[dgjl]

If you like the Ztella then I think that you should definitely try the Onyx.

I'm happy with the W2 for daily use at the moment. As the Onyx is another power hungry DAC I'm not sure I'm not sure I want to spend the £/$ to try that too. What I would like is something less battery chewing and small, but still with an elegant sound. Ztella is the best I've heard so far.

 

[Ichos]

I'm happy with the W2 for daily use at the moment. As the Onyx is another power hungry DAC I'm not sure I'm not sure I want to spend the £/$ to try that too. What I would like is something less battery chewing and small, but still with an elegant sound. Ztella is the best I've heard so far.

And you should stick with it because at this price point it is difficult to find something so good with similar sound signature.
ESS based dongles like the Shanling UA1 might suit your taste but I don't think that they are better.

 

[digititus]

@digititus

I would like to thank you for pointing me to the manufacturer response.

It is another proof of how vague , wrong and deliberately controlled is the ASR website.

Quoting from the manufacturers answer where he proves with detailed measurements the following

"
So, to sum up, Rhodium:

- can output 1 Vrms into a 32 Ohm load
- will generate 3 mW into a 300 Ohm load, and 30+ mW into a 32 Ohm load
- will have < 0.008% THD @ 1 kHz @ 30 mW output (1Vrms into 32 Ohms)
- has even better performance at typical 1 mW output listening levels
- was designed so that tradeoffs benefitted typical listening levels rather than rarely-used full output levels
- is not optimal for high impedance, large/inefficient cans
- is extremely portable

Oh, lastly: we use the ALC5686, not the 4050 as shown in a previous picture. It's a bigger package (6mm x 6.5mm) but with finer pitched pins. We also have a higher tolerance oscillator, and selected every cap in the system with an eye towards superior performance in the small package, but when tradeoffs arose we chose to give priority to typical listening levels (-25 dBFS to -10 dBFS) rather than full/max output (0 dBFS).

I hope this is instructive; for anyone wanting additional tests or information about our APx setup, please feel free to ask.

Dan Wiggins
Periodic Audio Inc."

And as always silence from Mr. ASR

I disagree. Both sets of measurements were taken under different conditions. ASR measures under maximum load (as a constant for all equipment). Periodic doesn't contradict this data as their THD/N data are very similar. However, Periodic describes their setup under realistic / real world loads with the explanation (rightly IMO) that not everyone will be running their DAC/Amp under maximum load. Both approaches have merit and both are welcome. There is nothing wrong or vague in how this data was collected or presented and with the balanced commentary from Dan Wiggins, I think it is very useful for potential customers.

 

[Ichos]

A potential user is mostly interested on how a specific device is going to perform under real world conditions and not under theoretical scientific hypothesis.
In that account measuring and presenting results in contradiction with the intended use is misleading or at least irresponsible.

And that is because most readers don't know or understand the exact measuring conditions and they are not going to read all the comments to the end in order to discover the manufacturers response.

So at the end we are just served with the final verdict that the Rhodium is not recommended don't buy it.

Very , very misleading and irresponsible.

IMHO.

(At this point I feel like quoting the Period Audio response into my review)

 

[digititus]

A potential user is mostly interested on how a specific device is going to perform under real world conditions and not under theoretical scientific hypothesis.
In that account measuring and presenting results in contradiction with the intended use is misleading or at least irresponsible.
IMHO.

Yes and no. If you want to make a comparison, there needs to be a standard set of test conditions. Also, whilst a manufacturer has an intention for how their product may be used, not all users will do so. The ASR data is not misleading at all and was the reason why Dan was asked to comment on it, which he did very well. There is no contradiction between them. The product is meant for easy to drive IEM's and not difficult to drive headphones. This is well represented by both sets of data.

 

[Ichos]

Yes and no. If you want to make a comparison, there needs to be a standard set of test conditions. Also, whilst a manufacturer has an intention for how their product may be used, not all users will do so. The ASR data is not misleading at all and was the reason why Dan was asked to comment on it, which he did very well. There is no contradiction between them. The product is meant for easy to drive IEM's and not difficult to drive headphones. This is well represented by both sets of data.

I don't know if he was invited to comment by the ASR themselves or a third party viewer.
In any case if someone doesn't dive into the comments he will be served with the impression that this is a bad performing DAC.
So Mr. Wiggins comment should be moved right under the original measurements or ASR should comment that this performs excellent for the intended use as it is very easy to tell by listening to it as I did.

Anyway thanks for the input , let's not detail the thread.

 

[axhng]

Received the cx31993 earlier, and thought I would share my 2 cents after using them for a short while. Probably should preface it by saying this is my own subjective opinion. I don't have measurements or what not to back it up, and I've only tried a handful of them. So take it with a grain tablespoon of salt.

My first impressions were done on my Mac Mini with the ER4XR by the way. important point to note since the Apple USB-C dongle is pretty useless on android phones. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Anyway, for me I still prefer how the Apple USB-C dongle sounds over the CX31993. I think dynamics are a little better, slightly better clarity, slightly more natural sounding overall. The track i spent the most time on was Yorushika's "That's Why I Gave Up on Music" (24bit/48kHz ALAC from ototoy IIRC), particularly around the 1:45 to 2:30. It's pretty busy track with a ton of instruments going on around that region. Apart from the things I mentioned earlier, I also noticed that the female vocal is a bit more distant sounding. BTW, the song wasn't an intentional choice or like a super great test track or what. I just happened to be listening to this song at that time and noticed the difference since I have listened to this song a ton of times with the Apple dongle.

Also when I roughly try to match the volume output, the volume level I use on my mac mini is lower on the Apple dongle compared to the CX31993 by about 5-7% or so. (again, if you're using an android phone, the apple dongle has a pretty low and almost unusable level of volume output)

I also happen to have the JM04 Pro (realtek 5686) which I purchased late last year, and I find that a bit nicer compared to the CX31993 too actually, though not as good or as clean sounding as the apple USB-C adapter. Volume level is somewhere in between the two as well. I did test them with a pair of 300ohms QIGOM white lotus earbuds too, and the results were the same. That said, all three kinda struggled to drive them properly which I did kinda expect, but just tested for the fun of it.

So my overall personal view is that they're fine, but not mind blowing to me. Anyway, seen quite a few folks ordering this, so looking forward to see their opinions on it too. With cheap chi fi stuff it's always hard to say if it's a QC issue, or the manufacturer did a switcheroo later on with inferior parts after the product gain popularity. So the more feedback we have here, the better it is for the community.

Peace.

 

[whatsupbras]

Astell & Kern PEE51 Review

First, I am a newbie to the whole headphone scene, I just recently purchased a pair of Sennheiser HD58x and was plugging them directly into the 3.5mm jack of my Macbook Pro 16"

I found that i was maxing the volume out and i could still comfortably listen to the headphones - meaning I needed an amp.

I originally was going to get a JDS Atom after using my friends for a few days and liking the sound it produced.

But I use my laptop in my bed/couch 90% of the time so i wouldnt be able to enjoy the Atom as much.

I set out to find a portable solution - tried the Apple USB-C dongle and it just couldnt really compare to the Atom.

So i dug deeper leading me to Osprey's legendary post (RIP)

I was between the Razr Onyx ($195 shipped with student discount) and the PEE51 ($165 shipped).

Both were also highly rated (in the high 90s i believe someone correct me if i am wrong) by Osprey.

Another draw was unlike most of the options on Osprey's list of 40 of the best dongles - the Onyx and the PEE51 were actually available to be shipped in less than a week. I didnt want to wait 2-6 weeks to receive a dongle, this played a role in my selection process as well.

I purchased from Crutchfield and their customer service was phenomenal. Only thing is I wish they offered SquareTrade warranty directly through their website and they do with other products so unsure why this is the case for the PEE51.

When i received the Astell & Kern dongle i realized that if i were to use this dongle while plugged into my laptop on the couch or in bed the cord attached to the dongle would hang down due to the weight of the dongle and the HD58x 3.5mm plug.

I believe the dongle at the point of attachment is sturdy enough and designed in such a way that it wont put undue pressure on the USB-C port but i have questions about the cable where it meets the molding - esp when it means if it fails you are left with a $165 useless piece of plastic

Trusting that little tiny cable - no matter what kind of copper or fancy wires they put into it - was tough so i purchased an accidental squaretrade warranty for like $41 - they have paid out over $2k worth of warranty claims on multiple items for me in the past 10 years so i feel comfortable to actually use and abuse this dongle without worrying about any cable breaking off

Now let's get to the actual review - again i am a newbie so i dont have the terminology and know how to describe what I am hearing so i will do a comparison to what i have heard

For me - the PEE51 sounds as good or better than the JDS Atom. Ive heard the PEE51 described as warm and i would definitely agree it sounded warmer than the JDS Atom. I dont know how accurate that description is but side by side - i preferred listening to the PEE51 over the JDS Atom.

I can hear the separation of the different instruments very clearly with both the Atom and PEE51 but the sound through the Astell & Kern just sounds more pleasing to my ear.

Maybe someone can explain this part out to me.

As mentioned prior, with my HD58x plugged directly into the Macbook Pro at 100% volume i could comfortably listen - yes it was loud but not ear damaging.

With the PEE51 at 100% volume on Apple Music and about 85% on Mac system volume (3 volume bars in the MacOS away from max volume) - i can not increase the volume without feeling like my ears are going to be blown off!

With the JDS Atom at 100% volume on Apple Music i only needed about 60% of the volume on MacOS to get to the same volume - does this mean the JDS Atom has more power? And if it has more power than the PEE51 shouldnt that mean it would produce a more fuller / better sound?

I paid $200 with the warranty for the PEE51 and while some may say that is stupid and I could have made a much better DAC + AMP stack separately via desk units.

But I received a simple, portable, compact DAC/AMP with a great fit and finish that requires that to me sounds as good or better than the JDS Atom.

If I only have to pay $65 (to $100 with warranty) more for the same sound in a portable package that doesnt limit me to my desk and a AC adapter then i would gladly pay it again.

I want to thank Osprey for his fine 40 dongle review - that needed to be a stickied PDF in every major audio forum/Reddit.

I was originally considering the Airpods Max at over $600 with AppleCare+ - the only other headphones i owned were the Airpods Pro and Bose QC35II.

Instead I spent $440 after tax for a pair of HD58x with warranty, Dekoni Elite Velour pads, and the PEE51 with 3 years warranty.

For $150 i feel like this set up sounds much better than the Airpods Max I compared them to and honestly about half as good (which is not bad for what i paid) as my buddy's set up and i know he spent near $1k for the headphones alone and he has a fancy tube amp.

I love my set up so without falling to deep into the next segment of the rabbit hole - where do i go from here if i want to upgrade the HD58x into a better set of cans (improve soundstage, comfort) - hopefully a set of cans that can be powered comfortably with the PEE51.

If anyone has any questions id be happy to answer as best as i could!

 

[robar]

Received the cx31993 earlier, and thought I would share my 2 cents after using them for a short while. Probably should preface it by saying this is my own subjective opinion. I don't have measurements or what not to back it up, and I've only tried a handful of them. So take it with a grain tablespoon of salt.

My first impressions were done on my Mac Mini with the ER4XR by the way. important point to note since the Apple USB-C dongle is pretty useless on android phones. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Anyway, for me I still prefer how the Apple USB-C dongle sounds over the CX31993. I think dynamics are a little better, slightly better clarity, slightly more natural sounding overall. The track i spent the most time on was Yorushika's "That's Why I Gave Up on Music" (24bit/48kHz ALAC from ototoy IIRC), particularly around the 1:45 to 2:30. It's pretty busy track with a ton of instruments going on around that region. Apart from the things I mentioned earlier, I also noticed that the female vocal is a bit more distant sounding. BTW, the song wasn't an intentional choice or like a super great test track or what. I just happened to be listening to this song at that time and noticed the difference since I have listened to this song a ton of times with the Apple dongle.

Also when I roughly try to match the volume output, the volume level I use on my mac mini is lower on the Apple dongle compared to the CX31993 by about 5-7% or so. (again, if you're using an android phone, the apple dongle has a pretty low and almost unusable level of volume output)

I also happen to have the JM04 Pro (realtek 5686) which I purchased late last year, and I find that a bit nicer compared to the CX31993 too actually, though not as good or as clean sounding as the apple USB-C adapter. Volume level is somewhere in between the two as well. I did test them with a pair of 300ohms QIGOM white lotus earbuds too, and the results were the same. That said, all three kinda struggled to drive them properly which I did kinda expect, but just tested for the fun of it.

So my overall personal view is that they're fine, but not mind blowing to me. Anyway, seen quite a few folks ordering this, so looking forward to see their opinions on it too. With cheap chi fi stuff it's always hard to say if it's a QC issue, or the manufacturer did a switcheroo later on with inferior parts after the product gain popularity. So the more feedback we have here, the better it is for the community.

Peace.

Thank you for your detailed impressions! It seems that apple has some magic going on with native dongles. I wonder if the chi-fi dongles actually perform at their best with apple or maybe they would benefit from an android/PC source that is less biased towards native apple devices? I don't have any apple products so no experience with this. But it would be interesting to compare appe dongle+apple with chi-fi dongle+non-apple system.

 

[slex]

Received the cx31993 earlier, and thought I would share my 2 cents after using them for a short while. Probably should preface it by saying this is my own subjective opinion. I don't have measurements or what not to back it up, and I've only tried a handful of them. So take it with a grain tablespoon of salt.

My first impressions were done on my Mac Mini with the ER4XR by the way. important point to note since the Apple USB-C dongle is pretty useless on android phones. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Anyway, for me I still prefer how the Apple USB-C dongle sounds over the CX31993. I think dynamics are a little better, slightly better clarity, slightly more natural sounding overall. The track i spent the most time on was Yorushika's "That's Why I Gave Up on Music" (24bit/48kHz ALAC from ototoy IIRC), particularly around the 1:45 to 2:30. It's pretty busy track with a ton of instruments going on around that region. Apart from the things I mentioned earlier, I also noticed that the female vocal is a bit more distant sounding. BTW, the song wasn't an intentional choice or like a super great test track or what. I just happened to be listening to this song at that time and noticed the difference since I have listened to this song a ton of times with the Apple dongle.

Also when I roughly try to match the volume output, the volume level I use on my mac mini is lower on the Apple dongle compared to the CX31993 by about 5-7% or so. (again, if you're using an android phone, the apple dongle has a pretty low and almost unusable level of volume output)

I also happen to have the JM04 Pro (realtek 5686) which I purchased late last year, and I find that a bit nicer compared to the CX31993 too actually, though not as good or as clean sounding as the apple USB-C adapter. Volume level is somewhere in between the two as well. I did test them with a pair of 300ohms QIGOM white lotus earbuds too, and the results were the same. That said, all three kinda struggled to drive them properly which I did kinda expect, but just tested for the fun of it.

So my overall personal view is that they're fine, but not mind blowing to me. Anyway, seen quite a few folks ordering this, so looking forward to see their opinions on it too. With cheap chi fi stuff it's always hard to say if it's a QC issue, or the manufacturer did a switcheroo later on with inferior parts after the product gain popularity. So the more feedback we have here, the better it is for the community.

Peace.

I received my CX31339 yesterday. Not for avid audiophile for sure

 

[slex]

Astell & Kern PEE51 Review

First, I am a newbie to the whole headphone scene, I just recently purchased a pair of Sennheiser HD58x and was plugging them directly into the 3.5mm jack of my Macbook Pro 16"

I found that i was maxing the volume out and i could still comfortably listen to the headphones - meaning I needed an amp.

I originally was going to get a JDS Atom after using my friends for a few days and liking the sound it produced.

But I use my laptop in my bed/couch 90% of the time so i wouldnt be able to enjoy the Atom as much.

I set out to find a portable solution - tried the Apple USB-C dongle and it just couldnt really compare to the Atom.

So i dug deeper leading me to Osprey's legendary post (RIP)

I was between the Razr Onyx ($195 shipped with student discount) and the PEE51 ($165 shipped).

Both were also highly rated (in the high 90s i believe someone correct me if i am wrong) by Osprey.

Another draw was unlike most of the options on Osprey's list of 40 of the best dongles - the Onyx and the PEE51 were actually available to be shipped in less than a week. I didnt want to wait 2-6 weeks to receive a dongle, this played a role in my selection process as well.

I purchased from Crutchfield and their customer service was phenomenal. Only thing is I wish they offered SquareTrade warranty directly through their website and they do with other products so unsure why this is the case for the PEE51.

When i received the Astell & Kern dongle i realized that if i were to use this dongle while plugged into my laptop on the couch or in bed the cord attached to the dongle would hang down due to the weight of the dongle and the HD58x 3.5mm plug.

I believe the dongle at the point of attachment is sturdy enough and designed in such a way that it wont put undue pressure on the USB-C port but i have questions about the cable where it meets the molding - esp when it means if it fails you are left with a $165 useless piece of plastic

Trusting that little tiny cable - no matter what kind of copper or fancy wires they put into it - was tough so i purchased an accidental squaretrade warranty for like $41 - they have paid out over $2k worth of warranty claims on multiple items for me in the past 10 years so i feel comfortable to actually use and abuse this dongle without worrying about any cable breaking off

Now let's get to the actual review - again i am a newbie so i dont have the terminology and know how to describe what I am hearing so i will do a comparison to what i have heard

For me - the PEE51 sounds as good or better than the JDS Atom. Ive heard the PEE51 described as warm and i would definitely agree it sounded warmer than the JDS Atom. I dont know how accurate that description is but side by side - i preferred listening to the PEE51 over the JDS Atom.

I can hear the separation of the different instruments very clearly with both the Atom and PEE51 but the sound through the Astell & Kern just sounds more pleasing to my ear.

Maybe someone can explain this part out to me.

As mentioned prior, with my HD58x plugged directly into the Macbook Pro at 100% volume i could comfortably listen - yes it was loud but not ear damaging.

With the PEE51 at 100% volume on Apple Music and about 85% on Mac system volume (3 volume bars in the MacOS away from max volume) - i can not increase the volume without feeling like my ears are going to be blown off!

With the JDS Atom at 100% volume on Apple Music i only needed about 60% of the volume on MacOS to get to the same volume - does this mean the JDS Atom has more power? And if it has more power than the PEE51 shouldnt that mean it would produce a more fuller / better sound?

I paid $200 with the warranty for the PEE51 and while some may say that is stupid and I could have made a much better DAC + AMP stack separately via desk units.

But I received a simple, portable, compact DAC/AMP with a great fit and finish that requires that to me sounds as good or better than the JDS Atom.

If I only have to pay $65 (to $100 with warranty) more for the same sound in a portable package that doesnt limit me to my desk and a AC adapter then i would gladly pay it again.

I want to thank Osprey for his fine 40 dongle review - that needed to be a stickied PDF in every major audio forum/Reddit.

I was originally considering the Airpods Max at over $600 with AppleCare+ - the only other headphones i owned were the Airpods Pro and Bose QC35II.

Instead I spent $440 after tax for a pair of HD58x with warranty, Dekoni Elite Velour pads, and the PEE51 with 3 years warranty.

For $150 i feel like this set up sounds much better than the Airpods Max I compared them to and honestly about half as good (which is not bad for what i paid) as my buddy's set up and i know he spent near $1k for the headphones alone and he has a fancy tube amp.

I love my set up so without falling to deep into the next segment of the rabbit hole - where do i go from here if i want to upgrade the HD58x into a better set of cans (improve soundstage, comfort) - hopefully a set of cans that can be powered comfortably with the PEE51.

If anyone has any questions id be happy to answer as best as i could!

Not sure about JDS atom spec, if whatever you are connected to are battery powered, you will likely have a clean playtime away from wallplugs. PEE51 have duo dac design, separation will be better then JDS if its a single dac?

If you still like PEE51 much, other upgrade are to go external amping from PEE51, oh yeah ...battery powered too.

 

[axhng]

Thank you for your detailed impressions! It seems that apple has some magic going on with native dongles. I wonder if the chi-fi dongles actually perform at their best with apple or maybe they would benefit from an android/PC source that is less biased towards native apple devices? I don't have any apple products so no experience with this. But it would be interesting to compare appe dongle+apple with chi-fi dongle+non-apple system.

I did try the CX31993 and JM04 Pro with android phones too (pixel 3 and HTC u12+) with poweramp player (i know not the best option probably in terms of output, but that's the app i prefer because of the UI) and still found the apple dongle a bit nicer. Though I think they sound a bit better on my android phones than they did on my computer? But this will be kinda hard to really compare since the time needed to unplug, plug in and adjust the volume to a match the levels (the volume resets all the time for some reason on my mac mini), is probably too long for my brain to properly remember how they sound. And i'm not quite willing to buy the same dongle again just for this test.

Anyway, another test I did after my previous post was to use the cables (both without mic) from the BL01 and BL03 (which is the same... i think), put the left and right side on a different cable, then use MacOS's audio MIDI setup to output to both apple dongle and the CX31993 (named as TTGK audio on MacOS) at the same time to match the volume.

The difference was around ~10% give or take. Apple dongle can match the volume output of the CX31993 at a lower volume level. This is probably not the most accurate way to test it, and there might even be another factor affecting the result, which is my auditory acuity for my left and right ear might not be 100% identical. But this is the only thing I can come up with, with the gear I have on hand. I did swap the left and right side of the earphones and repeated the test though, and it's around there still. I tested it on both BL01 and 03 too. It would probably be even better if I have another 2 identical cable that I can use to verify what I hear, but sadly I don't have other options on hand.

Also, using macOS "sound" settings after matching the volume level using my ears, I switched between the 2 output to compare them side by side, and I used a different track this time round (Ado's Gira Gira, again, just because i've listened to the song a ton recently) I'm hearing more or less the same things that I've described in my previous post as well. Again, it's not the most foolproof method, but it's a quick and dirty way for me to compare them side by side. I did the same swapping between the left and right side of the earphones as well, and tested with both BL01 and 03 too.

Anyway, again, this is based on my ears, my preference, my brains, the gear I have, etc. There are so many other factors at play here too. So it is a subjective opinion like all things related to audio, so take with a grain of salt. As long as you like how it sounds, don't let what other people think affect your enjoyment of the product. End of the day, I think the reason we all fell into this "audio" rabbit hole is that we enjoy listening to music, so as long as you enjoy it, it doesn't really matter what other people think. Peace

 

[povidlo]

New high-end dongle:
YIN LU MEI S4 AK4497

If you, like me, thought L&P W2 is costly... well, this one goes for $500.

It does feature whopping 4.5Vrms SE / 9Vrms BAL output level among some other impressive hardware specs.

 

[eloelo]

New high-end dongle:
YIN LU MEI S4 AK4497

If you, like me, thought L&P W2 is costly... well, this one goes for $500.

It does feature whopping 4.5Vrms SE / 9Vrms BAL output level among some other impressive hardware specs.

This weighs more than twice of the W2. Does it still qualify as a dongle lol

 

[slex]

Mini dap without screen, wifi, bluetooth ok, im exaggerating.