[ericp10]

Was waiting to read something on the W4 from you @ Joey. I think we have similar taste. I also think even if you love the W4, it's time to move into customs. There are some seeming great low-end customs companies now that can help you move in slowly (of course, I'm partial to 1964 EARS), then maybe move up to more expensive ones (which I plan to do eventually). But the W4 sounds like a nice IEM. As I've said on another thread, I've yet to hear any universal match up to my 1964 quad, so I'm really curious how a 4 armature universal will match up to it. Thanks for initial impressions buddy.
 
Quote:

I wholeheartedly agree with those two statements..  It's way too early on for full on fan-boyism or FOTM type talk, but I just had to pull the W4's out of my ears mid song and put the W3's in to see if it was the W4 or my mind playing tricks on me... It's not my mind..  The W4's are head and shoulders above any IEM I've heard to date as far as separation goes.  The soundstage is larger than the W3, but it's the separation and detail that stand out.  I just did a quick A/B between the W3 & W4 on one track that I'm intimate with and I can't believe the differences so far.  I also don't find the bass lacking, it's not as intrusive or bold as the W3, but it's definitely not lacking.  Ok, I need to go through more of my favorites before posting any more, but I'm very happy with what I'm hearing so far.  Oh and a quick thank you to Flavio for packaging the W4 so well
 
Hey, who said Westone can't do mids??  Not me..

 

[music_4321]

.

 

[JoeyRusso]

Ok... First impression time...
 
 Out of the box, the first thing I did was swap out the Comply tips for a pair of Shure Olives.  The olives are my favorite tip with the W3, so I wanted an even playing field for comparisons. 
 
As I mentioned earlier in response to a few other posts, these are far more detailed than I was expecting and the level of detail across the board so far has been impressive.  I too was afraid that the bass might be lacking compared to the W3, but that's not the case.  They extend very deep and rumble nicely on the Boston Acoustics Bass Test - Woofer cooker.  If you've never heard that track, search it out and have a listen/feel for yourself with your IEM of choice.
 
 I also don't find these rolled off in the highs, they are as detailed as my RE0's and show no signs of sibilance. (I'll try a few sibilance prone tracks later).
 
So far I've sampled just about every genre of music I own and I haven't found a flaw in the W4's presentation yet.  I've sampled the following:
 
A Perfect Circle - The Noose
AC/DC - Back in black
Acoustic Alchemy - Homecoming & Mr. Chow
Al Di Meola - Meninas
Alice in Chains - Nutshell - MTV Unplugged
Avenged Sevenfold - Almost Easy
Beyonce - Halo and Irreplaceable
Black Eyed Peas - Boom Boom Pow
Boston Acoustics Bass Test - woofer cooker
Best of New York session Volume two - Witch Hunt (Chesky recording - featuring some Jazz greats)
Bergen Philharmonic Orchestra's - Grieg for strings - Holberg Suite
 
 
I've thrown almost everything at them and I'm amazed at what I'm hearing.  These are more than just a refined W3.  The mids aren't over the top or in your face, but they are more forward than the W3.  They are detailed, full bodied but not overly warm.  They aren't clinical or sterile, they're just right to my ears. I never found the mids as recessed as others with the W3, but I can truly appreciate the step forward in the W4. The highs are also more detailed than the W3.  The W3 was bright, but lacked the last bit of detail that I wanted to hear.  The W4 strikes the right balance of shine and detail for me.  I'll be amazed if I find sibilance with these, partly because of the Olives, but also because of the refinement.  As I mentioned earlier, the bass rumbles deep and strong when called on, but it's not intrusive.  I now, more than ever, understand how others found the bass of the W3 overpowering or impeding.  While I never found them as dirty (mid-bass hump) as the IE8, I can now appreciate how others hear them.
 
 It's no secret that my ears never got along with the Shure 535's.  Partly due to fit but also presentation.  While I'm going from memory, I clearly remember what I didn't like about them.  The highs of the W4 are head and shoulders above the 535.  The 535 lacked enough sparkle/shine for my tastes.  The details may have been there but they were harder to find/hear.  The mids of the 535 were more forward than the W4 and they had a peak somewhere in the upper mids that disagreed with my ears.  I had to EQ them a db down at 7kHz and 10kHz (Foobar2k) to enjoy them.  I hear no spike like that with the W4, at this point anyway.  I also had a real issue with the bass of the 535.  While they may be flat down to 20Hz, they sounded short to me.  I'm not sure if it was the decay, but the bass lacked body to me.  The W4 sounds more like what I hoped for in the 535, a well balanced IEM.
 
 While typing this I've been letting Foobar2K shuffle through my default playlist.  I noticed one thing that may make me hold onto my W3's as a back up.  The bass impact of the W4 isn't nearly as viceral as the W3 with some of my Techno/Electronica.  Then again, I do have the VB's sitting in their case for those occasions when a little brain bouncing is called for

 

[JoeyRusso]

Quote:

Was waiting to read something on the W4 from you @ Joey. I think we have similar taste. I also think even if you love the W4, it's time to move into customs. There are some seeming great low-end customs companies now that can help you move in slowly (of course, I'm partial to 1964 EARS), then maybe move up to more expensive ones (which I plan to do eventually). But the W4 sounds like a nice IEM. As I've said on another thread, I've yet to hear any universal match up to my 1964 quad, so I'm really curious how a 4 armature universal will match up to it. Thanks for initial impressions buddy.
 

 

Thanks E.. I agree we have very similar tastes..  Honestly, after hearing the W4, I'm not sure if I'm more or less intrigued by customs.  The one and only thing that I could ask for over the W4 at this point anyway, is perhaps more bass impact.  I wouldn't want to sacrifice any of the detail or separation that I'm hearing above and beyond the W3, but I could always live with more impact    That may be where the line is drawn between universal and customs at this point.  It has to be that last bit of detail/impact/balance that can be rung out of these armatures that you pay for in a custom.  That and the isolation/comfort.

 

[javahut]

 
Quote:

...I just had to pull the W4's out of my ears mid song and put the W3's in to see if it was the W4 or my mind playing tricks on me... It's not my mind...

 
Ha Ha!... same here. I did that quite a few times.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by JoeyRusso /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Hey, who said Westone can't do mids??  Not me..

 
Westone definitely does mids now... in excellent detail!
 
Quote:

...a quick thank you to Flavio for packaging the W4 so well  

 
I also have to say thanks to Flavio. I think I've purchased 4 IEMs from them in the past 7 years or so. The first were Ety ER4... which I quickly returned, as too many recordings were just entirely too bright and grating so as to be unlistenable for me. So I sent them back to Flavio and traded for Shure E5, which were great at the time. Great low end, and the hi end sounded fine, as I had nothing else to compare it with and easily learned to love the sound. Then when the Shure E500 came out, I quickly purchased those. Huge improvement in detail over the E5... but I did miss the low end of the E5 sometimes... but I began to appreciate more than just the low end due to the E500. Had the E500 for over a year when I experienced the cable cracking problem. Sent them to Shure, and they replaced them with the SE530. Then I waited and waited for the Westone 3 to go into production when I first heard about their new 3 way design. I was really wanting the low end back I missed from the E5, and had heard good things about the UM2. The W3 was the answer... great low end and decent mids and top end to go with it. Now Westone has outdone themselves with the W4. Every transaction and communication with Earphone Solutions has been stellar! Thanks Flavio & company!!! You guys are great! 

 

[javahut]

 
Quote:

I noticed one thing that may make me hold onto my W3's as a back up.  The bass impact of the W4 isn't nearly as viceral as the W3 with some of my Techno/Electronica.
 
...It has to be that last bit of detail/impact/balance that can be rung out of these armatures that you pay for in a custom.

I don't know. I thought so, too, at first, regarding the low end impact. So I pulled out the W4 and put in the W3. There was really no more low end with W3 to me... and it was missing some of the detail and depth of the low end that the W4 had. And then there's the entire rest of the spectrum that just wasn't in the same ball park as the W4.
 
But that's not to say I wouldn't mind getting some JH16 Pros! ;-D

 

[50mm]

Just ordered the W4 from Flavio.....can't wait to get it in the mail from half way round the globe in the Southern Hemisphere !
Upgrading from the Jay Q Jays................hope the W4 will blow the Q Jays out of the water !
 

 

[ericp10]

Yeah Joey, from what I've read, it seems that the 4 armatures definitely bring the details out, whether custom or universal. Now, the difference, i don't know, but I would expect even more details with a custom because it's shaped to your ear and you can get a deeper fit, along with the the tuning of the IEM. Again, speculation on my part. Based on what you and others have described with the sound signature, I would think the quad bass is deeper than the W4. The W4 sound signature has been described similar to how  jermng described the Westone ES5 to me (he has both the Westone and the 1964 EARS quad). He too the Westone bass is detailed and of great quality, but tuned more neutral than the quad. While the bass doesn't bleed into the mids or treble, it does has a significant prominence. Sub bass, as I've read with the W4, comes in when needed. So I would venture that both on greatly detailed, but just tuned differently in sound signature. I'll debate if I want to compare the W4 with the quad myself somewhere down the future. I have yet to hear any Westone IEM, so this may be my first. Thanks again for the insight.
 
Quote:

Thanks E.. I agree we have very similar tastes..  Honestly, after hearing the W4, I'm not sure if I'm more or less intrigued by customs.  The one and only thing that I could ask for over the W4 at this point anyway, is perhaps more bass impact.  I wouldn't want to sacrifice any of the detail or separation that I'm hearing above and beyond the W3, but I could always live with more impact    That may be where the line is drawn between universal and customs at this point.  It has to be that last bit of detail/impact/balance that can be rung out of these armatures that you pay for in a custom.  That and the isolation/comfort.

 

[Flavio T]

Quote:

Originally Posted by javahut /img/forum/go_quote.gif

I also have to say thanks to Flavio. I think I've purchased 4 IEMs from them in the past 7 years or so. The first were Ety ER4... which I quickly returned, as too many recordings were just entirely too bright and grating so as to be unlistenable for me. So I sent them back to Flavio and traded for Shure E5, which were great at the time. Great low end, and the hi end sounded fine, as I had nothing else to compare it with and easily learned to love the sound. Then when the Shure E500 came out, I quickly purchased those. Huge improvement in detail over the E5... but I did miss the low end of the E5 sometimes... but, I began to appreciate more than just the low end due to the E500. Had the E500 for over a year when I experienced the cable cracking problem. Sent them to Shure, and they replaced them with the SE530. Then I waited and waited for the Westone 3 to go into production when I first heard about their new 3 way design. I was really wanting the low end back I missed from the E5, and had heard good things about the UM2. The W3 was the answer... great low end and decent mids and top end to go with it. Now Westone has outdone themselves with the W4. Every transaction and communication with Earphone Solutions has been stellar! Thanks Flavio & company!!! You guys are great! 

 

 
Thanks so much for your kind words and the repeat business! 

 

[JoeyRusso]

Quote:

 

I don't know. I thought so, too, at first, regarding the low end impact. So I pulled out the W4 and put in the W3. There was really no more low end with W3 to me... and it was missing some of the detail and depth of the low end that the W4 had. And then there's the entire rest of the spectrum that just wasn't in the same ball park as the W4.
 
But that's not to say I wouldn't mind getting some JH16 Pros! ;-D

Yeah, it may just require more brain burn in... Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't swap the detail I hear now for more impact.  I'm just being greedy and asking for everything (too much?)...  and you are correct, the W4 is in it's own league compared to the W3 and everyone knows how much I love(d) the W3... LOL

 

[Gastronomic]

Any comparison between w4 and um3x?
Thank you.

 

[mfdale]

Just bit the bullet as well. Placed my order and should get them on Thursday. Can't wait to get them since I have owned the UM2, UM3X, Westone 3. The W3 is by far my favorite and I look forward to comparing to the W4. Next up will be a new amp. I pair my W3 's with my Practical Devices XM4 with the AD8620 chipset and it sounds awesome. Now on the hunt to find a nice companion for the W4's.

 

[50mm]

Just showed a couple of my colleagues who are keen musicians and audio nuts, earphonesolutions and they were like kids in a candy store ! Haha !
 
Not sure what they will end up getting but they were sure keen to try my W4 when it arrives (I might not get it back !)
 
 
 

 

[HeadphoneAddict]

Quote:

Ok... First impression time...
 
 Out of the box, the first thing I did was swap out the Comply tips for a pair of Shure Olives.  The olives are my favorite tip with the W3, so I wanted an even playing field for comparisons. 
 
As I mentioned earlier in response to a few other posts, these are far more detailed than I was expecting and the level of detail across the board so far has been impressive.  I too was afraid that the bass might be lacking compared to the W3, but that's not the case.  They extend very deep and rumble nicely on the Boston Acoustics Bass Test - Woofer cooker.  If you've never heard that track, search it out and have a listen/feel for yourself with your IEM of choice.
 
 I also don't find these rolled off in the highs, they are as detailed as my RE0's and show no signs of sibilance. (I'll try a few sibilance prone tracks later).
 
So far I've sampled just about every genre of music I own and I haven't found a flaw in the W4's presentation yet.  I've sampled the following:
 
A Perfect Circle - The Noose
AC/DC - Back in black
Acoustic Alchemy - Homecoming & Mr. Chow
Al Di Meola - Meninas
Alice in Chains - Nutshell - MTV Unplugged
Avenged Sevenfold - Almost Easy
Beyonce - Halo and Irreplaceable
Black Eyed Peas - Boom Boom Pow
Boston Acoustics Bass Test - woofer cooker
Best of New York session Volume two - Witch Hunt (Chesky recording - featuring some Jazz greats)
Bergen Philharmonic Orchestra's - Grieg for strings - Holberg Suite
 
 
I've thrown almost everything at them and I'm amazed at what I'm hearing.  These are more than just a refined W3.  The mids aren't over the top or in your face, but they are more forward than the W3.  They are detailed, full bodied but not overly warm.  They aren't clinical or sterile, they're just right to my ears. I never found the mids as recessed as others with the W3, but I can truly appreciate the step forward in the W4. The highs are also more detailed than the W3.  The W3 was bright, but lacked the last bit of detail that I wanted to hear.  The W4 strikes the right balance of shine and detail for me.  I'll be amazed if I find sibilance with these, partly because of the Olives, but also because of the refinement.  As I mentioned earlier, the bass rumbles deep and strong when called on, but it's not intrusive.  I now, more than ever, understand how others found the bass of the W3 overpowering or impeding.  While I never found them as dirty (mid-bass hump) as the IE8, I can now appreciate how others hear them.
 
 It's no secret that my ears never got along with the Shure 535's.  Partly due to fit but also presentation.  While I'm going from memory, I clearly remember what I didn't like about them.  The highs of the W4 are head and shoulders above the 535.  The 535 lacked enough sparkle/shine for my tastes.  The details may have been there but they were harder to find/hear.  The mids of the 535 were more forward than the W4 and they had a peak somewhere in the upper mids that disagreed with my ears.  I had to EQ them a db down at 7kHz and 10kHz (Foobar2k) to enjoy them.  I hear no spike like that with the W4, at this point anyway.  I also had a real issue with the bass of the 535.  While they may be flat down to 20Hz, they sounded short to me.  I'm not sure if it was the decay, but the bass lacked body to me.  The W4 sounds more like what I hoped for in the 535, a well balanced IEM.
 
 While typing this I've been letting Foobar2K shuffle through my default playlist.  I noticed one thing that may make me hold onto my W3's as a back up.  The bass impact of the W4 isn't nearly as viceral as the W3 with some of my Techno/Electronica.  Then again, I do have the VB's sitting in their case for those occasions when a little brain bouncing is called for

Great impressions/review.  I want to throw in a few more of my own impressions.  I feel the same way about the W4 when it comes to throwing everything and all genres at them and having a hard time finding flaws.  If anything, I might ask for slightly more sparkle, transparency and air like the Westone ES5, but then again we're comparing the W4 to a custom IEM costing 2x as much and it's just not going to perform at that level.  Nevertheless, I've not had a universal IEM make me feel quite this close to the music before, when used with a good source and amp.
 
I see that you've tried different tips.  I'm surprised that they sound so good without needing my UM56 custom tips, and I liked them with the Complys, single flange silicone and triple flange with the stalks cut shorter.  I might have a pair of black olives buried around here to try later, but I seem to recall they didn't go in deep enough to seal when I tried them with my W3 in the past.  When I use the UM56 custom tips the W4 don't really sound a lot different, while my W3 sounded noticeably better with the UM56 as it balanced out their bass, mids and treble a little better (with UM56 tips I still like W3 more than UM3X).  
 
The W4 are already more balanced sounding and the UM56 don't make them a whole lot better, so although it is an improvement they're not mandatory.  On the other hand the fit and isolation are much better with the custom tips.  Note - if I push the W4 too deep into my ear using the single flange silicone tips then the treble does get a little bit muted with them - but re-seating them shallower fixes that.  So, the sound can be dependent on the tip and fit, like with any other universal fit IEM.  Another note, the universal silicone tips can make my ear canals itch a bit, but the UM56 silicone custom tips don't have that problem for me.
 
I believe that I get a bigger improvement upgrading my source and amp than with changing to different tips.  The UM56 tips are more like icing on the cake.  I've been using the W4 with my UM56 custom tips all day, trying them with different sources and amps. Like a good high end custom they scale up nicely with a good source and amplification so that they're not typically the weak link in the chain.  The iPhone 4 or 6G Nano headphone out sounds nice with them, but going to an LOD with Pico Slim or my HM-602 gives a noticeable jump in performance, as does my DACport 24/96 USB DAC from my Macbook.  I could certainly listen un-amped all day long, but I prefer to use the Slim or HM602 for portable (and the DACport sounds very similar to these).  
 
Moving from portable upgrades to my HDP DAC/amp with Macbook was small step up and improved the treble presence, air and ambience; but the DACmini out of the Macbook is another jump above that, giving me a "WOW" moment a couple of times.  The synergy is really great with this combo.  I still might have to try them with my Woo WA6 or ZDT amps, which are crazy silent, sound wonderful with my custom IEM, and have good channel balance at low volumes.  Those have always been my best amps for my ES3X, JH13Pro and UE11Pro.  
 
On the other hand, despite scaling up with better gear, the W4 don't seem to make a lower performing iPhone 4 or my lower bit-rate music sound bad, since their sound is not overly analytical.  If I can't carry around an LOD+Amp or HM-602 with me I'm still perfectly happy using the iPhone 4, and having just now switched back to the single flange silicone tips that opinion hasn't changed when giving up the custom tips.

 

[Audiophile1811]

Hi guys. I wanted to ask a few questions of what you guys prefer about the the Westone 4 and Shure SE535.
(For owners of both the SE535's and W4's, Please respond)
-What are the main sonic advantages of either one of these phones over the other and vice versa?
-Which is more balanced and neutral in your opinion?
-What genre of music are they best for?
-Which is more portable for you? 
-(Obvious Question) Which one do you honestly prefer?
Thanks guys!
A1811