Dec 17, 2022 at 12:02 AM Post #14,386 of 16,944
Hi all, quick question, setting aside aesthetic preferences, which form factor of the a16 is easier to use when setting it up, or using it to create your own prior, or during every day use? Is there a difference in things like the size of the lcd screen or the positioning of the commonly used buttons that make one more practical to use? I am getting close to purchasing a new a16 and wondered about the above. I have room for either form factor. Thanks for any guidance you can provide.
You might also want to consider that if you ever want to travel with the A16, the 2U version will be easier to do that with. When I went to visit John in NJ last year, my 2U unit fit inside a soft bag and that bag fit in the carry-on test space, so I didn't have to check it. Don't know if that would be the case with the headstand version which, I think, might need some kind of custom made protective case.
 
Dec 17, 2022 at 12:11 AM Post #14,387 of 16,944
Are any of you using eARC and internal streaming apps on a TV to stream Atmos to the A16? Was previously using a Fire Stick, and was only getting Atmos from Disney+, while the other apps only played DD+ (not carrying Atmos) even though there are tons of movies and shows on Prime and Netflix with Atmos. None of them would play it from the Fire Stick.

So I just now got a C9, that has eARC (upgraded from a C8 that simply had ARC) and still the exact same issue. Only Disney+ will stream Atmos for me.
I have the C1, use the NVidia shield and get Atmos passed through just fine to the A16 for Netflix. Digital Sound Output should be set to "Passthrough" and "eARC Support" should be selected. And your HDMI inputs should be set to "bitstream".
 
Dec 17, 2022 at 3:39 AM Post #14,388 of 16,944
I have the C1, use the NVidia shield and get Atmos passed through just fine to the A16 for Netflix. Digital Sound Output should be set to "Passthrough" and "eARC Support" should be selected. And your HDMI inputs should be set to "bitstream".

Mentioned getting it to finally work in a previous reply. Tried all kinds of options (the most obvious ones first, which include your suggestions), and I think it's some kind of handshaking issue. The only way I've been able to get it to work with the C9 at least is to already have Atmos content playing through the internal speakers so that the "Dolby Vision" and "Dolby Atmos" logos pop up on screen. Then I have to turn on HDMI ARC, toggle eARC from on to off, then back on again.

It's kind of annoying, but at the same time not a super big deal. At least I now have the ability to get Atmos from the streaming apps, and a future TV upgrade will likely solve the issue anyway.
 
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Dec 17, 2022 at 11:28 AM Post #14,389 of 16,944
Right, but my point was that if the A16 was not actually working like a passthrough (it's not right, or else it wouldn't actually decode the stream and play audio?) then the output via HDMI shouldn't matter for the sound we hear from the Realiser.

I'm not sure it actually has anything to do with whether or not the Fire Stick can or cannot output 4K resolution and more the OS each stick uses. This could be inaccurate however.

The HDMI protocol tells the source device the resolution of the display device. Why Amazon has (apparently) linked Atmos playback to the display resolution is a mystery to me.
 
Dec 17, 2022 at 12:26 PM Post #14,390 of 16,944
You might also want to consider that if you ever want to travel with the A16, the 2U version will be easier to do that with. When I went to visit John in NJ last year, my 2U unit fit inside a soft bag and that bag fit in the carry-on test space, so I didn't have to check it. Don't know if that would be the case with the headstand version which, I think, might need some kind of custom made protective case.
That's a good point. Thanks for the suggestion!
 
Dec 23, 2022 at 3:57 PM Post #14,391 of 16,944
That's a good point. Thanks for the suggestion!
Personally the form factor of the A16 depends on cable management.... the display screen is small so you have a choice to put the A16 close to where you are going to listen to it or the other option is to use the ipad https://smyth-research.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/05/A16-IP-command-server-May-2020-1.pdf
so lets talk cables... if you mount either option close to your TV and/or AVR then a short HDMI cable can be used and you will need to get headphone cable extensions to connect your headphones... maybe routed under a carpet or along a wall at floor level.... but if you plan on having the A16 close to your listening station then you would need to run long HDMI cable... so if you plan on having the A16 close to your listening area.. couch/chair then you just need to ask yourself if the head stand version would be an advantage or not... and there isn't any reason to just get the 2U and supply a different headphone stand... the disadvantage to the headphone stand version is it does take up more space at the listening location and its not a mountable option if placed near the TV and or AVR..
 
Dec 23, 2022 at 7:56 PM Post #14,392 of 16,944
One more consideration about location of both A16 unit (2U as I have) and your own separate headphone stand (Stax wood stand for my SR-009) is the additional thin cable for the A16 head-tracker that is affixed to the headphone band. This is one of the complications of using a wired-powered HT (rather than the rechargeable battery powered HT as with the A8, which thus had no cable considerations).

And don't forget about the secondary thin cable going from the A16 to the set-top unit (for the head tracker). It needs to be located above the center of the top edge of the TV with its own long cable run to the A16.

And then of course there is the headphone amp itself (Stax SRM-007tII for me) which also has to be connected to the headphones, also by its own long cable run. This is affected by your viewing/listening location relative to both the TV and wherever you've got the headphone amp. Not to mention that the headphone amp must be connected either to the A16 or to an external DAC, so all of this must also be in the same vicinity for cabling.

So it's a real cable management challenge when you add in the interconnect requirements of potentially one or more source devices (going into either the A16 or the AVR if you have one), possibly/probably an AVR, and also a connected TV. Quite the challenge.

My own "solution" was to place the A16-2U on a shelf in the "entertainment rack", where all the other "source devices" and AVR already were located. So HDMI interconnects were conveniently short and standard (and all hidden from sight BEHIND the rack and equipment), with four sources going HDMI into the A16 inputs, and the A16 output feeding HDMI into the AVR, and the AVR eARC-enabled output feeding 20ft. HDMI (fiber optic) into the TV. The A16 also has an optical-out connection to my external DAC which feeds XLR to the Stax headphone tube amp (on the top surface of the rack).

I already had a 16ft Stax silver extension cable added to the primary 8ft cable that is on the SR-009 itself, in order to reach from my listening location opposite the TV to the headphone amp located on top of the equipment rack. Fortunately, Smyth includes both a primary and extension cable for the HT. So for me there was absolutely no issue with the length of this HT cable going from the headband of my SR-009 to the A16 itself. Also, Smyth provides a number "black plastic clips" that can be used (quite successfully, spaced out over the full cable length) to secure the thin HT cable to the side edge of the [extended 24ft] 6-strand flat Stax headphone cable that makes the identical run from my head over to the equipment rack where the headphone amp lives.

As-is, this cabling and device/equipment location arrangement supports my "normal viewing/listening" habits. I can listen to SOUND FROM ANY SOURCE either (a) multi-channel through he headphones connected to the A16, or (b) to 2 stereo speakers connected to the AVR. When using the 2.0 stereo speakers it's fed either from a genuine 2-channel source, or from any multi-channel source downmixed to 2.0 stereo by either the A16 (for multi-channel streaming sources) or the AVR (for eARC from apps running on the TV), or in fact by my Oppo 203 (from discs, or from DD5.1 audio from HDTV). This cabling also supports ARC/eARC audio from the TV fed to the AVR for listening to sound through the 2.0 speakers, if that's what I want to do.

Note #1: If I want to use a streaming source app running on my LG C9, and feed audio from the TV via ARC/eARC to the A16 for listening through headphones, I must physically move the HDMI cable normally running from the AVR to feed video to the TV, from the HDMI-out of the AVR over to HDMI-out of the A16. The AVR is now no longer involved, and can be powered off. But if listening to ARC/eARC audio from the TV to AVR and 2.0 speakers is acceptable I can just leave the HDMI cable as-is, going from HDMI-out of the AVR to the TV. Then the A16 is not involved and can be powered off.

Note #2: I have an Oppo 203, used to play discs. Its HDMI1-out (video only) goes to an HDMI input on the AVR, and from the AVR's HDMI-out on to the TV. HDMI2-out (bitstream multi-channel audio only) of the Oppo goes to an HDMI input on the A16 (for decoding/processing and play through optically connected external DAC/amp/headphones).

Note #3: I have a Yamaha RX-A1080 AVR which has 8 HDMI inputs, of which I use two: (1) from Oppo 203 (for video only, from disk playback and external HDMI input for cable HDTV), and (2) from A16 (for the three A/V streaming source devices feeding into the A16, i.e. Roku Ultra, ATV4K, and Shield Tube).

Note #4: I have a DBX 14/10 EQ which supports two analog 2.0 stereo (RCA) inputs, that I use in order to provide 14-band tone control to the 2.0 stereo speaker sound whenever the AVR and speakers are used to listen. One input to the EQ comes from the L/R channels of the 8-channel "preamp analog outputs" of the Oppo. I have the analog audio output of the Oppo set to "downmix to 2.0 stereo" so that if I want to listen to multi-channel source (e.g. DD5.1 on HDTV going into external HDMI of the Oppo) through 2.0 speakers the downmixing to 2.0 stereo occurs in the Oppo, which feeds its 2.0 output into the EQ, which feeds its tone-controlled 2.0 output into the AVR (via analog, associated with HDMI video from the Oppo through the "scene" setup on the AVR), and then out to the speakers. ==> So multi-channel A/V disc/HDTV source from the Oppo producing either (a) multi-channel audio from A16 and DAC/amp/headphones, or (b) 2.0 channel tone controlled audio from EQ/AVR/speakers.

Note #5: If I want to listen to 2.0 stereo speaker sound for a streaming source going into the A16, the downmixing from multi-channel to "plain" 2.0 stereo now occurs in the A16 for feeding to the optical output (with SVS specifically disabled!). The optical output goes to the external DAC, whose own RCA outputs now feed the second RCA input of the DBX EQ so that, again, 14-band tone control can be applied. The tone-controlled audio output of the EQ again feeds an analog audio input of the AVR which is again paired with the A16 HDMI video input in the AVR's "scene" configuration. ==> So any multi-channel streaming A/V source into the A16 producing either (a) multi-channel audio from DAC/amp/headphones, or (b) 2.0 channel tone-controlled audio from DAC/EQ/AVR/speakers.
 
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Dec 24, 2022 at 12:33 AM Post #14,393 of 16,944
One more consideration about location of both A16 unit (2U as I have) and your own separate headphone stand (Stax wood stand for my SR-009) is the additional thin cable for the A16 head-tracker that is affixed to the headphone band. This is one of the complications of using a wired-powered HT (rather than the rechargeable battery powered HT as with the A8, which thus had no cable considerations).

And don't forget about the secondary thin cable going from the A16 to the set-top unit (for the head tracker). It needs to be located above the center of the top edge of the TV with its own long cable run to the A16.

And then of course there is the headphone amp itself (Stax SRM-007tII for me) which also has to be connected to the headphones, also by its own long cable run. This is effected by your viewing/listening location relative to both the TV and wherever you've got the headphone amp. Not to mention that the headphone amp must be connected either to the A16 or to an external DAC, so all of this must also be in the same vicinity for cabling.

So it's a real cable management challenge when you add in the interconnect requirements of potentially one or more source devices (going into either the A16 or the AVR if you have one), possibly/probably an AVR, and also a connected TV. Quite the challenge.

My own "solution" was to place the A16-2U on a shelf in the "entertainment rack", where all the other "source devices" and AVR already were located. So HDMI interconnects were conveniently short and standard (and all hidden from sight BEHIND the rack and equipment), with four sources going HDMI into the A16 inputs, and the A16 output feeding HDMI into the AVR, and the AVR eARC-enabled output feeding 20ft. HDMI (fiber optic) into the TV. The A16 also has an optical-out connection to my external DAC which feeds XLR to the Stax headphone tube amp (on the top surface of the rack).

I already had a 16ft Stax silver extension cable added to the primary 8ft cable that is on the SR-009 itself, in order to reach from my listening location opposite the TV to the headphone amp located on top of the equipment rack. Fortunately, Smyth includes both a primary and extension cable for the HT. So for me there was absolutely no issue with the length of this HT cable going from the headband of my SR-009 to the A16 itself. Also, Smyth provides a number "black plastic clips" that can be used (quite successfully, spaced out over the full cable length) to secure the thin HT cable to the side edge of the [extended 24ft] 6-strand flat Stax headphone cable that makes the identical run from my head over to the equipment rack where the headphone amp lives.

As-is, this cabling and device/equipment location arrangement supports my "normal viewing/listening" habits. I can listen to SOUND FROM ANY SOURCE either (a) multi-channel through he headphones connected to the A16, or (b) to 2 stereo speakers connected to the AVR. When using the 2.0 stereo speakers it's fed either from a genuine 2-channel source, or from any multi-channel source downmixed to 2.0 stereo by either the A16 (for multi-channel streaming sources) or the AVR (for eARC from apps running on the TV), or in fact by my Oppo 203 (from discs, or from DD5.1 audio from HDTV). This cabling also supports ARC/eARC audio from the TV fed to the AVR for listening to sound through the 2.0 speakers, if that's what I want to do.

Note #1: If I want to use a streaming source app running on my LG C9, and feed audio from the TV via ARC/eARC to the A16 for listening through headphones, I must physically move the HDMI cable normally running from the AVR to feed video to the TV, from the HDMI-out of the AVR over to HDMI-out of the A16. The AVR is now no longer involved, and can be powered off. But if listening to ARC/eARC audio from the TV to AVR and 2.0 speakers is acceptable I can just leave the HDMI cable as-is, going from HDMI-out of the AVR to the TV. Then the A16 is not involved and can be powered off.

Note #2: I have an Oppo 203, used to play discs. Its HDMI1-out (video only) goes to an HDMI input on the AVR, and from the AVR's HDMI-out on to the TV. HDMI2-out (bitstream multi-channel audio only) of the Oppo goes to an HDMI input on the A16 (for decoding/processing and play through optically connected external DAC/amp/headphones).

Note #3: I have a Yamaha RX-A1080 AVR which has 8 HDMI inputs, of which I use two: (1) from Oppo 203 (for video only, from disk playback and external HDMI input for cable HDTV), and (2) from A16 (for the three A/V streaming source devices feeding into the A16, i.e. Roku Ultra, ATV4K, and Shield Tube).

Note #4: I have a DBX 14/10 EQ which supports two analog 2.0 stereo (RCA) inputs, that I use in order to provide 14-band tone control to the 2.0 stereo speaker sound whenever the AVR and speakers are used to listen. One input to the EQ comes from the L/R channels of the 8-channel "preamp analog outputs" of the Oppo. I have the analog audio output of the Oppo set to "downmix to 2.0 stereo" so that if I want to listen to multi-channel source (e.g. DD5.1 on HDTV going into external HDMI of the Oppo) through 2.0 speakers the downmixing to 2.0 stereo occurs in the Oppo, which feeds its 2.0 output into the EQ, which feeds its tone-controlled 2.0 output into the AVR (via analog, associated with HDMI video from the Oppo through the "scene" setup on the AVR), and then out to the speakers. ==> So multi-channel A/V disc/HDTV source from the Oppo producing either (a) multi-channel audio from A16 and DAC/amp/headphones, or (b) 2.0 channel tone controlled audio from EQ/AVR/speakers.

Note #5: If I want to listen to 2.0 stereo speaker sound for a streaming source going into the A16, the downmixing from multi-channel to "plain" 2.0 stereo now occurs in the A16 for feeding to the optical output (with SVS specifically disabled!). The optical output goes to the external DAC, whose own RCA outputs now feed the second RCA input of the DBX EQ so that, again, 14-band tone control can be applied. The tone-controlled audio output of the EQ again feeds an analog audio input of the AVR which is again paired with the A16 HDMI video input in the AVR's "scene" configuration. ==> So any multi-channel streaming A/V source into the A16 producing either (a) multi-channel audio from DAC/amp/headphones, or (b) 2.0 channel tone-controlled audio from DAC/EQ/AVR/speakers.
That's a real good one, cable management, expecially considering how spaghetti thin those head tracker related cables are, as well as how rare and unusual they are. You don't want to break one, believe me.

What I have done is as follows:

(1) Place my 2U unit in the equipment cabinet. The power brick is there as well, so only the power cord goes out the back of the cabinet to the multi plug power conditioner hidden behind the TV.

(2) There is a USB cable running from a Mele Quieter 3 mini PC to the back of the A16's USB 2 socket to accept 2 channel Qobuz audio.

(3) The set top unit rests atop the LG C1 and is run in back of the TV and though an opening in back of the AV cabinet to the A16.

(4) The LG C1 is connected via an HDMI cable from its eARC HDMI output to the A16's HDMI output/HDMI eARC input.

(5) My primary video source is an NVidia shield which is connected to the LG HDMI 2 input and its audio is relayed via eARC to the A16.

(6) A SPDIF cable connects the A16's binauralized 2-24 channel output to my OCTO Dac 8 Pro DAC with the spdif transformed to AES/EBU for the OCTO's input. and a 20 ft XLR cable connects the balanced output of the OCTO to the balanced input of the THX AAA 789 headphone amp (which is next to my Ikea Poaang listening/viewing chair, which also has a Subpac S2 tactile sub driven by the 789 amp strapped to the Poang's backrest).

(7) I run the headtracker cable from the front of the A16 user A output under a throw rug to the headtracker, so as to prevent tripping, and cable destruction.

(8) Finally I have a Hue Intuition USB based microcamera pointed at the screen of the Realizer, so the display can go to the Mele and be displayed on my LG C1 which serves as the Mele's monitor. That way I don't need to squint, or get out of my chair, or bend over to read the display of the A16. It beats all those early kludges like placing a magnifier in front of the screen by a mile, and obviates the need for a web based solution for my use case.

And it all works perfectly. I never snag a cable, never pull anything out with the wires for the most part hidden away. And it just works. I use my A16 every day with no issues and I'm able to enjoy 24 channel Atmos from Netflix, as well as other streaming video souces such as Tubi and Shudder, along with 2 channel audio form Qobuz. It requires very little manipulation of the A16 other than switching presets which are set up to have EQ's for the different headphones and room combinations I have. I have to say I'm really satisfied now that I've figured out both the sound and the ergonomics. It sounds great, and it's now very easy to use. Took a long time, but I finally got there.

I also have a 5.1 channel speaker based system. The Octo Dac 8 Pro serves as the center of that one. Six channels are dedicated to accepting 5.1 channel LPCM sound input from streaming Video from the Quieter 2 (which sends the video via HDMI to the LG). The other two channels are for the Realizer.
 
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Dec 24, 2022 at 2:47 PM Post #14,396 of 16,944
Dec 24, 2022 at 2:53 PM Post #14,397 of 16,944
Wishing all my friends of the Realiser community a wonderful holiday season.
Same to you and all my friends here. Hope you have a joyous holiday season.
 

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