[tim3320070]

I would honestly forget the 595- I had it and could not stand the grain the treble had. My HD580 (same drivers as HD600) are extremely pleasing with acoustic (guitars sound very real) and vocals. These can be had for under $150.

 

[elbuzzard]

Quote:

Originally Posted by tim3320070 /img/forum/go_quote.gif I would honestly forget the 595- I had it and could not stand the grain the treble had. My HD580 (same drivers as HD600) are extremely pleasing with acoustic (guitars sound very real) and vocals. These can be had for under $150.

totally agree. The grain in the treble was just unbearable with 595. I wish I had avoided the 595 from the get go.
The 600 is a good place to start building your system. I'm happy now with my 580 w/650 cable.

 

[Melanter]

I really appreciate all of the help everyone!

So a 600 straight out of an iPod, how awful is that? I don't really understand how 'bad' a headphone that needs amping sounds when it isn't amped. Is it worse than a headphone that is $150 cheaper but doesn't require amping? Worse than the 595s straight out of an iPod?

 

[aimlink]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Melanter /img/forum/go_quote.gif I really appreciate all of the help everyone! So a 600 straight out of an iPod, how awful is that? I don't really understand how 'bad' a headphone that needs amping sounds when it isn't amped. Is it worse than a headphone that is $150 cheaper but doesn't require amping? Worse than the 595s straight out of an iPod?

It's possible for it to be worse than a can $150 cheaper. However, it's easy for it to be the other way around too. Audiophiles will be audiophiles and we do get anxious at the prospect of an 'undernourished' HD600 plugged straight into an iPod. Although you could hear a lot better coming from the HD600, this 'lot' better is pretty relative. Additionally, you're more sensitive to differences from the perspective of a deterioration in sound vs one of improvement.

If the HD600's are cans that you'll, in the end, really like, I'd expect that you should be fine running it from your iPod until you get some amp'ing for it sorted out.

 

[mr. nice]

get the hd600 and go shopping around for a used DAC/AMP. as mentioned before ive got an apogee one now and love it with the hd600. it's around $150 used. it's got a 1/8 mini out to run into your headphones and the hd600 stock cable has the same thing once you remove the 1/4 adapter that it comes with. it's only mac compatible though. im also coming from a Lavry DA10 and Grace M902 which are pretty good units and the apogee can hold it's own for one tenth the price. anyways i def say get the hd600 cuz those are pretty hard to beat at any price point and don't need to be upgraded forever really though you probably will someday in the not so distant future.......................

 

[Melanter]

This is one of the only ones I can find online in Canada. How terrible of a choice would it be?

 

[Melanter]

Quote:

Originally Posted by HeadphoneAddict /img/forum/go_quote.gif Small note - it's the Nuforce Icon Mobile that is colder sounding and it wont drive the HD600 that well. The uDAC is warmer sounding, but it still will drive the HD600 much better than the portable Icon due to more power. The uDAC even sounds good with HD800. The Vivid V1 that I recommended seems to have even more power (belying it's 5v power supply, so it must have a voltage multiplier or something). But the V1's DAC is not nearly as detailed and spacious as the one in the uDAC, although V1 can be used with an iPod and the uDAC is computer only. The V1 just has nice synergy with HD600 and can pound out the bass lines. I would not use the V1 as a DAC to feed a nicer amp later, but the uDAC's RCA out into a high end amp sounds wonderful. PS: Nankai's HD580 at RMAF sounded like my HD600, not much different.

Hey just to clarify, you're talking about this right?
https://www.themacgroup.ca/store/ind...t&product=uDac

So that would be a pretty good choice to power the 600s? I assume similarly with the 650s?

 

[HeadphoneAddict]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Melanter /img/forum/go_quote.gif I really appreciate all of the help everyone! So a 600 straight out of an iPod, how awful is that? I don't really understand how 'bad' a headphone that needs amping sounds when it isn't amped. Is it worse than a headphone that is $150 cheaper but doesn't require amping? Worse than the 595s straight out of an iPod?

The HD600 sound bad and dull and quiet via a 5.5G iPod video. The HD600 sound very clear, detailed and transparent with an iPhone 3GS but they wont play loud enough. It all depends on the source. It has been silly to use HD600 via iPod without an amp, so I have not tested my Nanos or Touch headphone out with them. If you want a strong DAC/amp for HD600 on a budget, the $99 vivid V1 DAC/amp or $270 3MOVE DAC/amp are the best ones I recommend at this time, followed by $475 Pico DAC/amp or $219 iBasso D4 using 9v power (last due to short battery life). Other portables don't have as much power as they need, but ALL will drive the HD600 better than most non-amped headphone out. (well, Marantz CD5001 desktop CD player headphone out is nice with HD600, but it's not portable so more power is available).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Melanter /img/forum/go_quote.gif Hey just to clarify, you're talking about this right? https://www.themacgroup.ca/store/ind...t&product=uDac So that would be a pretty good choice to power the 600s? I assume similarly with the 650s?

That is the DAC/amp I am recommending, and it does sound good with HD600. I did a review of the uDAC, and somewhere in the review thread added my impressions of it with the HD600. A link to all my reviews is in my public profile "about me".

I do not like HD650. If I did I would have recommended them. But I did not recommend them. I would not drive an HD650 with anything less than a $1000 Headroom Balanced Dekstop amp. Do not ask me about HD650, or I will curl up into a ball and hide.

While we're at it, in regards to a previous question, I cannot fathom the Hotaudio sounding as high end and as great as the uDAC. The uDAC took me completely by surprise, especially after all the experience I've had with budget DACs and amps in the past. Hotaudio might be that good, but I will not recommend ANYthing I have not heard for myself.

 

[dweaver]

The Hotaudio your looking at will sell for close to the price of the uDac from the Macgroup but the Macgroup charges a pretty high shipping cost so if you can pick it up locally you will be better off (keep in mind I was looking at shipping to Calgary). If you can go in to the store you might also be able to demo the uDac as well. BTW the MacGroup is the only authorised NuForce dealer I am aware of in Canada.

I have conversed via email with the owner of Hot Audio and he did seem to be a pretty straight up guy so you probably won't go wrong looking at his stuff either, you just might not be able to find many reviews of his stuff on Head-fi for some reason, so you would be flying blind a bit with his stuff.

 

[Melanter]

Arpf, I ordered the 650s assuming that whatever has been said about powering the 600s also applies to the 650s. Would the 650s really sound worse with a $100 amp than the 600s would with the same amp?

 

[dweaver]

The HD650 do use a different driver than the HD600... I haven't owned both so can't say for sure but I do think the HD650 are harder to drive and may require a better amp. But in the end it is your ears that will tell the true story. You may be quite happy with what you hear out of that setup. Personally I went HD600 partially out of price concerns and partially because I read (and at a head-fi meet experienced) it was more neutral than the HD650.

 

[HeadphoneAddict]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Melanter /img/forum/go_quote.gif Arpf, I ordered the 650s assuming that whatever has been said about powering the 600s also applies to the 650s. Would the 650s really sound worse with a $100 amp than the 600s would with the same amp?

Urgh!

The HD650 are pickier about the amp. I wish you hadn't done that, but I'm not you. The HD650 have more bass than they have highs, and so they can seem slower and duller or "veiled" than the HD600, and can seem less transparent due to their extra warmth and coloration. For me, I would NOT recommend mixing the uDAC with an HD650 unless I heard it first, because the uDAC highs are neutral but not extra sparkly. The Vivid V1 recommendation may still hold water, again I have no idea now.

At a meet at my home in Feb 2009, I tried the HD650 with my $1250 maxed Woo WA6 and the music was duller and less involving than with the HD600 which I love with that amp. I tried the Head-direct EF1, Cavalli CTH and SOHA II amp with the HD650 and still didn't think the HD650 were as balanced as HD600. Only with a $3000 balanced Beta 22 amp with Sigma 22 PSU's did the HD650 actually sound good for me at that meet (or a $2200 Zana Deux at a previous meet in 2008).

Good luck for not following the recommendations.

 

[Drubbing]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Melanter /img/forum/go_quote.gif This is one of the only ones I can find online in Canada. How terrible of a choice would it be?

Terrible. Hones, but very, very basic product. Why go to all the trouble - just buy a great phnoe that doesn't need amping?

Why buy a Ferrari and say. "I just have to have one of these, but 1st or 2nd gear will be fast enough for me"

 

[Melanter]

Quote:

Originally Posted by HeadphoneAddict /img/forum/go_quote.gif Good luck for not following the recommendations.

huh?

 

[Melanter]

I might be able to cancel the shipment and get the 600s, but how universal is the opinion that you guys have stated? I tried the 650s at the store, and loved them, couldn't try the 600s. Will there really be that big of a difference between the two of them as far as ability to find a suitable amp? If I loved the 650s will I love the 600s? You guys are saying that they sound very different.

Also I've read other thread on here where people say that the 650s are just as easy, if not easier to amp than the 600s. Granted you are saying that the 650s are pickier about the amp, not that they are harder to run, but how noticeable will that be?