[AverageGuyNC]

So not much advatage/benefit using a solid wire as far as transferring signal quality goes? That was probably my main question.

 

[EuropeanEar]

So not much advatage/benefit using a solid wire as far as transferring signal quality goes?

I think USB cable quality depends on way more variables than the choice could be simplified to solid/stranded wire. Materials used, geometry, insulation all play an important role.

Also, instead of a 1m USB cable, you might want to buy a 1.5m one.

 

[AverageGuyNC]

I think USB cable quality depends on way more variables than the choice could be simplified to solid/stranded wire. Materials used, geometry, insulation all play an important role.



Also, instead of a 1m USB cable, you might want to buy a 1.5m one.

He only lists the 1m size, you have to send him a message if you want a different size. He says 4N purity, I know on stranded cables offer 7N (Maybe better idk?). But it is made with silver too. Not sure about how great that copper sleeve is, but it looks pretty cool IMO. I've been considering his stuff for a while. It looks to be great quality and is reasonably priced. And what little I can find from owners are all very positive. His high end ICs have no shielding. He thinks they sound better with out it?

 

[LazyListener]

There is no such thing as "all-digital signal" transmission, only analogue representations of a digital signal.

PCM is an all-digital signal and when transmitted over a USB cable qualifies as an all-digital signal transmission. An "analogue representation of a digital signal" would be an analog signal (continuous waveform), not a digital signal.

My main point with my previous post is that all those fancy materials, design, and shielding in a USB cable have little, if any, benefit, and probably no perceivable audio benefit, when digital signals are being transmitted over such short distances. Digital signals over short cable runs are virtually immune to audible noise or interference. Sure, digital signals can have errors and timing issues, but that is typically caused/mitigated by the interconnected devices. The cable is simply a dumb pipe used to transfer the signal. Digital signal will weaken over longer runs causing signal drop outs, but repeaters or active cables can help with this. Even then, noise and interference aren't the issue.

Now, if we're talking about analog signal (waveform) being transmitted over cables, then yes, better materials and shielding can help. But even then, you don't need to go overboard in order to get maximum audible benefit. An inexpensive, but good quality, shielded cable is all that's needed. Exotic materials/design don't add any audible benefit.

Signal integrity can be measured (input vs output) with any cable as the transfer medium. Most "differences" people hear between cables, especially ones transferring digital signals, are sorry to say, "in their head." I mean, if the measured output signal is identical to the measured input signal, then what else can explain these "differences" people hear?

BTW, did the thread starter ever define what he/she means by "best?" I don't recall. Been a while since I read this thread.

 

[musicmaker]

I highly recommend the Chord c-usb cable. Sensibly prices and excellent price/performance and build quality.
https://www.thecableco.com/c-usb.html

Went through more pricey exotic cables and went back to the chord.

 

[EuropeanEar]

He only lists the 1m size, you have to send him a message if you want a different size.

The 1m length could be a problem. Unlike the interconnects where the shorter the better, USB audio cables have to be 1.5m long in order to avoid the reflection issue.

 

[EuropeanEar]

An "analogue representation of a digital signal" would be an analog signal (continuous waveform), not a digital signal.

That's exactly what it is in the USB audio cable; an analog signal. Technically, it is a binary transmission in the form of an analog voltage. A series of 0s and 1s transferred as square waves (instead of sine waves) detected by the receiver only when they pass a certain voltage threshold. The all-digital "zeroes and ones" only exist on an abstract, mathematical level in the DAC chip. In reality, the "digital" USB cable is just another analog cable.

Most "differences" people hear between cables, especially ones transferring digital signals, are sorry to say, "in their head."

Well, it could be and obviously I cannot prove otherwise but I think there's more to this. When different people hear the same thing listening to the same USB cable it suggests that something must be there.

Honestly, do you believe that people who share the same experience listening to an USB cable are victims of self-hypnotism or a collective hallucination of some kind? I'm not provoking you, would really like to know.

 

[Winston67]

Can I ask an only semi-related question? My DAC is connected to my desktop via a powered hub. If I were to introduce something like an Audioquest Jitterbug (or something comparable like an iPurifier 2) just to see what happens, where in the chain should it go? Between DAC and USB hub, or between desktop (source) and USB hub?

 

[bfreedma]

That's exactly what it is in the USB audio cable; an analog signal. Technically, it is a binary transmission in the form of an analog voltage. A series of 0s and 1s transferred as square waves (instead of sine waves) detected by the receiver only when they pass a certain voltage threshold. The all-digital "zeroes and ones" only exist on an abstract, mathematical level in the DAC chip. In reality, the "digital" USB cable is just another analog cable.


Well, it could be and obviously I cannot prove otherwise but I think there's more to this. When different people hear the same thing listening to the same USB cable it suggests that something must be there.

Honestly, do you believe that people who share the same experience listening to an USB cable are victims of self-hypnotism or a collective hallucination of some kind? I'm not provoking you, would really like to know.

Yes, until objective evidence indicates otherwise, though I consider it to be placebo effect (which all humans are subject to), not self-hypnotism or hallucination. I'll be first in line for a "high end" USB cable if objective evidence is produced by an independent study.

 

[LazyListener]

That's exactly what it is in the USB audio cable; an analog signal. Technically, it is a binary transmission in the form of an analog voltage. A series of 0s and 1s transferred as square waves (instead of sine waves) detected by the receiver only when they pass a certain voltage threshold. The all-digital "zeroes and ones" only exist on an abstract, mathematical level in the DAC chip. In reality, the "digital" USB cable is just another analog cable.


Well, it could be and obviously I cannot prove otherwise but I think there's more to this. When different people hear the same thing listening to the same USB cable it suggests that something must be there.

Honestly, do you believe that people who share the same experience listening to an USB cable are victims of self-hypnotism or a collective hallucination of some kind? I'm not provoking you, would really like to know.

I think you are confusing analog signal with electrical signal. Yes, both analog signals and digital signals are transferred with voltage fluctuations, but that doesn't mean a digital signal is analog. I agree the cable is not "digital" and never said it was. There's no such thing as a digital or analog cable. Digital or analog refers to the signal, not the cable or other medium of transfer.

Just because people hear the same thing doesn't prove that the cable is making that difference. As soon as you introduce human hearing into the equation you are introducing a plethora of subjectivity and brain games. Could be the cable, but there are ways to objectively measure if the cable is changing the signal in any way that could be audible. "Hearing" is not a scientific or objective testing method. I'm just saying if the input signal and output signal (on the ends of the cable), which can be measured, are identical measurements beyond any thresholds of human auditory perception, then yes, it's not the cable that's changing the sound. In such cases, could be a number of other things, all most likely related to the human brain. The power of suggestion is real, too. If someone posts how they "hear" a new cable online, some will be susceptible to hearing it the same way when they finally audition it, simply because what they had read about it beforehand influences their perception of the sound.

 

[AverageGuyNC]

The 1m length could be a problem. Unlike the interconnects where the shorter the better, USB audio cables have to be 1.5m long in order to avoid the reflection issue.

I had never heard of reflection issues, I learn something new every day. Thanks

And he will make them whatever length you want, you have to let him know how long. I guess he mainly gives the 1m so you kinda have an idea where the price starts at.

 

[AverageGuyNC]

And I was really not trying to get into a "cable quality matters" debate. I hear a difference in usb cables. Nothing major, just sounds a little different. I have a pretty good system and wanted to upgrade my $6 cable I'm using now. Wanted to stay under $100 (1.5m). Was curious what you guys (I'm not that experienced) thought of that cable as far as build? It looks like a great cable with high end(ish) materials for a decent price. Does it look like that to you guys or am I missing something important? Thank you for you opinions and help!

 

[AverageGuyNC]

Can I ask an only semi-related question? My DAC is connected to my desktop via a powered hub. If I were to introduce something like an Audioquest Jitterbug (or something comparable like an iPurifier 2) just to see what happens, where in the chain should it go? Between DAC and USB hub, or between desktop (source) and USB hub?

Are u saying the dac gets it's signal from a usb hooked into a usb hub? I thought that was supposed to be a bad idea? But anyways, I'm pretty sure you would hook it up after the hub and before the dac. There would likely be some info from the manufacturer included with item or on their website. Most have an email or can contact them thru Facebook even (I've contacted Audeze and IFI this way, and others non audio related) and they usually answer within a day. Hope this helps!

 

[AverageGuyNC]

I highly recommend the Chord c-usb cable. Sensibly prices and excellent price/performance and build quality.
https://www.thecableco.com/c-usb.html

Went through more pricey exotic cables and went back to the chord.

It's a little more than I wanted to spend. And I don't like the way it looks that much. If it was for sure a major improvement , I would c insider it, but I think I can find one a little cheaper that I like just as much. Another one I am considering is DH labs silver son is USB. But it's kinda high.

 

[squee116]

That's exactly what it is in the USB audio cable; an analog signal. Technically, it is a binary transmission in the form of an analog voltage. A series of 0s and 1s transferred as square waves (instead of sine waves) detected by the receiver only when they pass a certain voltage threshold. The all-digital "zeroes and ones" only exist on an abstract, mathematical level in the DAC chip. In reality, the "digital" USB cable is just another analog cable.


Well, it could be and obviously I cannot prove otherwise but I think there's more to this. When different people hear the same thing listening to the same USB cable it suggests that something must be there.

Honestly, do you believe that people who share the same experience listening to an USB cable are victims of self-hypnotism or a collective hallucination of some kind? I'm not provoking you, would really like to know.

So what are you arguing? When the data is transferred from start through the usb, to end, is it binary or not? If the DAC takes in 1s and 0s, and uses this order of 1s and 0s to produce an analog wave, if the 1s and 0s are in the same order, regardless of the cost of the cable, how is the audio output affected?