change is not big and i like the final audio cable better. the balanced cable has a minor effect with the lab ii, the soundstage is a tad better defined. it's a very small change vs other earphones driven balanced, the silver core cable changes the sound a lot more vs the balanced cable. i'm not a big fan of changing the cables, the lab is perfect machted/tuned with the orgnial cable. if you wan't the last details with the lab ii go for a solid silver litz cable but you also loose this wide soundstage. the soundstage get's better in a technical sense but is not as nice matched with the character of the lab ii.

Thank your very, very useful to know!

 

[bidn]

... I guess that because the PF go in the ear they are much more stable and good enough to use for home listening, but from images I have seen there appear to be different ways these end up sitting in your ear depending on the ear shape.

Their very elongated ending allows to put them very deep in one's ear, and it also Final's recommendation, and gives them a more stable fit.
However on some images some people don't wear them deep in their ear, hence the different ways.

 

[bidn]

Bidn, I have been listening to my Lab 2 for the past few months now and I do not notice any change across different sources. As I posted the frequency chart previously there is a slight slope on the low frequency down to 20 Hz. The decline is not big or sharp may be around 8 db or so making the sub bass not so pronounce. Some of the previous complaints or criticism of the Lab 2 is that there is no sub bass and I disagree with that assessment as proved by the frequency chart (post #7113) as well as my own testing using HDtracks Hifi test file and the Lab 2 is able to play audible file at 20 Hz even though at that frequency it is more a rumbling feel than sound but it is clearly there. The question to me is not whether the Lab 2 is capable to going down to 20 Hz, because it can. The question is whether one finds the Lab 2 produced enough sub bass to his liking but that is a personal preference thing that is different for each person individually. As long as the Lab 2 is capable of making down to 20 Hz, people can adjust the quantity of sub bass using eq to their liking. Personally I am happy as is with the Lab 2 as I can hear every bass frequency there is on the recording. To me it is the quality of the bass (the resolution, the layering, the tightness etc) of the bass that is more important to me that how much and the Lab 2 seems to have all that.

Dear Jalo and Rumina,

Jalo, I agree with you that for me the quality of the bass is definitely more important (but if you excuse me, not on interpreting the decrease of many dB on the frequency chart).

Rumina, like you I listen at low volume. Yet this cannot be the reason for the difference of perception between you LAB II and mine, Jalo, because I do hear at the same reference level at lower frequency than my LAB II with other earphones and headphones.

Jalo, Rumina, and anyone interested (if realistically possible),
what do you think about exchanging some audio test files?
(i.e. I make mine available to you and you make yours available to me)

Mine are between 500-600 kB per file (a flac file per test frequency: 100 Hz, 63, 45, 32, 20 Hz), meant for pro testing by the test lab of the reference German magazine Audio.
The only thing is that the reference level voice (announcing the frequency) is in German, but that does not matter because when I ripped the CD I put the frequency in the file name, and the point of the voice is to make sure you have the same volume and compare to the same volume reference for each test signal.

Do you know if there is a way for exchanging files here (by PM ?)

Thank you again to both of you for having made me discover and buy the LAB II before it was sold out .

 

[bidn]

I have a quick question for those that have the lab 2. During changing cables and when the cables are off the earpieces is there a way to identify left and right piece?

I am repeating the answer (to the same question by me, maybe 2 months ago) from Rumina : if you look closely at the transparent plastic tube ( sleeve) near the beginning of the cable, one (and only one of the two) has a little (the diameter may be about 1 mm) dot carved out in the plastic. Final have a picture of this on their site and Rumina put this picture when answering.

 

[bidn]

I just ordered the last set of Lab 2's in Australia. I should have them delivered on Tuesday. I look forward to hearing their sound, I want something to compliment my Zeus XR Adel and not replace it, which I think the Lab 2 should achieve. I previously owned the Lab 1 and thought they were incredible so hopefully it's younger sibling has a similar impression on me. I love the fit of the PF's and nearly bought the PF IX a while back.

Welcome, nogi replicant, to the microscopic "cult" of LAB II owners !
I don't have the LAB I, but the main shortcoming of my FI-BA-SS is a really too narrow soundstage.
so maybe going from the LAB I to the II may hugely immensely widen the soundstage.

 

[Wyville]

Their very elongated ending allows to put them very deep in one's ear, and it also Final's recommendation, and gives them a more stable fit.
However on some images some people don't wear them deep in their ear, hence the different ways.

Thanks! The PF are high on my list of options to reduce the pressure issues I have been dealing with and I assume they will work well for classical music (it seems they are designed for it) which is what I listen to most. Will still need to find a place in London where I can try them.

 

[nogi replicant]

Welcome, nogi replicant, to the microscopic "cult" of LAB II owners !
I don't have the LAB I, but the main shortcoming of my FI-BA-SS is a really too narrow soundstage.
so maybe going from the LAB I to the II may hugely immensely widen the soundstage.

Hi, thanks. They were delivered this morning.

I have listened to them a little throughout the day, some very engaging moments, however I am thinking they do need some burn in to smoothen out a little and stretch their legs. Did you notice improvements with burn in? of course I also need some brain burn too.

I sold the Lab 1 atleast 18 months or so ago so it is difficult to compare the soundstage size but these are much brighter. My current iem's are EE Zeus XR Adel which have a monstrous soundstage and incredible imaging so without burn in of the Lab ii the Zeus XRA stage feels larger.

The lab ii are aesthetically gorgeous and lovely to touch. I love the box and the packaging as well, some nice Final opulance. The box isn't practical for travel but I think it is awesome for home, which I think Iwill limit these to as I have found out today that my office is a little too noisy to really enjoy these properly.

I am a little suprised at the lack of fanfare on Head Fi re the Lab ii. Back when the Lab 1 were released the forum was very busy and it seemed like every man and his dog was scrambling to get one.

 

[rumina]

Dear Jalo and Rumina,

Jalo, I agree with you that for me the quality of the bass is definitely more important (but if you excuse me, not on interpreting the decrease of many dB on the frequency chart).

Rumina, like you I listen at low volume. Yet this cannot be the reason for the difference of perception between you LAB II and mine, Jalo, because I do hear at the same reference level at lower frequency than my LAB II with other earphones and headphones.

Jalo, Rumina, and anyone interested (if realistically possible),
what do you think about exchanging some audio test files?
(i.e. I make mine available to you and you make yours available to me)

Mine are between 500-600 kB per file (a flac file per test frequency: 100 Hz, 63, 45, 32, 20 Hz), meant for pro testing by the test lab of the reference German magazine Audio.
The only thing is that the reference level voice (announcing the frequency) is in German, but that does not matter because when I ripped the CD I put the frequency in the file name, and the point of the voice is to make sure you have the same volume and compare to the same volume reference for each test signal.

Do you know if there is a way for exchanging files here (by PM ?)

Thank you again to both of you for having made me discover and buy the LAB II before it was sold out .

hi bidn

i think the exchange of files via pm is limited to some filetypes here, i couldn't exchange a rar file. i think a free hoster or email would be the best.

i think the form of the ear chanel is also a big factor with the lab ii. the acoustics short circuit plays a big role with deeper frequencys (http://www.visaton.com/en/lexikon/A/3.html). higher frequencys act like a beam, lowering the frequency opens the beam till the bass is acting like a ballon (for dynamic drivers). their you have the problem with the acoustics short circuit, the trumpets in the lab ii try to prohibt this (and they do great). if the sealing in the ear chaneel is more open maybe due a oval shape this could changes the amount of bass you hear. from a technical aspect the lab ii are giants, final audio is very brave to go for a more or less completely open design at the back with a small dynamic driver in this case (litte control over the sealing and pressure flow in the ear channel). a open headphone is simpler to design, the parameters are quite similar from user to user (distance to the ear, pressure flow, sealing) and so better to measure/correct.

but would be intressting to make a test with the files, i once had a cd from a german magazin, it's maybe the same

 

[bidn]

Thanks! The PF are high on my list of options to reduce the pressure issues I have been dealing with and I assume they will work well for classical music (it seems they are designed for it) which is what I listen to most. Will still need to find a place in London where I can try them.

yes Final put on their site that listening to them is like listening to an orchestra. Indeed they image superbly each instrument at its place, they are fantastic for classic (I mean from ancient to romantic; sacred ) and vocal performance, but also even really great for most metal genre, but not when you need a lot of bass.

 

[bidn]

Hi, thanks. They were delivered this morning.

I have listened to them a little throughout the day, some very engaging moments, however I am thinking they do need some burn in to smoothen out a little and stretch their legs. Did you notice improvements with burn in? of course I also need some brain burn too.

I sold the Lab 1 atleast 18 months or so ago so it is difficult to compare the soundstage size but these are much brighter. My current iem's are EE Zeus XR Adel which have a monstrous soundstage and incredible imaging so without burn in of the Lab ii the Zeus XRA stage feels larger.

The lab ii are aesthetically gorgeous and lovely to touch. I love the box and the packaging as well, some nice Final opulance. The box isn't practical for travel but I think it is awesome for home, which I think Iwill limit these to as I have found out today that my office is a little too noisy to really enjoy these properly.

I am a little suprised at the lack of fanfare on Head Fi re the Lab ii. Back when the Lab 1 were released the forum was very busy and it seemed like every man and his dog was scrambling to get one.

Hi ,

very interesting and I will be interested in your further impressions.
The break-in smoothed them a little ( mine were a bit harsh at the beginning ),
but didn t change their type,
I mean for me their sound from the beginning on was outlandish to the sound of the Piano Forte line contrary to what I was thinking, and never came closer to the PF.

My PF and FI-BA-SS are a little dark, by comparison the LAB II are relatively brighter, but not bright as such, rather neutral, for me.

To compare my LAB II with relatively similar sounding hps of my collection, I think their sound would globally resemble most that of my pair of AKG K812 headphones with few differences, e.g. they have the advantage of not being ( anyway not too much ) bright like the K812, but the disadvantage of having less bass extension.

thank you for the comparison with the Zeus XR A, I didn 't know about them and will look for more info on them.

enjoy your LAB II