Weiss DAC/Audeze LCD-5 High End Loaner Program @TTVJAudio.com
Nov 20, 2021 at 10:11 PM Post #16 of 34
Aww, too bad. I was at work when this announcement came down. I would've loved to compare the LCD-5 to my HE-6 4-screw and 6-screw and my LCD-2's and 3. I don't know which headphone to get next, the LCD-5 or the Susvara (haven't heard either yet). Synergy-wise (HE-6 setup), I've been looking seriously at the Sus for awhile now, but I'm not going to pull the trigger without a demo somewhere.
 
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Dec 7, 2021 at 8:27 PM Post #17 of 34
LCD-5 and Weiss DAC made it here safe. Woohoo! Excited to listen and compare with my Susvara for the week.

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Dec 10, 2021 at 12:54 PM Post #18 of 34
What do you think so far? :relaxed:
 
Dec 17, 2021 at 1:45 AM Post #20 of 34
After seven days with the LCD-5 & Weiss DAC I shipped the LCD-5 to the next loaner participant. My current headphone is the HIFIMAN Susvara running off the RME ADI-2 Pro FS R DAC/AMP. The Susvara have been tremendous headphones and I find them to really live up to the praise they’re given. With all my prior headphones I always felt there could be another level of sound quality reached but after listening to the Susvara for a year I still have a hard time imagining what could sound better. The only minor nitpick I could give is sometimes I wished for better impact, especially in bass for electronic music. I found the level of dynamism/impact in headphones such as the original HIFIMAN HE-6 and Focal Utopia to give a lot of energy for music that could benefit from it.

I was curious if the LCD-5 could be similar to Susvara in technical capabilities but with more punch for music that could benefit from it. If the LCD-5 filled in some missing gaps or was a great complementary headphone I wouldn't mind picking it up. I listen to most genre’s of music but slightly weighted towards all the sub-genres of electronic music.

I initially listened to the LCD-5 on its own for a day before making comparisons. My immediate impressions were great. They sounded crisp, highly detailed, and dynamic. Clearly on similar technical level to the Susvara. The mids were slightly more elevated than I was accustomed or preferred but they sounded very neutral and balanced overall. They’re clearly a different direction from the other LCD series with a focus on a clean neutral sound - similar to nice studio monitors.

Second day I started comparing with the Susvara. I volume matched each to within 0.1db at 200hz (where the frequency response is even and levels off). Doing a frequency response sweep with SignalScope X showed levels to be near perfectly matched from 200hz on down. I played the LCD-5 with both the RME ADI 2 Pro (where it can drive both headphones) as well as the LCD-5 on the Weiss DAC. I found performance to be similar in both setups and DAC/AMP and not make a difference in all the nuanced ways that make both headphones different. I'll add the Utopia in the comparison as well although from memory, after having owned them for many years.

Soundstage
Susvara soundstage is clearly wider. The LCD-5 isn't as small as the Utopia (a headphone I owned for many years), it probably splits the difference. The Utopia soundstage was small but offered incredible depth, pinpoint precision and great layering. The LCD-5 offers all this but in a wider soundstage although not as wide as the Susvara. Susvara presents the soundscape in a very holographic way. You can close your eyes and have moments you forget you’re wearing headphones. LCD-5 always sounds like you’re having great headphones strapped on but that’s similar to almost every headphone I tried with Susvara being more an exception.

Timbre & Frequency Response
The Susvara sounds very natural with a slight warmth. I find it the most balanced of the three and the frequency response is perfect for my taste. I found the Utopia to have the slight metallic timbre and with a bit too much upper treble energy than I prefer. This frequency response coupled with its dynamic nature made it fatiguing to listen for more than 30 minutes. The LCD-5 is slightly more mid-forward than I prefer when compared to the Susvara but still very balanced. It doesn't have the slight warmth of the Susvara and sounds more similar to neutral studio monitors.

Bass
LCD-5 has very quick, detailed and tactile bass. Its impact/punch is clearly more than Susvara and close to what I remembered the Utopia to have. Susvara is not as tight, giving it a bloom in the sub-bass however it makes it sound more full. Really outstanding bass performance from the LCD-5, clean and reference class.

Mids
Mids are very detailed and excellent however a bit more elevated than I prefer. In comparison to Susvara vocals and guitars in LCD-5 standout much more. It's possible that the LCD-5 is the more correct & 'neutral' tuning and the Susvara has recessed mids but I do prefer the latter. Those who prefer more a more energetic mid-forward sound will prefer the LCD-5 tuning.

Treble
Susvara has a bit more pronounced upper treble giving cymbals and other instruments a bit more energy and shine but overall I had no issued with the treble performance of LCD-5. They sound as detailed and correct, just with a bit less shimmer.

Detail & Layering
LCD-5 are highly detailed and at initial comparison right up there with the Susvara. However on further listen the dynamic & tactile nature of the LCD-5 sometimes prevents the more subtle micro-dynamics from being noticed. I listen to a lot of electronic music that’s atmospheric in nature and the subtle nuances of the music and how samples are layered are noticed more in the Susvara. Here is the tradeoff for the dynamic and tactile nature of the LCD-5 IMO.

EQ
I found the LCD-5 to really come alive with some EQ. Adding a 3-4db bass shelf and a 2-3 db treble shelf balances out the mid-centric tuning. The dynamic and tactile sound is very impressive and those who listen to music with a lot of energy (hip-hop, dance-music, metal, etc) will be extremely impressed and probably prefer it to the more relaxed presentation of the Susvara. If the LCD-5 sounded this way without EQ I would definitely buy them. Without EQ switching from the Susvara directly to the LCD-5 the latter sounds compressed with a shouty midrange.

Overall
If I were to sum up both headphones, the LCD-5 are crisp, detailed, tactile and dynamic with a slight mid-centric tuning that can be changed with EQ. With EQ I consider them a very impressive all rounder. Susvara has a balanced, warm, slightly relaxed presentation that more easily reveals all the subtle nuances and micro-dynamics of music while sacrificing the tactility and punch that LCD-5 offers. LCD-5 could be easily driven (even with my iPhone) while Susvara is chained to a desktop amp. Additionally, I loved the build quality of the LCD-5 and much preferred it to Susvara.

After a week of listening I found many things I loved about the LCD-5 but in the end it's not my preferred tuning without EQ and that prevents me from purchasing it immediately as a complementary headphone to the Susvara. A major use-case for a complimentary headphone in this price range would be to use it in more portable situations around the house where I wouldn’t have the DSP capabilities of my desktop DAC/AMP and I’d prefer to not rely on EQ with whatever portable stack I’d have. This was the reason why I sold the Utopia despite being able to drive them easily. I wasn’t a huge fan of Utopia's tuning without EQ. However now that the LCD-5 are gone I may find myself ending up craving it as its technical capabilities were very impressive - time will tell.

Weiss DAC
I’ve been very happy with my RME ADI-2 and I’m not one to hear differences between well performing DACs but I’ll say the Weiss appears to be one top-shelf high quality and classy piece of gear. Since owning the RME ADI-2 I’m a huge fan of DAC/AMPs that have built-in digital parametic EQ. I much prefer it happen in hardware than loading and relying on some plugin on my computer. The manual is impressive and clearly shows a great deal of technical competence in the engineering of the DAC. Build quality, user interfaces and aesthetics are clearly at a premium level. Both the single-ended and balanced outputs competently drove the LCD-5 (although I couldn’t find the power output specs for the amp section). One unique feature is having the Audeze headphone correction built in. From what I could tell this EQs each Audeze model to a target reference curve so if someone masters a track with a LCD-2 using this curve, someone else with a LCD-4 can apply the same curve and get the same frequency response. I can imagine this being very useful for mastering engineers. Unfortunately even after updating to the latest firmware they didn’t have the curves for the LCD-5 so I couldn’t listen to what this target curve sounds like.

Conclusion
It’s not everyday you get loaned such high-end gear and I greatly appreciate Todd & the TTVJ team for the opportunity to join this program. I’m not sure yet if I’ll pick up the LCD-5, it’ll depend on how much I end up thinking about it and missing the headphone now that it’s gone. I would definitely order it or my next headphone from Todd after this experience and I encourage anyone who gets something out of this comparison to consider supporting TTVJ as it’s with their generosity that gave me the opportunity to listen and do this writeup.
 
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Dec 17, 2021 at 11:34 AM Post #21 of 34
Hi Guys,

I will do a LCD-5 tour once the combo tour is done, so you will get a chance to hear it for yourselves in your systems. The Weiss DAC and LCD-5 are on their way to the 2nd participant. Nice review Moshen! Thank you for participating.

Todd
 
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Dec 21, 2021 at 4:44 PM Post #22 of 34
Some short impressions of the Weiss DAC. No matter what I plug into the Weiss, the thing takes absolutely no prisoners and hits headphones with the very best clarity I've heard personally. The IEMs I love all had a better and more realistic sound. I felt like I was listening to a music in the same room as it was being recorded. On the flip side. IEMs I thought could use some improvements all sounded much worse and the Weiss DAC really brought out any down sides to the IEMs I was on the fence with. I don't quite know that it's worth it money wise but this is definitely a "buy once and forget" item. My $1100 SMSL stack(not including all the Audioquest cables) just didn't bring the same magic to all the headphones both IEMs and full sized that the Weiss DAC did.

Now for the LCD-5. I was surprised on first listen but this sounds a little mids heavy which surprised me. A little on the warm side overall with well controlled lows and tamed highs. I haven't listened to the LCD-5 long enough though to come to any final thoughts. Not quite my flavor for full sized headphones but I can see these being very genre specific.
 
Dec 21, 2021 at 5:43 PM Post #23 of 34
Some short impressions of the Weiss DAC. No matter what I plug into the Weiss, the thing takes absolutely no prisoners and hits headphones with the very best clarity I've heard personally. The IEMs I love all had a better and more realistic sound. I felt like I was listening to a music in the same room as it was being recorded. On the flip side. IEMs I thought could use some improvements all sounded much worse and the Weiss DAC really brought out any down sides to the IEMs I was on the fence with. I don't quite know that it's worth it money wise but this is definitely a "buy once and forget" item.

Yes, I concur. :relaxed:
 
Jan 21, 2022 at 9:56 AM Post #26 of 34
LCD5 and Weiss DAC arrived late yesterday. Hooked everything up last night and will begin some listening tests today. I plan on comparing the LCD5 to my LCD4 and CRBN. And the Weiss to my Yggdrasil.
 
Jan 24, 2022 at 10:36 PM Post #27 of 34
I put in a fair amount of time with the LCD-5 and think I have a handle on it. I have been a fan of the Audeze house sound for a while now, and the LCD-4 and CRBN are probably my favorite headphones. The LCD-5 is more like the LCD-X and MX4 in signature than the LCD-4. More nuetral and mid focused. The vocals really stand out.
Speed: these are very fast headphones. I think the 1266 TC and SR1A are faster, but really at this point it doesn't really matter. All three are going to deliver everything you could ask for. The CRBN strikes me as a little faster as well.
Detail: again, everything you could ask for. Because they are so balanced, the details are easy to pick out. They don't scream detail like the SR009, but the Stax headphone is very treble focused highlighting details as opposed to just presenting them.
Treble: Very clean and refined. Balanced, not elevated like many electrostats. As detailed as the 1266 TC, but with less distorsion. I always feel like there is a little grain with the TC, not so on the LCD-5. But we are splitting hairs as the TC is a fantastic headphone.
Mids: This is where the 5 differs from most of the LCD series, especially the 4. Probably the reason I will be sticking with the LCD-4. They are just so smooth in the mids. If you like the X or MX4 then the 5 is your next step.
Bass: Again a departure from the LCD-4. The 5 has good extension and detail here, but not as much quanity or richness as the 4. I believe the 4 has slower decay which makes it seem fuller. The 5 goes for speed and detail. Again it will come down to preference.

I found the LCD-5 fantastic for vocals and accoustic music. Classic rock and pop are right in it's wheel house. If you were thinking of the SR1A or an electrostat but were worried about bass or the cost of a new amp, the LCD-5 may be just the ticket. If you love the weight of the LCD2,3,4 then probably better looking elsewhere.
A fantastic headphone but a departure from classic Audeze sound. That could be good or bad depending on taste.
 
Jan 27, 2022 at 3:58 PM Post #29 of 34
Review of the Weiss coming today or this weekend. I enjoyed my time with it and have some thoughts as to who would like it signature.
 
Jan 30, 2022 at 12:25 AM Post #30 of 34
Weiss DAC 502: I want to start by thanking Todd for the opportunity to demo the Weiss and LCD-5. I have already shared my thoughts on the LCD-5 so here goes the Weiss.

Build: This is a well made piece of equipment. No fancy case work, but still well made and user friendly. All of the connection points feel very solid and the display and rotary control have nice feel to them.
Controls: This is where the Weiss really stands out. The front display is uncluttered but still contains plenty of useful info. The touch screen and rotary control are intuitive and easy to use. The remote is well laid out and seems substantial in your hand. Now for what makes the Weiss a step above many other DACs: the programmable DSP or EQ settings. 12 of them. You can set these from the website as long as your DAC is connected by USB. I didn't try to load any but seems fairly straightforward. This would be particularly handy if you have multiple headphones as well as speakers. If you use Roon the volume can be controlled in the player or by the remote or by the rotary dial. Holy choices Batman! That really sums up the DAC, lots of ways to control and customize. There are also 4 gain settings for the RCA and XLR outputs as well as the built in headphone amp.
Headphone Amp: Clean and detailed about sums it up. Although if you are spending this much on a DAC you probably already have a good amp, or should get one. I really think the headphone amp is for people who primarily run speakers and want the option to use headphones on occasion. It has decent power and is clean sounding with a quiet background. However it didn't sound as good with my LCD-4 or Abyss 1266 TC. These are just too power hungry. It played plenty loud but bass control seemed to suffer a little.
Sound:This is a very detailed and fast sounding DAC. If you are someone who craves details, this will do it for you. However, if your looking for romantic, vinyl sounding, expansive soundstage, this may not be the DAC you're looking for. For warmer sounding speakers or headphones it may be a good match. I am used to my Schiit Yggdrasil which seems more 3D with more bass presence. If you have ever heard the difference between Multibit and Delta Sigma you know what I mean. Hard to describe but once you hear it you'll know. Now which you prefer, ultimate detail or spacious , is a personal choice. I never felt any details were lost by the Weiss, it is very revealing. Feed it high quality tracks and it squeeze every drop of resolution out of them.
Conclusion: If you are looking for a DAC to use with multiple headphones/speakers the Weiss is worth a listen. The included headphone amp is more of a bonus than a necessity. I think for a speaker guy it would be worth the added convenience. If you already have a headphone amp I would go with the version minus the amp. At this price point a lot is expected. And if you are a detail guy or one who likes to tweek the sound using EQ the Weiss should be on your short list.
 

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