[hifimanrookie]

Has your superamp been delivered yet? I've not been in the HE-500 thread since I flogged mine.

Nope...still waiting...
And its no super amp... But it what it does is, is the most expensive audio equipment i ever bought for my home.. as my code-x B lack Edition is the most expensive thing i ever put on my head

I still have to find out how super they will sound together...or how ****ty... U never know

 

[Paul Graham]

Frank, Ive left you an important PM mate. 

 

[som4ew]

After 5 months, I have received my HD800 Black Widow on the eve of Christmas day, it look gorgeous and precious with top quality hand made as usual. It is one of my best investment in headphone, with over 200 hours burn-in, it turn a very good headphone HD800 into a great Headphone. I like HD800 for it’s wide sound stage and instrument placement, pace, but that come with ear piecing treble and short in instrument timber and instrument realism. I have it Anaxilus mod modified, but that still not really cure the ear bleeding treble. Trying new amps with no avail, (I am using Earmax SE with NOS ’60 Seimen E88CC ) from Bakoon HP-1 to Yulong with no better than Earmax sometime even worst. My ATH L3000 is not strong in sound stage width but it second to none on instrument timber, piano, drums and timpani first note attack, are real and life size, HD800+Toxic cable Black Widow +Anaxilus come to very close to L3000 in this department, gaining this make HD800+Toxic cable Black Widow +Anaxilus mod an all rounded musical headphone. With the second hand HD800 now is on sale at 7-900 usd. + Toxic cable Black Widow, it make this combination a bargain. What I should do next is to Un-Anaxilus mod and see what is the result, but at this moment the joy of music from HD800 is so addicted that I am too immersed in to have anything done. Thanks Frank

 

[Hipper]

Toxic Silver Poison Balanced for HD800
 
I ordered these in May 2013. I had been listening to the HD800s with a TEAC UD-h01 DAC. My set up was a PC with Windows 8, Jriver and music (only ripped Red Book Cds) on a hard drive in the PC. This was connected to the TEAC via USB and at first I used the TEACs own ¼” headphone jack. The sound was very detailed throughout the frequency range but the bass, whilst all the notes were there, was not strong enough to give that bottom that completes the musical picture. It was though still very nice listening.
 
However, I have a Headroom Blockhead balanced amp from nine years ago and wanted to listen through that so I ordered the Silver Poison balanced cables with a pair of three pin Neutrik XLR plugs.
 

 
Finally the Silver Poisons arrived after a seven month wait. I was not bothered about appearance but practicalities so I was not impressed with the uncovered weaved cables at the headphone end (as they can chafe on zipped clothing), the heavy weight of the metal cable splitters at each end (leading to strange twists at times), and the Neutrik 3 pin XLR plugs because they had no left/right markings on them. I put a dab of red paint on the right one once I identified it. All these are rather petty problems but worth pointing out nevertheless.
 

 
Anyway I plugged them in with out any problems. So the set up was now PC-TEAC DAC-Blockhead amp. Of course the cables need some burn time but I never bother with that. I just listen and take it from there. Well, not surprisingly, the sound was a bit disappointing. The bass was good. The Blockhead is noted for strong bass and it delivered - a bit too strong for my taste. The treble was also good - better even then from the TEAC‘s own amp. It was the mids that were the problem - they seemed recessed. However even after just eight hours or so this seemed to be improving - or I was getting used to the sound.
 

 
I then borrowed a T+A DAC8 for trialling. There are various filter options on this DAC but choosing what sounded the best (called ‘pure Bezier interpolator‘) I got a different sound. Now there was a bit less bass but still with the detail - just right I think. The mid range was lovely - acoustic guitars, harmony singing, a touch more information. The highs however were a tiny bit less than the TEAC. Subtle percussion on a very few tracks which I’d never heard before on my speakers or headphones were heard with the TEAC and I liked that. A pity.
 
Soundstage you ask? I’ve never understood headphone soundstage claims such as wide and deep images. To me the sound is stuck between the ears and I’ve never heard it beyond that. Is wider deeper really possible on headphones with ordinary gear (I‘m aware of the Smyth Realiser)?
 
What does this say about the Silver Poisons. Clearly even with just twenty hours use it can play whatever information is given it in good detail and musically. From my point of view it would seem I still need to find the right DAC as everything else seems capable too.
 
Were the Silver Poisons worth the seven month wait - no, of course not. It’s just a headphone cable albeit a good one. I’ve no idea how it compares to others and doubt if I’m going to try and find out. I don’t regret buying them though - they sound good to me.

 

[Toxic Cables]

  Toxic Silver Poison Balanced for HD800
 
I ordered these in May 2013. I had been listening to the HD800s with a TEAC UD-h01 DAC. My set up was a PC with Windows 8, Jriver and music (only ripped Red Book Cds) on a hard drive in the PC. This was connected to the TEAC via USB and at first I used the TEACs own ¼” headphone jack. The sound was very detailed throughout the frequency range but the bass, whilst all the notes were there, was not strong enough to give that bottom that completes the musical picture. It was though still very nice listening.
 
However, I have a Headroom Blockhead balanced amp from nine years ago and wanted to listen through that so I ordered the Silver Poison balanced cables with a pair of three pin Neutrik XLR plugs.
 

 
Finally the Silver Poisons arrived after a seven month wait. I was not bothered about appearance but practicalities so I was not impressed with the uncovered weaved cables at the headphone end (as they can chafe on zipped clothing), the heavy weight of the metal cable splitters at each end (leading to strange twists at times), and the Neutrik 3 pin XLR plugs because they had no left/right markings on them. I put a dab of red paint on the right one once I identified it. All these are rather petty problems but worth pointing out nevertheless.
 

 
Anyway I plugged them in with out any problems. So the set up was now PC-TEAC DAC-Blockhead amp. Of course the cables need some burn time but I never bother with that. I just listen and take it from there. Well, not surprisingly, the sound was a bit disappointing. The bass was good. The Blockhead is noted for strong bass and it delivered - a bit too strong for my taste. The treble was also good - better even then from the TEAC‘s own amp. It was the mids that were the problem - they seemed recessed. However even after just eight hours or so this seemed to be improving - or I was getting used to the sound.
 

 
I then borrowed a T+A DAC8 for trialling. There are various filter options on this DAC but choosing what sounded the best (called ‘pure Bezier interpolator‘) I got a different sound. Now there was a bit less bass but still with the detail - just right I think. The mid range was lovely - acoustic guitars, harmony singing, a touch more information. The highs however were a tiny bit less than the TEAC. Subtle percussion on a very few tracks which I’d never heard before on my speakers or headphones were heard with the TEAC and I liked that. A pity.
 
Soundstage you ask? I’ve never understood headphone soundstage claims such as wide and deep images. To me the sound is stuck between the ears and I’ve never heard it beyond that. Is wider deeper really possible on headphones with ordinary gear (I‘m aware of the Smyth Realiser)?
 
What does this say about the Silver Poisons. Clearly even with just twenty hours use it can play whatever information is given it in good detail and musically. From my point of view it would seem I still need to find the right DAC as everything else seems capable too.
 
Were the Silver Poisons worth the seven month wait - no, of course not. It’s just a headphone cable albeit a good one. I’ve no idea how it compares to others and doubt if I’m going to try and find out. I don’t regret buying them though - they sound good to me.

Thank you for your impressions, it is always appreciated.
 
Please let me quickly point out a couple of things. Both ends on the cables are marked with L and R, if you look at the picture you posted showing the red blob on the connector, on that same connector where the wire comes out and at the end of the strain relief you can see the letter R (can be seen on picture) and the left side will have the letter L.
 
Regarding that second picture, this looks like the 2 wires were not untwisted before plugging them in, as you can can see from the first picture, this is how they should be plugged in and once the are, the weight of the cable will stop the wires twisting unless you did not straighten out the cable before plugging it to the headphone's. Not untwisting the wires before you plug them in, can also damage the cable. I understand it's just a cable, but reasonable care needs to be taken, as with anything.
 
The wight of the splitters are only 8g each, 8g is something most people would hardly notice. I would be more then happy to take them off and replace with heatshrink.
 
Regarding the uncovered ends past the Y split, my sleeved cables always come like this. I like to think most know this before ordering. You should not have any issues with it occasionally rubbing against something, the wires are quite durable, unless you start swinging on them 

 
I always recommend burn in with silver cables, after 8 hours you will notice improvements as you did, but will start getting even better with 50+ hours on it and sound it's best with 200+ hours.  The Widow seems to need less then the Poison.
 
 
Sorry lads, the last week has been hectic, i have been all over the place. I will reply to every single email and PM i have tomorrow, if you don't hear from me by Sunday, please send over another PM.

 

[AManAnd88Keys]

Soundstage you ask? I’ve never understood headphone soundstage claims such as wide and deep images. To me the sound is stuck between the ears and I’ve never heard it beyond that. Is wider deeper really possible on headphones with ordinary gear (I‘m aware of the Smyth Realiser)?
 
What does this say about the Silver Poisons. Clearly even with just twenty hours use it can play whatever information is given it in good detail and musically. From my point of view it would seem I still need to find the right DAC as everything else seems capable too.
 
Were the Silver Poisons worth the seven month wait - no, of course not. It’s just a headphone cable albeit a good one. I’ve no idea how it compares to others and doubt if I’m going to try and find out. I don’t regret buying them though - they sound good to me.

Ok... You say you have never understood claims about differences in soundstage in headphones, which says to me that you still have to hear good headphones and/or a proper setup.
Then you go on, telling us that "it can play whatever information is given in good detail und musically" (=musicality?). Then you say you probably need a better, i.e. "the right" DAC. So the cable seems good to you (sound quality-wise) but you are not so satisfied with your source.
And in the end you conclude that the Silver Poisons are not worth the wait, because they are just a headphone cable "albeit a good one". And that you have no idea how it compares to other cables which you probably won't try out anyway.
 
This review is confusing and I, for one, can't take it seriously. You have no idea about headphone soundstage, you're not satisfied with your source and you have no ability (or willingness) to try out other cables. So what's the point of this...?

 

[hifimanrookie]

Ok... You say you have never understood claims about differences in soundstage in headphones, which says to me that you still have to hear good headphones and/or a proper setup.
Then you go on, telling us that "it can play whatever information is given in good detail und musically" (=musicality?). Then you say you probably need a better, i.e. "the right" DAC. So the cable seems good to you (sound quality-wise) but you are not so satisfied with your source.
And in the end you conclude that the Silver Poisons are not worth the wait, because they are just a headphone cable "albeit a good one". And that you have no idea how it compares to other cables which you probably won't try out anyway.

This review is confusing and I, for one, can't take it seriously. You have no idea about headphone soundstage, you're not satisfied with your source and you have no ability (or willingness) to try out other cables. So what's the point of this...?

+1 i was a bit confused also because of the contradicting info ..and i for sure can hear differences on headphones..as most of us do...

 

[daltonljj]

Hey Frank left you a PM with the details not sure if you missed it cos I didnt get a reply from you. Thanks

 

[inter voice]

+1 i was a bit confused also because of the contradicting info ..and i for sure can hear differences on headphones..as most of us do...

+2 Totally agreed.  I have TWO HD800s and they are using Scorpion and BW.  I found the sound staging are exceptional.  I have no issues with HD800's bass, mid and HF.  As you all know HD800 is difficult to drive and needs a good headphone amp. and DAC to make it sing.  IMHO there is no problem with Frank's cable it is the DAC or the headphone amp. is to be blamed. 

 

[Hipper]

Thanks for the response Frank.
 
The amp end of the cable gets twisted in natural use as I remove and replace the headphones on the headphone stand. Perhaps if I paid more attention to replacing them exactly as they were the twisting wouldn't happen but it's not something I've come across with other headphones, that's why I brought it up.
 
Having looked again at the ends I can just see the 'L' and 'R' labels you mention. I never noticed them before.
 

 
AManAnd88Keys, instead of criticising me about my ignorance on headphone soundstages why don't you explain it. My equipment is pretty good yet I still don't get it. Help me! 
 
My conclusions were pretty clear - the toxic cable is good but I still need a suitable DAC. I don't need to check out other cables as I'm satisfied this will do the job. I'm not like many on here who seem own a library of cables - I'm just an ordinary music listener.
 
I've re read (again) my post and don't find it confusing. It is not a totally positive review but I've offered constructive criticism. The seven month wait is just not acceptable (babies take nine months) and Franks administration did not keep pace with his success. Hopefully that has changed.
 
But, I like the sound from the cables.

 

[AManAnd88Keys]

  Thanks for the response Frank.
 
The amp end of the cable gets twisted in natural use as I remove and replace the headphones on the headphone stand. Perhaps if I paid more attention to replacing them exactly as they were the twisting wouldn't happen but it's not something I've come across with other headphones, that's why I brought it up.
 
Having looked again at the ends I can just see the 'L' and 'R' labels you mention. I never noticed them before.
 

 
AManAnd88Keys, instead of criticising me about my ignorance on headphone soundstages why don't you explain it. My equipment is pretty good yet I still don't get it. Help me! 
 
My conclusions were pretty clear - the toxic cable is good but I still need a suitable DAC. I don't need to check out other cables as I'm satisfied this will do the job. I'm not like many on here who seem own a library of cables - I'm just an ordinary music listener.
 
I've re read (again) my post and don't find it confusing. It is not a totally positive review but I've offered constructive criticism. The seven month wait is just not acceptable (babies take nine months) and Franks administration did not keep pace with his success. Hopefully that has changed.
 
But, I like the sound from the cables.

Alright. Headphones in general are capable of delivering believable soundstage depth, that means that you get the sensation that the sound is not just coming from one fixed point in front of you, but that there are several layers or positions from which instruments, vocalists etc. project their sound. For example, you hear the singer close in front of you, behind that the guitarist and so on...
Soundstage width is something else and has often been a weak point of many headphones. I can understand that for you sound is stuck in your head and doesn't seem to come from anywhere on the sides, or that it's just plain "left right" and nothing else. You're not alone here, many people experience this phenomenon. I have made the experience that these things could help:
 
- Use good gear, especially the amp  should drive your headphones well. Check impedance, power, voltage swing...
- Listen to high quality records. Soundstage is a weak point of many records, but there are also records that are superb in that area. Binaural records are particularly outstanding. Use the search function to find out more about this.
- Use crossfeed. There are not many options for that, I for one use a Meier Audio StageDAC. I have had better DACs when it comes to detail and that, but the crossfeed turns this one into a little gem. I find it awesome, but have also read reports of people that don't seem to notice any change for the better at all. Which brings me to my last point...
- Soundstage is basically 100% psychoacoustics. That means: the experience is different for everyone, as our brains are just not exactly the same. And for some people it even doesn't work at all or never reaches the point of being satisfactory.
 
So my suggestion is: try out different gear, find some good records, make experiences with crossfeed (Phonitor (2) is THE option here)... If at the end of this journey you still say "Nope, I can't hear something I'd call soundstage" then that's alright as you gave it a try. The good thing is, you'll learn a lot about how your brain works, no matter what the outcome will be.

 

[Hipper]

Thanks AManAnd88Keys. My Headroom Blockhead has crossfeed (as well as gain, brightness filters and phase switches. The T+A DAC8 has a phase switch and four filters that offer different sounds). Indeed I also have a Meier Corda amp with this.
 
I can here instruments and voices in different places. One track for example has twin lead vocals (Matthews Southern Comfort - Sylvie from the album Later That Same Year). The first appears on the left but slightly in and the second the equivalent on the right. This is exactly the same as on my speakers, mid left and mid right. Indeed this is how I decided what was left and right on the XLR plugs. I do get instrument and voice separation where the recording has it, both left and right and to a lesser extent, back and front.
 
What I find problematic is reviewers saying they got a wide deep soundstage on a headphone. It can never be wider then your head, apart perhaps from phase issues. Perhaps what they really mean is separation.

 

[singleended58]

Frank, I've just pm'd you

 

[Toxic Cables]

  Thanks for the response Frank.
 
The amp end of the cable gets twisted in natural use as I remove and replace the headphones on the headphone stand. Perhaps if I paid more attention to replacing them exactly as they were the twisting wouldn't happen but it's not something I've come across with other headphones, that's why I brought it up.
 
Having looked again at the ends I can just see the 'L' and 'R' labels you mention. I never noticed them before.
 

 
Not a problem.
 
As for the twisting of the cable, if you straighten the cable out before you plug them in, you should not  get the problem, if it's not twisted the cable will act a little like a spring and this is what's happening with your. Try it out and let me know how you get on.  The only time this will happen then is if you move around in circles when you have the cable plugged in while listening to them.
 
I always listen to what my customers have to say and all of my cables are designed from customer feedback, to work rhe best they can.
 
I have never had anyone mention the Y splitter to be heavy on a headphone cable, i don't find it to be either. If you would like me to change it up, you can send the cable in and i will get it changed for you at no extra cost. As long as you are happy, i am happy.
 
I just got up guys, was working all night. I will start going to messages in an hour, gotta feed my snakes now. 

 

[alan_g]

I'm waiting to pay for a silver poison