[RTodd]

For sure. For one, I had no idea there were so many Jewel owners. Also telling to see how the Traillii has basically kept its seat at summit over a year since release and amidst lots of new competition.

I’d like to hear both the X and Annihilator but I think that latter may be more in my wheelhouse simply due to my proclivity for mid-bass focus versus sub bass.

I want to hear the one that sounds the least like everything else. And hope I get that instant desire to add it to my line up.

 

[HiFiHawaii808]

Cooler top three:

1) Fourte
2) LX
3) Odin

old school good.

 

[HiFiHawaii808]

Keep in mind though, I have zero headphones or desktop gear, so you’re at least as crazy as me

yeah, but I am twice your age.

 

[MaggotBrain]

As @HiFiHawaii808 once observed a top 3 really makes you think and reflect carefully on what really matters to you.

1) UM Red Halo FE
2) MMR Thummim
3) Noble Kaiser K10

Was inspired to reply while wearing the Red Halo this morning on a jog while vacationing in the Big Island and saw this burly fellow.

Red Halo is the GOAT from my experience in this hobby. It can be hard to translate into words what it does between your ears. When properly driven it is nothing short of spectacular in how accurately it translates the presentation of each instrument. If it was a chef, you would imagine it would have an unfussy mis en place. Everything is in its place. It can be a little high maintenance in that its performance is more dramatically enhanced by proper amping more than any IEM I’ve tried, but then again even if you equipped Michael Jordan with a pair of Chuck Taylors instead of his namesake shoes he would still be incredible - in other words, even the Red Halo not properly amped is way better than most anything else I have heard. The Thummim runs a close second and bests the Halo in sub bass to be sure. The K10 is the old veteran on the bench that if you reward with a fat silver cable it can still surprise with its bass presentation though a bit more subdued on treble than the other two.

If I passed the goat this morning wearing my Abyss TC I would have felt more comfortable holding my own in a head butting competition. And even if he were friendly I feared he would devour my kilobuck cable like a spaghetti noodle, so I kept my distance. So I imagine he kindly nodded at me wearing the Red Halos, and in deference I
put on The Legend of Chavo Guerrero by his favorite band, The Mountain Goats.

 

[metaljem77]

And mine too which is amazing because our libraries are so different. There really is a thing such as reference sound. But, it's not what many have tried to describe it as. It is not what the artist intended that is reference sound. Reference sound is the most agreeable sound across the most users and the most genres of music. If the sound engineer tunes their products to that curve, it will have the broadest appeal. That's for tuning alone though. Other technical attributes that don't end up showing much variance in the FR are really what differentiates great IEMs from only good ones. Take Monarch mkii, for example. It almost has the same FR as Jewel, but it is nothing like it.

I really can’t wait to try out Jewel with metal and EDM. I know I’m a bass head but it’s definitely interesting for me to hear how other iems render such genres

 

[Doug2507]

And mine too which is amazing because our libraries are so different. There really is a thing such as reference sound. But, it's not what many have tried to describe it as. It is not what the artist intended that is reference sound. Reference sound is the most agreeable sound across the most users and the most genres of music. If the sound engineer tunes their products to that curve, it will have the broadest appeal. That's for tuning alone though. Other technical attributes that don't end up showing much variance in the FR are really what differentiates great IEMs from only good ones. Take Monarch mkii, for example. It almost has the same FR as Jewel, but it is nothing like it.

I'd have to partly disagree on that. Reference is a fixed point, a standard of evaluation, that's the reason it's called reference. It's not based on majority opinion of what sounds good or bad. If you were in the studio when the track got laid down, that would be the reference. Anything else after that is colouration / skewed based on opinion, providing the technical capability is there.

Reference is such a miss-used term in hifi and stems from PR BS used years ago to distinguish TOTL product line from the "lesser" models. Most brands had "reference series" products but all had their own flavour (colouration in some form). These days reference usually implies a neutral tuning but the main aspect IMO is the technical ability of the gear, which as you've said isn't reflective of the curve. I'd go out on a limb and say most TOTL gear whether that be IEM / HP / DAP / main rig etc could be considered reference relating to today's terminology but each will add their own colouration (tuning).

A prime example that you personally can relate to would be Red. Absolutely 100% reference in terms of technical ability but like most transducers, most likely differ in tuning from original source.

Same goes for tuning transducers based on xyz amps which most manufacturers do. What differs between the product line isn't necessarily tuning / FR curve but technical merit.

That's what in this day and age reference is and it's a lot harder for transducers than amplifiers, as a 'true' amplifier technically has no colouration at all.

Anyway, beer time is over and time to get some sleep...

 

[metaljem77]

I’m a little late in my response to the poll:
Yesterday was metal day, my need for inner venting from work and family stresses.
1. Evo
2. LX
3. Red Halo FE
Today is some acoustic and vocal bliss to lead me to some calibrated calm with Red, which does these genres justice that my other IEMs can’t do as well. I’m guessing Jewel will be able to shine here too

 

[twister6]

I love how we can share anything in this thread, audio gear or not related, including nature shots or just a litter of kittens

This afternoon, my son and I went on a trail behind our house, and thought it was a great sky view to capture in our neck of the "NJ" woods

On the way back, we stopped by a small lake, saw a bunch of people gathered around with 3ft lens cameras trying to capture a picture of this bird standing still, trying to blend in. Had to zoom in with my phone from far away.

 

[RTodd]

I love how we can share anything in this thread, audio gear or not related, including nature shots or just a litter of kittens

This afternoon, my son and I went on a trail behind our house, and thought it was a great sky view to capture in our neck of the "NJ" woods



On the way back, we stopped by a small lake, saw a bunch of people gathered around with 3ft lens cameras trying to capture a picture of this bird standing still, trying to blend in. Had to zoom in with my phone from far away.

That sky is awesome.

So true about Jeff’s Cooler besides allowing us to be multi dimensional, I feel like in the Cooler we take effort to get to know each other.

Keeping it somewhat audio focused, I feel like the past 24 hours I learned a lot more about a dozen or so IEMs and what differentiates them.

 

[Frankie D]

That sky is awesome.

So true about Jeff’s Cooler besides allowing us to be multi dimensional, I feel like in the Cooler we take much more effort to get to know each other, and dare I say care.

Keeping it somewhat audio focused, I feel like the past 24 hours I learned a lot more about a dozen or so IEMs and what differentiates them.

Who cares about audio! My Easter Bread rose baby! We’ll be eating good!

Stomach ache expected in 2 hours.

 

[efftee]

The biggest problem I have with the Elysian X, and where I think the Annihilator is actually “better” is the bass. The X just doesn’t do mid bass well enough for me at all. The bass is crazy sub bassy and rumbly but really lacks any sort of body for me.

The Annihilator has the same type of timbre as the X but I find the extra mid bass presence really helps breathe some heft in the lower end.

With that said, I don’t think bass is either of their selling points.

The Elysian pair certainly doesn’t sell bass like the LX or EVO, but I have found that the source can change so much of what I hear -- the amp first, I'm still trying to figure out the current/voltage thing and what/how/why it does, then the DAC, Delta-Sigma or R2R, the Annihilator can sound like 2 different IEM! Curiously, that doesn’t happen with others I’ve tried, the Odin, Traillii, etc, I guess that’s attributable to the scalability of Annihilator. I never thought it was good for vocals and jazz, and like you, the bass wasn’t standout-ish but I was more than pleasantly surprised on my franken HM1K/Aroma power stack — a whole new ‘nother level, even the bass.

Wish you could hear it; the Subtonic boys had a listen and were quite impressed, exact words were 'never heard the Storm so good'. That's saying a lot coming from guys who design gear and have probably heard everything under Horatio's sky! IM(most)HO, amping is inexpensive (in the grand scheme of things) and make the most drastic improvements to your audio set-up. Not sure if you have a good amp; I hear the N8ii has a great LO, and how it leaps up a few notches being freed from having to internally power its DAC…

 

[aaf evo]

The Elysian pair certainly doesn’t sell bass like the LX or EVO, but I have found that the source can change so much of what I hear -- the amp first, I'm still trying to figure out the current/voltage thing and what/how/why it does, then the DAC, Delta-Sigma or R2R, the Annihilator can sound like 2 different IEM! Curiously, that doesn’t happen with others I’ve tried, the Odin, Traillii, etc, I guess that’s attributable to the scalability of Annihilator. I never thought it was good for vocals and jazz, and like you, the bass wasn’t standout-ish but I was more than pleasantly surprised on my franken HM1K/Aroma power stack — a whole new ‘nother level, even the bass.

Wish you could hear it; the Subtonic boys had a listen and were quite impressed, exact words were 'never heard the Storm so good'. That's saying a lot coming from guys who design gear and have probably heard everything under Horatio's sky! IM(most)HO, amping is inexpensive (in the grand scheme of things) and make the most drastic improvements to your audio set-up. Not sure if you have a good amp; I hear the N8ii has a great LO, and how it leaps up a few notches being freed of having to internally power its DAC…

I have no interest in amping IEMs, I like them for portability haha. At that point I'd rather just go to headphones (which I won't do)

 

[efftee]

I have no interest in amping IEMs, I like them for portability haha. At that point I'd rather just go to headphones (which I won't do)

Fair enough. But if you ever catch an opportunity, do demo it just so you know…

 

[Deezel177]

I'd have to partly disagree on that. Reference is a fixed point, a standard of evaluation, that's the reason it's called reference. It's not based on majority opinion of what sounds good or bad. If you were in the studio when the track got laid down, that would be the reference. Anything else after that is colouration / skewed based on opinion, providing the technical capability is there.

Reference is such a miss-used term in hifi and stems from PR BS used years ago to distinguish TOTL product line from the "lesser" models. Most brands had "reference series" products but all had their own flavour (colouration in some form). These days reference usually implies a neutral tuning but the main aspect IMO is the technical ability of the gear, which as you've said isn't reflective of the curve. I'd go out on a limb and say most TOTL gear whether that be IEM / HP / DAP / main rig etc could be considered reference relating to today's terminology but each will add their own colouration (tuning).

A prime example that you personally can relate to would be Red. Absolutely 100% reference in terms of technical ability but like most transducers, most likely differ in tuning from original source.

Same goes for tuning transducers based on xyz amps which most manufacturers do. What differs between the product line isn't necessarily tuning / FR curve but technical merit.

That's what in this day and age reference is and it's a lot harder for transducers than amplifiers, as a 'true' amplifier technically has no colouration at all.

Anyway, beer time is over and time to get some sleep...

Exactly, exactly this. Reference for tracks vs. Reference for IEMs vs. Reference for marketing are three very different things. To me, a reference track is a track you intimately know, which you can judge systems with. An ideal reference IEM is one that’ll “sound as different” (or carry over as little color) as possible with each track you play through it. And, reference in marketing is - more often than not - an ad for clarity and detail; not much else.

Speaking of, something I’ve noticed as my collection of self-made reference tracks has grown is they’re actually very ineffective for judging IEMs; for me, at least. Because, a mix and a master will go through so many iterations before publishing, that when an IEM makes them sound different, it won’t make them sound wrong, if that makes sense.

So, for example, when I listen to one of my tracks with a bass-boosted IEM, my brain, rather than go, “Oh, there’s more bass than there should be,” will instead go, “Ah, sounds like mix version 6 when I put in a bit more low-end.” And, there are a myriad of differences beyond bass boosts too. I don’t know if it’s the same for any other producer/engineer here, but I’ve found it much easier to judge IEMs with tracks not of my own that I only know one, definitive version of.

The Elysian pair certainly doesn’t sell bass like the LX or EVO, but I have found that the source can change so much of what I hear -- the amp first, I'm still trying to figure out the current/voltage thing and what/how/why it does, then the DAC, Delta-Sigma or R2R, the Annihilator can sound like 2 different IEM! Curiously, that doesn’t happen with others I’ve tried, the Odin, Traillii, etc, I guess that’s attributable to the scalability of Annihilator. I never thought it was good for vocals and jazz, and like you, the bass wasn’t standout-ish but I was more than pleasantly surprised on my franken HM1K/Aroma power stack — a whole new ‘nother level, even the bass.

Wish you could hear it; the Subtonic boys had a listen and were quite impressed, exact words were 'never heard the Storm so good'. That's saying a lot coming from guys who design gear and have probably heard everything under Horatio's sky! IM(most)HO, amping is inexpensive (in the grand scheme of things) and make the most drastic improvements to your audio set-up. Not sure if you have a good amp; I hear the N8ii has a great LO, and how it leaps up a few notches being freed from having to internally power its DAC…

I agree with both you and @aaf evo on this. Amps are one of the most fun links in the chain to play with, as they bring much more to the table than just tone-shaping. There are power and space-related traits to each amp, and shootouts of those can get pretty addictive. I’d second @aaf evo’s notion, though, that, while inexpensive, a portable amp’s biggest toll is portability and convenience. I used to carry a Mojo stack for a while, than a KM-01 stack after that, and it became a hassle whipping out a whole brick just to switch albums or tracks. But, if you’re used to a backpack, or you’re just sitting at home, it is a joy, indeed.

 

[pkcpga]

Anyone have a Jewel FR graph handy? Did a quick search and I'm sure one's been posted before, just didn't see it.