[Ace Bee]

@Rockwell75 and @Scuba Devils are really making it difficult to choose between Zen Pro and Dark Sky. C'mon @Scuba Devils , be out with it - how do they compare to each other?

 

[rantng]

 

[Rockwell75]

Would love to hear you thoughts on how the FD7 compares to the Zen Pro. Even a cable change to pure copper or EQing, is not cutting it for me when it comes to improving the thinness in the lower mids. Does the Zen Pro solve that?

I would say yes. From memory Zen Pro has a better tonal balance than the FD7 for me. I know some have described FD7 as "warm and bassy" but for me it was not that at all-- it achieved a tremendous amount of resolution up top but it achieved that by selling the low end short to my ears. Zen Pro does not have this problem-- it is very balanced and while there's certainly not a bass/lower mid emphasis or anything there is certainly nothing lacking there to my ears. The only ding in Zen Pro's armour for me so far is that it appears to be a little source sensitive. The upper mids as has been mentioned straddle the line of being a bit too energetic-- they sound great-- perfect even-- through my M8, quite good through my Macbook Pro but through my AK SR25ii the top end is a bit more aggressive. YMMV and all that.

At what cost?

It's not quite as purely resolving up top as the FD7.

Does the Zen Pro bring that "organic je-ne-sais quoi of Elysium's sound"?

I'd be tempted to say to say no. Elysium is quite special in that regard-- a combination of the DD mids & speedy e-stat treble gives it a sense of life and air that I'm not sure I've ever heard to the same extent in any other IEM. Elysium has a more narrow stage than the Zen Pro I think and, while it's tremendously coherent-- especially for a tribrid-- it can't top a single DD in this regard.

Also curious on how FA DarkSky compares the the Zen Pro and FD7 if that is possible.

@Scuba Devils is our man on the ground there.

@Rockwell75 and @Scuba Devils are really making it difficult to choose between Zen Pro and Dark Sky. C'mon @Scuba Devils , be out with it - how do they compare to each other?

I've never heard Dark Sky so I can't comment.

Oh snap! I knew something was coming. I hope it's got a DD doing the mids...will be hard to resist in that case.

 

[elindil]

I would say yes. From memory Zen Pro has a better tonal balance than the FD7 for me. I know some have described FD7 as "warm and bassy" but for me it was not that at all-- it achieved a tremendous amount of resolution up top but it achieved that by selling the low end short to my ears. Zen Pro does not have this problem-- it is very balanced and while there's certainly not a bass/lower mid emphasis or anything there is certainly nothing lacking there to my ears. The only ding in Zen Pro's armour for me so far is that it appears to be a little source sensitive. The upper mids as has been mentioned straddle the line of being a bit too energetic-- they sound great-- perfect even-- through my M8, quite good through my Macbook Pro but through my AK SR25ii the top end is a bit more aggressive. YMMV and all that.



It's not quite as purely resolving up top as the FD7.



I'd be tempted to say to say no. Elysium is quite special in that regard-- a combination of the DD mids & speedy e-stat treble gives it a sense of life and air that I'm not sure I've ever heard to the same extent in any other IEM. Elysium has a more narrow stage than the Zen Pro I think and, while it's tremendously coherent-- especially for a tribrid-- it can't top a single DD in this regard.



@Scuba Devils is our man on the ground there.



I've never heard Dark Sky so I can't comment.



Oh snap! I knew something was coming. I hope it's got a DD doing the mids...will be hard to resist in that case.

Thanks for taking time to reply

 

[Rockwell75]

Compared to the Zen Pro Isabellae feels like more of a specialist-- more intimate, mid-range/instrument/vocal focused. Zen Pro by comparison is balanced across the board and it wouldn't surprise me if, once the dust settled, I proclaim it the best "all rounder" I've heard. It doesn't quite sweep me off my feet and draw me into the mid-range like Isa does, and to be fair it's midrange on the whole probably isn't as emotionally evocative-- but the bass, treble and overall tonal balance & technical chops of Zen Pro is a decided step up from Isa imho.

I want to caveat the above statement-- one area where Zen Pro does shine above Isa is in the treble-- it has better extension and sparkle up top. Bass is about equal in quality, but tuned differently. It's not really fair to say that Zen Pro has a better tonal balance because I think that the goals were different with each IEM. Isa was never meant to be balanced across the FR-- it's about warmth and intimacy in the mid-range and it pulls this off marvelously. Zen Pro is more about balance and technicalities and it also pulls this off marvelously. I don't think it's really fair to say one is better than the other as they're like two fine but distinct wines. Zen Pro isolates better and is probably a better choice for a versatile all rounder. It doesn't romance me like Isa does however. As with all things YMMV.

 

[Stuff Jones]

Thank-you for your great impressions-- I have only listened so far with the M8. I will try the SR25ii later, which is a more neutral source.



The sense of vastness perhaps but Zen Pro has that single DD coherence that gives rise to a sense of cohesiveness, unity & grandeur that (Traillii aside in my experience) hybrid models struggle to match. It doesn't have freakish resolution & detail like the Odin but I can't imagine anyone feeling anything really lacking in this regard on the Zen Pro.

Yes the coherency and timbre of DDs is well worth missing out on that last bit of staging and technicalities IMO. For years I've been waiting for a decently tuned DD IEM with close enough to TOTL technicalities that at least for casual listening you don't feel like you're missing out. An added benefit is that DDs don't usually end up competing in that crazy expensive price bracket which is still too rich for my blood. This is as close as I've heard so far to that once mythical IEM.

 

[mashuto]

Oh snap! I knew something was coming. I hope it's got a DD doing the mids...will be hard to resist in that case.

I'm going to guess this is going to be a more mass produced version of the onyx. Basing that on absolutely nothing except that it appears to be the new shell shape (though maybe metal) of the honeydew/satsuma/onyx.

 

[drftr]

I listened to this:

It sounds grand like it should, with the powerful dynamic swell towards the end. You can clearly pick out the bell from the wall of sound. Mind you not as big sounding as say the Solaris, but pretty good for an IEM.

I also listened to this:

The Zen Pro straddle the line between slightly lifted and well behaved upper mids that gives them bite for strings without ever to my ears getting harsh. And the mids are even enough where all the strings (violin, viola and cello) are balanced volume wise, with violin having bite and cello having body. The bowed texture/micro dynamics is great. Separation is good enough to distinctly hear each instrument.

Finally, I listened to this:

Piano is hard to do right timbre wise. The Zen Pro does a really good job. However in the higher frequencies, the keys are a bit sharp when played dramatically (what gives the violin and electric guitar great bite). However I haven't heard piano reproduced great by an IEM - getting the timbre right across all 88 keys without multi BAs is pretty hard with a tiny DD driver, and BAs lose you that impact of key compression to my ears.

Anyway, I think these are a good choice for classical as they are pretty neutral and technical while still having good timbre and body. Just don't expect freakish soundstage or instrument separation which I don't think is possible in single DD.

Excellent write-up! Tnx much...

Especially with single DD setups I'm mostly worried about having too little definition in the low end and also when listening to more complex string ensembles, or being overly polite way up high for wood and string instruments. I take it single DD's have a very hard time to cover the whole frequency range in a perfect way and either have to compromise down low or up high. I would defenitely go for compromising on the low end; just not in quality. In between these extremes I'm mostly worried about female opera singers given the OG Zen's reputation for being (sometimes more than) a tad shouty. That would certainly drive me nuts. Not sure if you're an opera lover though...

drftr

 

[Stuff Jones]

Excellent write-up! Tnx much...

Especially with single DD setups I'm mostly worried about having too little definition in the low end and also when listening to more complex string ensembles, or being overly polite way up high for wood and string instruments. I take it single DD's have a very hard time to cover the whole frequency range in a perfect way and either have to compromise down low or up high. I would defenitely go for compromising on the low end; just not in quality. In between these extremes I'm mostly worried about female opera singers given the OG Zen's reputation for being (sometimes more than) a tad shouty. That would certainly drive me nuts. Not sure if you're an opera lover though...

drftr

I don't think your first two concerns are issues with the Zen Pro. Sub-bass might be if you listen to a lot of organ music. I'm not a huge opera fan, but do like Osvaldo Golijov with Dawn Upshaw. I'm listening to this now and I don't find it harsh. I'm in a cafe and while the Zen Pro isolate better than the Isa, isolation is still not great. So I'm listening a little louder than I would in quiet environment, and still I don't find it harsh when she hits the higher registers. Mind you, it's not relaxing or laid back either, but if it were, you probably wouldn't get the desired violin bite...

 

[Scubadevils]

@Rockwell75 and @Scuba Devils are really making it difficult to choose between Zen Pro and Dark Sky. C'mon @Scuba Devils , be out with it - how do they compare to each other?

I'll get there - unfortunately life this week getting in the way of hobbies!

 

[drftr]

100%, ZEN PRO takes the crown as best all-rounder single DD I've heard. I did wonder if FD7 might compete but a mix of your and some other impressions have cleared that up for me. I'd still like to hear it though as a lot of high praise.

But from the FD7 thread we know quite some people have sold off their 2 grand IEMs in favour for it and, more important, @tgx78 seems to have some pretty good ears too. I have learned there's less favourable and even very critical things to say about every single IEM (think @Precogvision Traillii ear-opening write-up that is extremely valuable for finding balance), so I have shifted focus to picking up love instead. As long as it doesn't get into fanboy territory of course, which unfortunately is a bit of a risk with FiiO.

drftr

 

[Scubadevils]

But from the FD7 thread we know quite some people have sold off their 2 grand IEMs in favour for it and, more important, @tgx78 seems to have some pretty good ears too. I have learned there's less favourable and even very critical things to say about every single IEM (think @Precogvision Traillii ear-opening write-up that is extremely valuable for finding balance), so I have shifted focus to picking up love instead. As long as it doesn't get into fanboy territory of course, which unfortunately is a bit of a risk with FiiO.

drftr

Yes very good points... and indeed my own love for discovering DD superpowers. Maybe I'll just buy FD7 and find out for myself. ZEN PRO in the New Year!

 

[drftr]

I'll get there - unfortunately life this week getting in the way of hobbies!

Crazy talk...

drftr

 

[Scubadevils]

Crazy talk...

drftr

Yep, I know - priorities all over the place!

 

[drftr]

BTW, Dunu came back to me saying:

"For portable audio, Europe is not a large market at all. In terms of market demand, the whole of Europe is quite small, smaller than even the United States, which also lags behind our Asian markets."

and, more interesting:

"We have plans to make a more definitive version of the LUNA sometime in the future, but as with any flagship, it's a "done when it's done" kind of thing, so there's no clear timetable on it or even defined product for it. We need to get over a significant engineering challenge, and it's to produce a beryllium foil dome with the same W-shaped morphology as the ZEN and ZEN PRO."

drftr