[robo24]

I've been waiting for someone to ask me this, haha!

I've had the WA-23 since autumn 2022 and have had the Envy for about 2.5 months. Did not expect to own two TOTL tube amps, but did not like the Enleum 23R overall in my system, so ended up exchanging for the Envy.

When I got the Envy, I immediately loved the bigger bass and bigger soundstage over the WA-23. It was obvious it'd be a great compliment to the WA-23. Now that I've had a good amount of time to listen to both, I still prefer the WA-23 for most of my headphones. I've been listening to the Caldera a lot since I got it, and it's particularly seriously addictive on the WA-23. I prefer it on that amp over the Envy. I was trying to think about why that is as I've been listening, so that's why I said I'm glad someone asked since I've been wanting a chance to articulate these thoughts!

To me, the WA-23 sounds more cohesive and tonally perfect to me over the Envy. The Envy slams harder and also has a bigger soundstage, but it sounds almost like there's a lack of coherency in its sound because of that, almost like the bass and soundstage are separated. The soundstage and bass is still really good on the WA-23, there's just more of it on the Envy. The first amp I listened to the Caldera on was the WA-23 and immediately was just taken with it. As I said in a different post, I actually teared up a few songs in! There's just something married between technical performance with some specific emotional midrange in the Caldera that hits me right in the feels (first time I've ever used that hipster phrase too, ha!) and the WA-23 is just an incredible match with Caldera. It's amazing in the same way for all my other headphones, where I'd say Envy is a little more picky. VC seems to scale unusually high with the Envy where it doesn't as much with the WA-23. Susvara also benefits from the extra power and soundstage that the Envy has, but still sounds amazing on the WA-23. I'd say the only time I've preferred Envy so far is with the VC , or when I need more of a punchy, super exciting bigger sound. It's nice to have both though for sure.

P.S. - your photographs are kinda what made me want this particular set, so thanks! They look just as cool in person, although with some different qualities. Very stoked on them.

The Envy really benefits hugely from upgrading the tubes. If you don't want to spend crazy amounts on ELROGs or WE 300bs even the relatively cheap (for 300bs) JJs will be a nice upgrade over the Full Music. Got those recently out of curiousity and so far can't see using them much. The stock 6SN7 aren't particularly special either. Of course a zillion recommendations on the Envy thread, especially with all the possible adapters. Though now I'm very curious to hear the Caldera with the WA-23 someday, as I've yet to hear anything I enjoy more than the Caldera Envy combo.

 

[zach915m]

Congrats @zach915m ! Headphonia 2023 Best Orthodynamic HP!

https://www.headfonia.com/headfonia-2023-awards-part-1/

Well Deserved!

Oh wow, just saw this thanks to you. Awards are weird, and flattering ofcourse, but in such a subjective hobby I never believe there is a best. But none-the-less thank you to anyone who appreciates the Caldera.

 

[TheMiddleSky]

I've been waiting for someone to ask me this, haha!

I've had the WA-23 since autumn 2022 and have had the Envy for about 2.5 months. Did not expect to own two TOTL tube amps, but did not like the Enleum 23R overall in my system, so ended up exchanging for the Envy.

When I got the Envy, I immediately loved the bigger bass and bigger soundstage over the WA-23. It was obvious it'd be a great compliment to the WA-23. Now that I've had a good amount of time to listen to both, I still prefer the WA-23 for most of my headphones. I've been listening to the Caldera a lot since I got it, and it's particularly seriously addictive on the WA-23. I prefer it on that amp over the Envy. I was trying to think about why that is as I've been listening, so that's why I said I'm glad someone asked since I've been wanting a chance to articulate these thoughts!

To me, the WA-23 sounds more cohesive and tonally perfect to me over the Envy. The Envy slams harder and also has a bigger soundstage, but it sounds almost like there's a lack of coherency in its sound because of that, almost like the bass and soundstage are separated. The soundstage and bass is still really good on the WA-23, there's just more of it on the Envy. The first amp I listened to the Caldera on was the WA-23 and immediately was just taken with it. As I said in a different post, I actually teared up a few songs in! There's just something married between technical performance with some specific emotional midrange in the Caldera that hits me right in the feels (first time I've ever used that hipster phrase too, ha!) and the WA-23 is just an incredible match with Caldera. It's amazing in the same way for all my other headphones, where I'd say Envy is a little more picky. VC seems to scale unusually high with the Envy where it doesn't as much with the WA-23. Susvara also benefits from the extra power and soundstage that the Envy has, but still sounds amazing on the WA-23. I'd say the only time I've preferred Envy so far is with the VC , or when I need more of a punchy, super exciting bigger sound. It's nice to have both though for sure.

P.S. - your photographs are kinda what made me want this particular set, so thanks! They look just as cool in person, although with some different qualities. Very stoked on them.

Thanks for detailed impression man! I can understand your feeling about "bass and soundstage are separated", perhaps because Envy deliver big imaging and punchy character at the same time. Anyhow, I suspect that Full Music Tube perhaps the one that cause it. When I tried to use Elrog 300B and Elrog Mo, all notes become much more fluid, cohesive, and "coherent" from bottom to top. It's like someone changing the setting from 60hz screen to 120hz.

Both Elrog deliver better detail and soundstage than Full Music, and at the same time also smoother treble/upper mid area (less sibilance for not good recording).

Yeah just like all colored stabilize zmf, a bit tricky to photograph them, different angle and light intensity may make them look different. Even my photo actually still a little bit different than what Zach shot. I think because I use natural sun light and Zach use indoor flash light (I assume). Either way they look pretty though.

 

[AcousticMatt]

Thanks for detailed impression man! I can understand your feeling about "bass and soundstage are separated", perhaps because Envy deliver big imaging and punchy character at the same time. Anyhow, I suspect that Full Music Tube perhaps the one that cause it. When I tried to use Elrog 300B and Elrog Mo, all notes become much more fluid, cohesive, and "coherent" from bottom to top. It's like someone changing the setting from 60hz screen to 120hz.

Both Elrog deliver better detail and soundstage than Full Music, and at the same time also smoother treble/upper mid area (less sibilance for not good recording).

Yeah just like all colored stabilize zmf, a bit tricky to photograph them, different angle and light intensity may make them look different. Even my photo actually still a little bit different than what Zach shot. I think because I use natural sun light and Zach use indoor flash light (I assume). Either way they look pretty though.

My pleasure! Always very fun to talk about this stuff.

Ah, yes, I've been hearing about the tube upgrade for Envy. That's good to hear your impressions, too. Envy sounds great with the Full Music, but I can see how other tubes can bridge the gap between the bass and airy soundstage elements. Based on what I've read, my preferences seem to lean to Western Electric, but I have yet to hear any upgraded tubes in the Envy.

Oh yeah, I can see how tricky it is to photograph these headphones - as you can see from my photos too. Your photos look great though and the outdoor lighting really made the colors pop and toned down the gold on the grill. They still have a lot of cool textures in real life though that I'm stoked on.

The Envy really benefits hugely from upgrading the tubes. If you don't want to spend crazy amounts on ELROGs or WE 300bs even the relatively cheap (for 300bs) JJs will be a nice upgrade over the Full Music. Got those recently out of curiousity and so far can't see using them much. The stock 6SN7 aren't particularly special either. Of course a zillion recommendations on the Envy thread, especially with all the possible adapters. Though now I'm very curious to hear the Caldera with the WA-23 someday, as I've yet to hear anything I enjoy more than the Caldera Envy combo.

Thanks for these tube suggestions! Also meant to say that my WA-23 has upgraded tubes - they're Psvane 2A3s instead of stock. It's what was installed when I listened at CanJam last year, so I ended up buying them with it because I liked that sound. I think the stock tubes would sound great too though.

Hope you get to hear the Caldera with the WA-23 some day. To me, it's probably been one of my favorite pairings ever. I'm using my iFi Pro iDSD Signature DAC and sometimes a Chord Qutest. Hope to upgrade to a Holo May, Sonnet Pasithea, or something similar sometime next year.

 

[chrisnyc75]

Been listening off and on to my Caldera since it arrived yesterday and... was moved to tears within a few songs of listening! Unique experience for me that connects me back to the days of when I first started being really emotionally moved by music. I've always been a fan of ZMF, but this feels like the culmination of my experience so far. Also feels a bit like I'm obviously preaching to the choir in this thread, but man, this headphone really does something special to my ears! I see now why it's become people's favorite.

They really are damn near perfect, aren't they? I'm a die-hard Utopia fanboy, but I knew I wanted a planar as an alternative option. That "dynamic engagement" that Utopia is so famous for is the "secret sauce" that makes it my favorite, and in that respect I could never find a planar that quite hit that sweet spot for me. Even Susvara, though I'm not entirely sure I ever heard it amped to its maximum potential, always sounds a little bit limp to me. The highest compliment I can pay Caldera is that I have rarely thought "hmmmm, I wonder if this might sound better on Utopia?". When I A/B back and forth, Utopia certainly "slams" a little harder, but in exchange Caldera is noticeably better/more resolving in the bass - making them trade punches quite evenly IMHO. I'm convinced Caldera, even as ZMF's first entry into the category, has comfortably claimed its place in the discussion for the "best planar magnetic headphone in the world"

 

[steamboiled]

Taking emergency leave tomorrow. The blue’s darker in real life.

 

[mattiastomas]

So I've had my Caldera's for a few days now. Been kinda a mixed bag so far. Think I'm having issue dialing in a sound I like. Coming from the AC and Bokeh a pad swap kinda nailed the sound for me.

With the Caldera's some songs sound amazing but then others sounds bright. Currently listening to them with the stock pads on.

Am trying to give it time and see if I just need time to adjust coming from the AC and Bokeh.

 

[goldwerger]

So I've had my Caldera's for a few days now. Been kinda a mixed bag so far. Think I'm having issue dialing in a sound I like. Coming from the AC and Bokeh a pad swap kinda nailed the sound for me.

With the Caldera's some songs sound amazing but then others sounds bright. Currently listening to them with the stock pads on.

Am trying to give it time and see if I just need time to adjust coming from the AC and Bokeh.

Check with @zach915m perhaps one of the mesh options may help?

or with @heliosphann who might recommend other pads to attenuate some of the higher frequencies?

 

[wizzman121]

Am trying to give it time and see if I just need time to adjust coming from the AC and Bokeh.

^This.

Don't bounce back and forth between headphones. Your two headphones are alot thicker sounding and less resolving. I went through some real brain and actual headphone burn with the Caldera. It is far and away my favorite headphone now.

 

[RoThe]

I had to use the mesh in the beginning, too, because it was too much treble. But I at least adjusted to the treble after some days. And now I it is just perfect without the mesh. Or maybe the headphones really do need some burn in time.

 

[mattiastomas]

Check with @zach915m perhaps one of the mesh options may help?

or with @heliosphann who might recommend other pads to attenuate some of the higher frequencies?

I did get the thick pads and the mantle mesh when I bought the unit. Will try them at some point to see how it affects the sound. Trying to get used to the "stock" caldera sound first and adjust from there.

 

[mattiastomas]

^This.

Don't bounce back and forth between headphones. Your two headphones are alot thicker sounding and less resolving. I went through some real brain and actual headphone burn with the Caldera. It is far and away my favorite headphone now.

Yeah, this is what I'm wondering too. I'm so used to the AC sound signature and the Bokeh does sound similar to the AC that I enjoyed both very quickly. Suddenly the Caldera sounds really different (not that I'm not used to Planars. I've owned Arya and LCD-X)

 

[zach915m]

Check with @zach915m perhaps one of the mesh options may help?

or with @heliosphann who might recommend other pads to attenuate some of the higher frequencies?

I did get the thick pads and the mantle mesh when I bought the unit. Will try them at some point to see how it affects the sound. Trying to get used to the "stock" caldera sound first and adjust from there.

Other options may be to try suede with or without the mesh.

I know DMS liked the velour Lcd pads so I bought them, they measure very close to zmf pads but are very very thick, kinda like super thick angled pads, and dull the treble a bit. I don't personally love them but I think for people who want a slightly darker headphone and want to make sure their ears are super far from the driver it's not a bad option. The actual ear hole / cavity is somewhat small though.

 

[mattiastomas]

Other options may be to try suede with or without the mesh.

Thanks will give that a try. I actually have the suede pads from my AC. so I can give them a shot and see.

 

[XVampireX]

So I've had my Caldera's for a few days now. Been kinda a mixed bag so far. Think I'm having issue dialing in a sound I like. Coming from the AC and Bokeh a pad swap kinda nailed the sound for me.

With the Caldera's some songs sound amazing but then others sounds bright. Currently listening to them with the stock pads on.

Am trying to give it time and see if I just need time to adjust coming from the AC and Bokeh.

Honestly, a few days is not enough for them for burn in, they sounded at first quite bright or peaky in the treble, a week or two more should do it for them