[earnmyturns]

tamar halprin

I didn't know Tamar Halperin, thanks for the tip! She also does awesome jazz work, listening to "Wunderkammer XXL," wow! Next to her classical work.

 

[johnjen]

Can you offer advice on how that's done in JRiver?
I would like to experiment - thank you!

Sure enough.
Go into the DSP Studio, then the tempo and pitch section.
Insert this value into the pitch adjustment,
-0.01818181818 (It is a negative number, so make sure you include the minus sign)

That's it, yer done.

JJ

 

[RCBinTN]

Sure enough.
Go into the DSP Studio, then the tempo and pitch section.
Insert this value into the pitch adjustment,
-0.01818181818 (It is a negative number, so make sure you include the minus sign)

That's it, yer done.

JJ

Thank you! Will give it a try.

 

[RCBinTN]

In the past month we've done two experiments investigating The Gadget's lowered tuning with professional trombone players.As if we don't see enough of each other playing professionally in an opera company we often get together to play recreationally and to investigate combinations of beer, wine and food. Of course none of what follows is double blind and it might be interesting to come up with a more rigorous double blind procedure.

On the first day we played an anonymous15th century piece (much more sonorous and consonant than later music) and some Bach chorales, first at normal A=440Hz pitch. We then tuned our instruments down to the A=430.5 pitch, which equates to the C=256Hz pitch of The Gadget. Most of our tuning slides had to go to their physical extension limit to get down to the Gadget pitch. To keep us honest and to prevent our drifting up to the A 440 or sharper pitch we've all played at all of our lives I kept a stroboscopic tuner set to A 430.5 on my music stand; we were able to keep the strobe wheel stable while we played. We all found the lower pitch very easy-feeling and our opinions were that the Gadget pitch seemed comfortable - more blended and more resonant were common comments.

While we were messing around with the two tunings I had a call from a friend who was in the neighbourhood. He's retired now but he used to own a high-end stereo store, selling Audio Research and similar brands. I invited him over and we played him the same music in the two pitches. He's not a trained musician but his reaction was similar; he found we sounded more relaxed and "better" but of course he couldn't describe what he was hearing technically.

A couple of weeks later five of us got together for more playing and smoked meat with beer. One player was delayed so we started with quartets, again Bach Chorales at the two pitches. We had the same reactions as previously and when our colleague arrived we repeated the experiment for him. We couldn't hide what we were doing from him; he saw us pull our tuning slides out to their limits. But his reaction was the same - more relaxed, more resonant, more comfortable and easier-sounding.

None of this is definitive, of course. But it's beyond interesting. My personal opinion has always been that choirs, string quartets and trombones have a natural resonance advantage because they can adjust their tuning to resonant temperaments. But the addition of the C=256 factor gives more food for thought and experimentation in music performance.

That is one of the most interesting posts / experiments that I've read about in a long time.
My granddaughter plays trombone. She could experiment with pitch re-tuning.

Not to mention the easier ones...the strings. They can easily re-tune.

It sounds like a fun experiment. Can you post the stroboscopic tuner you're using?
Thanks in advance, and thanks for the great post!
RCB

 

[bosiemoncrieff]

On product lines in general and The Gadget:

That means it should be fully baked. Yeah there are some DSP issues in the first gadget for 192KHz stuff. It is a very minor problem, and can always be redone later in a faster proc.

The problem is that I came out with it at the same time as Eitr. Yeah, Gen V sound baby. In all of my wisdom, I wanted to bring it out at $200, which meant Magni/Modi chassis. To make the $200, with USB/Coax in (It was never intended to be the Coax only in out that I brought to RMAF, just what we had at the time.) it had to be Gen 3 USB in and was still really space constraining the Magni/Modi chassis. That's all fine except Gen 3 (or any non isolated USB) sounds like hemorrhoidal ass.

So — bifrost-sized gadget, with a faster processor, gen5, and more i/o?

Then we have the fact that it is a single purpose component for $200.

Until Fulla, weren't all of Schiit products single purpose? Some for under that, some for a little more than that, some for a lot more than that? I recall Jason's stern admonition about Magni's built in DAC being in a separate chassis for an additional $99. I love single purpose components. They're easier to understand than copier printer scanner faxer all-in-ones, and if anything part of the brand's strength.

Worse, it is a single purpose component that no one understands. At the show and at the Schiitr people look at it and say "What is that?" The factual explanation is C=256. You can't even get to relative and absolute pitch before their eyes glaze over. A capella singers, adjusting flat to C=256, yada, yada. makes them comatose. Only if they are a musician who can actually read music and understand music theory do they understand. How do No one knows how to write a flyer for the Gadget. The reality is it is really simple.

The Flyer:

How do I use it, you ask? It is just like masturbation. You fool around with the knob until you get it. And when you get it, you GET it! There is only one knob, for God's sake.

But as a standalone product for $200 with yesterday's USB today that no one knows how to use – naah. Buried inside a DAC or a better EITR – Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm....

It is coming folks. Just a bit more down the road

The instinct to sell a first generation product in a modi chassis for an affordable price to a cult following was not a bad one. It would have generated interest—it's something people need to see other people doing before they see a reason for it. Henry Ford, faster horse, yadda yadda yadda.

The original Loki could have been the next big thing. It wasn't, for a host of reasons, but trying it out on an initial run that didn't bankrupt the company was a rational, justifiable move. If the processing and USB needs are such that the product really requires a bigger chassis, though, why the DAC suggestion? Your bottom line about Yggy (and the other two) was that it would be upgradeable. Where on the chassis do you stick the hypothetical DSP tuning knob, and bypass switch? A standalone product is the only one that makes sense to me.

It's a pity that there are processor issues, and that the original chassis size isn't looking like a workable platform, and that the $200 price tag may not be attainable. My greatest sympathies are with you there. DSP is a difficult art. Would a (say) $400 Bifrost-sized gadget be probable, perhaps by the summertime?

 

[basstrombone]

That is one of the most interesting posts / experiments that I've read about in a long time.
My granddaughter plays trombone. She could experiment with pitch re-tuning.

Not to mention the easier ones...the strings. They can easily re-tune.

It sounds like a fun experiment. Can you post the stroboscopic tuner you're using?
Thanks in advance, and thanks for the great post!
RCB

In the Android Play Store, Stroboscopic Tuner by Adam Foster. It's amazing for pitch calibration and training, has a massive library of temperaments, and allows instrumentalists to visually evaluate resonance tuning.
Also please check out Audio Tool by JJ Nunn.

 

[ofilippov]

Read this and weep!

https://www.mattmontag.com/music/universals-audible-watermark

You made my day! It seems it's better to develop spiritual qualities like abandonment instead of audio gear

Do you know if HDtracks affected? Thanks!

 

[r0dd3r5]

You made my day! It seems it's better to develop spiritual qualities like abandonment instead of audio gear

Do you know if HDtracks affected? Thanks!

As far as I know it's only used for streaming so download purchases should be fine. As I haven't bought any downloads I haven't been able to test this.

 

[Ableza]

Some sources on the Web are reporting that the UMG watermark is present on all streaming and downloadable content they control, including from iTunes, HDTracks, etc. I can neither confirm nor deny this, just reporting what anyone can discover using Google.

 

[Pietro Cozzi Tinin]

At the show and at the Schiitr people look at it and say "What is that?" The factual explanation is C=256. You can't even get to relative and absolute pitch before their eyes glaze over. A capella singers, adjusting flat to C=256, yada, yada. makes them comatose. Only if they are a musician who can actually read music and understand music theory do they understand.

I must put in some nuance here.
Reading all posts on this one would believe there're 2 categories regarding the Gadget:
1) The people who do not understand it and thus do not grasp how to use it.
2) The people who are somehow proficient in musical theory and harmony who do grasp the workings and like it.
You all are forgetting the third categorie:
3) The people who are somehow proficient in musical theory and harmony who do grasp the workings and do not like it.
The adjustment of central C to 256Hz is called the Verdi pitch. There are other variances on pitch. A lot of them.
Discussions on what the best and probably most "skingasmable" pitch is are around as long as the notion of pitch itself.

 

[Alcophone]

I must put in some nuance here.
Reading all posts on this one would believe there're 2 categories regarding the Gadget:
1) The people who do not understand it and thus do not grasp how to use it.
2) The people who are somehow proficient in musical theory and harmony who do grasp the workings and like it.
You all are forgetting the third categorie:
3) The people who are somehow proficient in musical theory and harmony who do grasp the workings and do not like it.
The adjustment of central C to 256Hz is called the Verdi pitch. There are other variances on pitch. A lot of them.
Discussions on what the best and probably most "skingasmable" pitch is are around as long as the notion of pitch itself.

I like to think I understand what it does, while it would be ridiculous to call me proficient in musical theory. Whether I like it, we shall see.

Maybe in June at the LA Audio Show?

 

[GearMe]

I must put in some nuance here.
Reading all posts on this one would believe there're 2 categories regarding the Gadget:
1) The people who do not understand it and thus do not grasp how to use it.
2) The people who are somehow proficient in musical theory and harmony who do grasp the workings and like it.
You all are forgetting the third categorie:
3) The people who are somehow proficient in musical theory and harmony who do grasp the workings and do not like it.
The adjustment of central C to 256Hz is called the Verdi pitch. There are other variances on pitch. A lot of them.
Discussions on what the best and probably most "skingasmable" pitch is are around as long as the notion of pitch itself.

Hmmm...the way The Gadget's been explained, I'm thinking I don't need to know anything about musical theory, equally tempered scales, or Who's on first. I simply need to use it with music that can leverage the DSP algorithms 'enough' for me to like the output more than the input.

Am I missing something?

 

[JohnnyCanuck]

Hmmm...the way The Gadget's been explained, I'm thinking I don't need to know anything about musical theory, equally tempered scales, or Who's on first. I simply need to use it with music that can leverage the DSP algorithms 'enough' for me to like the output more than the input.

Am I missing something?

That seems to sum it up rather succinctly.

JC

 

[Pietro Cozzi Tinin]

Hmmm...the way The Gadget's been explained, I'm thinking I don't need to know anything about musical theory, equally tempered scales, or Who's on first. I simply need to use it with music that can leverage the DSP algorithms 'enough' for me to like the output more than the input.

Am I missing something?

No you don't.
You're in the a sub-category also not mentioned:
1a) The people who do not understand it and thus do not grasp how to use it but do like it.
So 1b would be: The people who do not understand it and thus do not grasp how to use it and do not like it.
It's the way Baldr categorises the users. Not me.
Tnx for the notion.

 

[GearMe]

NP...this will literally be a purchase for me based on trusting what Mike is saying about this product.

Being an early adopter is not my typical MO. I usually wait and let others test the waters, then I'll buy once enough reviews are in that convince me I'll enjoy the product.

However, based on what's being said, it sounds like a high-value product for a significant chunk of my music collection...worth jumping in early in my estimation.