Smyth Research Realiser A16

[Bccc1]

Does the windows driver work for anyone? I get a Code 52 warning in the device manager, the driver apparently isn't properly signed.
The ASIO control panel for the A16 can be opened, but doesn't detect any device.

For cable management, I did see someone using a heat shrink tube, but are there better options? I was thinking about cable sleeves like the ones used in pc modding, but for my Sennheiser HD650 they either wouldn't fit other the connectors or be to loose on the cable. Is my only option to solder my own cables?

Regarding the delay discussion: The absolute delay should definitly be normalised. I think the relative delays between speakers should be preserved, but maybe not as part of the IR, just as a pre set offset/delay value. I personally would like to be able to simply remove the relative delay, but it shouldn't be the default.

 

[esimms86]

I was wondering if any A16 owners use the device for a single type of media, e.g., just movies, just gaming or just music. I, of course, understand that, even within a single media choice there are still other options, such as 5.1, 7.1, Atmos, pre-decoded in software and converted to bitstream/LPCM to send via analog to the A16, Dolby decoded by the A16, etc. My planned way to use the A16, however, is for listening exclusively to music already decoded by software (JRiver Media Center) to 4.0, 5.1, or 7.1. What I’m ultimately trying to ask is whether any A16 users are set up with a single PRIR and a single HPEQ fed by a consistent single source so that their units are effectively plug and play? If so, how is that working out for you in the real world? Thanks.

 

[Richter Di]

Gentleman, listen up, I actually got a reply from Stephen Smyth and I'm allowed to post this.

He just gave answers to a few things but thanks us for putting this information up.

On the Brexit issues he wrote:

he added


So I'd say they don't see any problems there.


On the issues he said



He said also something about solo/mute:


-> my conclusion is: I will drop this from the list, for the time being. Maybe put this on a separate list which we will send them next year or so, when all the A16s are shipped.
At the moment they seem to be very busy with testing and shipping units. So it's really cool that they still found some time to give us those FW updates!

Many thanks to the Smyth Team!



He also said something about HDMI pass through:


And of course he's right. The Realiser would demand Dolby Atmos for example but a TV connected to the Realiser only stereo, so both is not possible at the same time.


And I may add they are working on asynchronous measurement and browser base GUI at the moment.


Hope this makes all of you happy. I certainly am!

Hi, I like to come back to your answer received from Smyth. Is there maybe any chance that you also have done a measurement with the Smyths at one of the trade shows? And maybe you even asked why they did not send you this measurement?

I can still not believe that it might happen that me and my family traveled for 1,5 days to Paris to get this measurement done and Smyths wouldn‘t povide it.

 

[Dixter]

Hi, I like to come back to your answer received from Smyth. Is there maybe any chance that you also have done a measurement with the Smyths at one of the trade shows? And maybe you even asked why they did not send you this measurement?

I can still not believe that it might happen that me and my family traveled for 1,5 days to Paris to get this measurement done and Smyths wouldn‘t povide it.

All of the demo show measurements will be available on the Exchange Site when it becomes live... I do not know when it will go live but have been told they are working on it... all of the measurements will become available then...

 

[Fox1977]

All of the demo show measurements will be available on the Exchange Site when it becomes live... I do not know when it will go live but have been told they are working on it... all of the measurements will become available then...

Is it your personal opinion about it or did you get this information from Smyth Research ? I had a measurement done in Paris also 3 years ago and i do hope i'll get it also, as i may not have an opportunity to capture an Atmos room anytime soon... (but first i'll have to get my unit... #203, getting there at a slow pace but as long as it's going forward, i'm not complaining !!)

 

[sander99]

@Fox1977: I think Dixter has some "inside" information source, he was also the one who knew beforehand about the manual coming online...

 

[Dixter]

Is it your personal opinion about it or did you get this information from Smyth Research ? I had a measurement done in Paris also 3 years ago and i do hope i'll get it also, as i may not have an opportunity to capture an Atmos room anytime soon... (but first i'll have to get my unit... #203, getting there at a slow pace but as long as it's going forward, i'm not complaining !!)

The information is from an official source...

 

[jgazal]

I haven’t received yet. They didn’t provided any tracking number, so I can’t tell you if they really shipped it. For now is just a promise.

I've just received the second headtracker. So now I can confirm they delivered the reward established in the Kickstarted campaign.
I have a working unit with all accessories I have been entitled to.

 

[Richter Di]

All of the demo show measurements will be available on the Exchange Site when it becomes live... I do not know when it will go live but have been told they are working on it... all of the measurements will become available then...

That would make a big difference.

The information is from an official source...

Thanks. Good to know. Very happy that we have you here in the thread.

 

[Fox1977]

The information is from an official source...

Thanks for the information. That’s good news to know that measurements were not lost and that we’ll get them eventually!!
Because using the A16 with a generic room and using it with a room captured with one’s own ears are two very different experiences, I think...

 

[audiohobbit]

Well, those rooms were not acoustically treated. Often very small. And the center playing to your feet... not of much use for me.
In one video Stephen said that they deliberately place the center below the TV at those demos, because that's the hardest thing to get right with binauralization.
But for all of those who want to actually use this PRIR it's not good. If you have the opportunity that voices will come directly out of your TV or screen, you should take it

A PRIR of a good room personalized via the service on the exchange website could sound better I think.

And keep your fingers crossed that all those measurements don't get mixed up and you get a PRIR of another person and never know why it sounds so crappy...

 

[You Gene]

[OFF]How do u delete a post ? lol[/OFF]

Hello,

You can not delete your post in this forum, you can only edit it : https://www.head-fi.org/articles/faq.6724/

You Gene

 

[Grue]

Does the windows driver work for anyone? I get a Code 52 warning in the device manager, the driver apparently isn't properly signed.
The ASIO control panel for the A16 can be opened, but doesn't detect any device.

It works for me, but keep in mind that you need most likely usb2 connector. 16ch multichannel takes quite some bandwidth so you might run into problems with usb-port sharing some other high bandwidth device.
I noticed that I cannot switch dolby atmos on, unless I use hdmi for audio output from my pc. ASIO works fine with usb connection.

 

[sander99]

Ok, I have a small confession to make: last week I discovered a nice affordable little DSP unit with 4 analog inputs and 4 analog outputs (suitable for balanced and unbalanced use), that can do level, delay, 7 band PEQ and a few things more on 4 channels. I ordered 4 (for 16 channels) and they have arrived. I kept it a secret for you guys until I had them in my possession because I think it is from a kind of house brand of the seller, music gear and instrument shop Thomann in Germany, and I don't know if they have a big stock of them. Once sold out maybe they will have to order a new batch to be produced for them exclusively.
They cost 79 Euro each (although on the following page - English version aimed at the UK market - they say 77, apparently it depends from where you order).

https://www.thomann.de/gb/the_t.racks_dsp_4x4_mini.htm

The device itself has no knobs or buttons, but can be configured via USB from a Windows PC (unfortunately you can not connect more than 1 with the same pc at the same time, but once it is set up it can run stand alone).

On the page is a link to the configuration software, you can install and run this software without having the device to see the possibilities (choose "demo" in the pop-up screen after starting the program):
https://images.static-thomann.de/pics/atg/atgdata/file/misc/448459dsp10soft.exe

I want to put them between the 16 analog outputs of the A16 and my 16 channels of amplification (in the form of 2 obsolete Yamaha RX-V750 7.1 receivers with 7.1 analog inputs and 1 Yamaha AX-592 stereo amp).
The parameters of the PEQ can be set in very fine steps; I can manually copy the settings from the 7 band PEQ in my (newer RX-V771) Yamaha receiver. (This receiver for example can set the frequeny of each band only in 1/3 octave steps, but the DSP 4x4 Mini can make much smaller steps and can accept all the values of the Yamaha or very close: only 31.3 Hz is changed to 31.2 Hz, and 10.1KHz is changed to 10.08KHz which seems like a trivial difference and maybe just a case of rounding differently.)
(So I will first have to run a few speaker set ups with the RX-V771 with different subsets of my speakers, and each time copy the settings.)

Do note that you can not do complete bass management on 16 channels with 4 of these, because inside any one of these units you can not refer to the channels in the other units. But the A16 can do a part of the bass management. (What I did not see in the A16 is the possibility to redirect low frequencies from small speakers to the main L and R front channels, only to the sub. But if I put the L, R and sub outputs of the A16 in one and the same DSP 4x4 Mini I can redirect the sub signal to the L en R in there. I need to because I don't have a sub.)

If my A16 would never come for some reason (or if and when level, delay and PEQ controls are implemented in the A16) then I can still use the DSP 4x4 Minis as active cross overs, or other things.

I discovered one little disadvantage testing them just now, but it is not a dealbreaker for me: on power off they produce some strange output signals for a few moments, but they were connected straight into the "main input" of my AX-592, that is directly into the power amp without volume control (reckless, I know), considering that fact means the strange signals are not very loud (otherwise I probably had 2 speakers less now and troubles with my neighbours!).
I should just turn the amps off first before powering them off. And maybe use a normal input on the AX-592 and put the volume controller on the amp at some level that I will never exceed. The analog inputs of the RX-V750s will go through the volume control anyhow, so it will be more consistent over all channels.

 

[Dixter]

I decided to try and test the manLoud routine last night to test out the youtube video and how user friendly it is/is not... and the bottom line is the video is easy to follow and the results are very good when you complete the manLoud routine....

I decided to use a headphone that I had never used/measured on the A16.. so I chose the Audio-technica ATH-m50s/LE , wanted the A16 to have a little challenge..

I set the A16 on the kitchen counter, plugged it in to the AC wall plug and turned it on..nothing else hooked up to the A16..
To start the routine the A16 needs to know two items.. 1) user name and 2) headphone name... so I went into the menu and verified the user name was Dixter and created a new headphone called M50...that out of the way I pulled out the necessary hardware 1) in-ear mics 2) in-ear lanyard strap 2) grounding wrist strap 3) scotch tape 4) M50 headphones

I un-raveled the cords on the in-ear mics and chose one to be the right side ( placed a small piece of stoctch tape at each end to mark it as right mic) and then I aligned up the cords length wise and placed scotch tape about every 6 inches up the cord and once completed I had a single mic cord with one end both connectors ( one marked as right ) and on the mic end (also one marked as right)

I un-raveled the cord on the grounding wrist strap and adjusted the strap band and placed it on my wrist with the metal part in contact with the bottom of my wrist...and plugged it into the ground plug on the back of the A16

I plugged the M50 headphones into the A16 ... plugged the in-ear mics into the front of the A16, making sure the right mic is in the right input.. I then placed the in-ear mics into my ears ( right side to right ear ) and made sure the foam tips were going to hold the mics correctly I then put on the head phones.. making sure the right cup was on the right ear...

I placed a chair in front of the A16 so when sitting in it the A16 display is at eye level... this is kinda important for this routine as you will be interfacing with that display for the final results...

OK... now that the setup is complete.. on with the routines...

As this was a new headphone to the A16 the first routine that had to be completed is the HPEQ... so I pulled up the A16 manual and went to the HPEQ routine starting on page 73, paragraph 9.2 ... thru paragraph 9.4
I think the only issue you might run into is the actual -in-ear mic level reading... and its not a big issue once you play with it a little... the routine starts out by performing short sweeps to test the -in-ear mics and to verify that the level is correct for them to record... all you have to do is set the gain switch (just right of the volume nob) to the lowest level... run the routine (hit the HP button) and watch the display and if you see the two bars going green then you are good at that gain setting... if the bars are yellow you are too low and you just click the gain switch up a notch until the sweeps go green... pretty easy as you just change the switch and hit the HP button and you can run that all you want until you get them to go green during the initial sweep... once I got the bar to go green, mine ended up at the center gain, I took a large breath and hit the HP button and held my breath until the routine had completed and then hit the Enter button to save it all... a note on the hold my breath thing... its probably silly but I did notice quite a bit of noise from my surroundings and in the microphonics of the cables and breathing... so I decided to stay real still and to hold my breath ... didn't take any measurements with the phone ringing in the back ground and stuff like that... sounds silly but at least if the routine didn't go well I couldn't blame it on external noises... with the HPEQ out of the way I go straight for the manLoud routine...

A couple of notes on both of the routines... the HPEQ is ran to characterize the headphones and it just happens that your head is a great place to hold the in-ear mics and the headphones at the same time.. the HPEQ routine creates two filters.. Auto and Flat.... so after the HPEQ routine is ran, one of the variables is taken care of... the other variable ? your ears, and how they actually hear... so that needs to be measured and taken into account.... and thus.. the manLoud routine... this routine is used to measure and take into account how good or how bad your ears can hear.... and you get to compensate for that... the manLoud routine will allow you to adjust for any level variations your ears have over a set frequency range... and if your ears aren't perfectly matched and they hear a little differently then you get to fix the balance between the two ears also...

For this routine I loaded the youtube video and watched it first to get a guest of what I needed to accomplish... its very straight forward and worked like a charm... you should make time for this routine as it does take a while to complete....
The setup is pretty much the same except you won't be using the in-ear mics this time... I just followed the routine as they played it out and that works fine.... when I first started listening to the noise bands, I started at the bottom end and working up the frequencies... it seemed a bit harder once you get to the upper bands... so I found out if I started listening to the lowest band (the reference band) and used the left button on the remote it would jump to the highest band.... so I rocked back and forth from the lowest band to the highest band and adjusted the levels between the two... easy as you just hit the left button then the right button on the remote... once I had that complete I now had a low reference and a high reference... so I started at the bottom end and started to work my way up the frequency bands... I also purposefully tried to not look at the display while adjusting the bands... not sure why that made a difference but it seemed to be easier that way... just listen with the ears and make the adjustments.... in my case while working my way up into the higher frequencies the balance would shift over from center to the left side... the reason is because the right ear does not hear the same as the left ear.... I ignored that for the moment and worked my way through all of the frequencies...once complete I now looked at the display and noted the higher frequencies volume were pushed up quite a bit... the video warns you of this happening and for you to try and not allow this to happen so I went back through the higher frequencies and made fine adjustments and this time I paid attention to the left/right balance and adjusted those out also... so what happens is the right ear gets a little more volume to balance out the ears... and with the fine tuning this time the overall volume came down for the higher frequencies and the balance issue was taken care of.... now I went back at least two times and fine tuned the overall volume between all frequencies... again, not watching the display.... once complete and pretty much happy with the results I saved the manLoad filter...

So now that the routines were completed it was time to hear some music and see if it worked or not.... so a super easy hookup, I took my iphone XS with a headphone adapter and plugged it into the A16 at the stereo jacks on the top rear and loaded the Onkyo HF Player app and played back some nice DSD files for the testing.... I can report the routines worked perfectly and those head phones have never sounded better... I also went into the apps EQ settings and fine tuned the A16 to the iphone for a great pairing.....

The only issue... it does take a bit of time to get this all done.... is it worth it.... I don't see how you can get away with not doing it....

Sorry for the long... drawn out post... but I do hope it helps some...