[Got the Shakes]

New update from James Smyth available here: https://www.kickstarter.com/project...al-3d-audio-headphone-processor/posts/2044207

 

[SergioPOE]

Yep... I just hope they explain everything well in the user's manual. It's obvious these guys have forgotten more about audio processing than all of us put together will ever know, and sometimes it's difficult for experts to explain things in a way that average consumers will understand.

 

[sander99]

There is a new update from Smyth!
[Edit: didn't see the posts before me, sorry]

 

[Sordel]

It's a helpful update: nothing on shipping dates but at least there's some grounds there to anticipate a Spring delivery date and it's good to get some insight into the manufacturing process.

 

[Sanctuary]

New update from James Smyth available here: https://www.kickstarter.com/project...al-3d-audio-headphone-processor/posts/2044207

I'm not even upset. This is the kind of update that is very reassuring (all of those PCBs). Also, on a personal note, the delay had been so long already that it could have cut into my annual trip out of town for a few weeks, but it seems like I'll be in the clear for that at least, and not too long after these will start shipping.

edit: Odd that the aluminum housing for the headphone unit is already black, but that they aren't going to make a black version of them.

 

[Got the Shakes]

I'm not even upset. This is the kind of update that is very reassuring (all of those PCBs). Also, on a personal note, the delay had been so long already that it could have cut into my annual trip out of town for a few weeks, but it seems like I'll be in the clear for that at least, and not too long after these will start shipping.

edit: Odd that the aluminum housing for the headphone unit is already black, but that they aren't going to make a black version of them.

I'm not upset either. This update, while lacking a firm ship date, makes it feel like there's light at the end of the tunnel. Hearing that they'll be testing all of the boards after Christmas and starting assembly hopefully not long after that leads me to believe that barring some unexpected massive delay because of DTS or Dolby cert that hopefully shipping happens by the end of February.

 

[sander99]

edit: Odd that the aluminum housing for the headphone unit is already black, but that they aren't going to make a black version of them.

I think only the front and rear panels of the headstand model will be silver, the sides (tubes as they call them in the update) will be black.

 

[Sanctuary]

I think only the front and rear panels of the headstand model will be silver, the sides (tubes as they call them in the update) will be black.

Probably. I thought about that after posting, but I'm still kind of wondering why it would be such an issue to do an all black version unless the aluminum used for the sides is a different thickness than the front and back. I guess the knobs are a factor too though. I had initially been considering getting the headphone stand version when it was potentially going to be available in black, but was still leaning more towards the traditional box. In the end, the available color made the choice easy.

 

[jgazal]

well, playing some HRTF cues on speakers totally defeats the purpose. that's playing binaural record on a pair of speakers. but for the principle alone, then yes the left speaker will send the cues intended for the left ear alone, but the right ear will end up getting them too(modified by distance and HRTF). same for right channel. it's like the reverse of the problem we usually have with stereo albums playing on headphones. one stereo method played on the other = some result that is at the very least not accurate in position cues.

In the video, by using one mono sound source, the first "spatial rendering system" is taken out, one mono source is just one mono source, and you purely can concentrate on how one mono source is "spatially rendered" over headphones. Including hrtf, ILD, ITD, everything that comes with it.

So if you use the following instructions ...

Try to listen with loudspeakers in the very near field at more and less +10 and -10 degrees apart and with two pillows one in front of your nose in the median plane and the other at the top of your head to avoid ceiling reflections (...)​

... Do you hear the virtual speakers in front of your head? Or do you still hear exactly were you first heard with your headphones without DSP?

Would the A8/A16 with a crossfeed free PRIR (here or here) emulate a similar result to the instructions above?

 

[sander99]

I have been trying to find information about the Illusonic N:M channel upmixer, without real succes. However I found an Illusonic product called IAP 16 Immersive Audio Processor. It does a special kind of upmixing, trying to seperate the sound into 3 parts: direct sound, early reflexions, and diffuse sound, and each of these parts is treated differently in how it is distributed over the speakers. It could all just be marketing talk but it seems to me it could be very beneficial in particular for stereo recordings. Now I don't know if the Illusonic N:M channel upmixer works in a similar way (anyone who does know?), but if it does I think this is very interesting.

Here is a link to a video about it:

And the Illusonic webpage about this product:
https://www.illusonic.com/audio-processors/iap-16/

 

[jgazal]

(...)
However I found an Illusonic product called IAP 16 Immersive Audio Processor.
(...)

You may want to read the review of the IAP in the link below:

(...). An example would be the Illusonic Immersive Audio Processor, from Switzerland, a company that also provides the upmiximg algorithm in the Realiser A16.
(...)

 

[sander99]

Ouch, didn't know the price of this IAP 16 thing: about $21,300 (in january 2014, that is).
I guess it is not likely then that the Illusonic N:M channel upmixer can do the same thing?
Or maybe this price just comes mainly from over-the-top high end AD- and DA-converters and analog circuitry/preamps (for 16 channels, that can add up)?

 

[jgazal]

If you want to extract direct sound, early reflections and diffuse field from the audio content, I guess you need some loops and computing power.

I don’t know if their product differs from the A16 in computing power.

But the concept applied in IAP is probably the same used in the n:m algorithm inside the A16.

Did you pay attention to the large absorbers they use to avoid reflections in their demonstration listening room?

I expect the early reflections in regular listening rooms to affect the performance of their algorithm.

Reducing the window/taper values of a PRIR’s may be an advantage then.

 

[castleofargh]

So if you use the following instructions ...



... Do you hear the virtual speakers in front of your head? Or do you still hear exactly were you first heard with your headphones without DSP?

Would the A8/A16 with a crossfeed free PRIR (here or here) emulate a similar result to the instructions above?

sorry, cannot comply. moving my speakers would mean having to later go over all the measuring and placing hurdle I went through last time. I'm kind of curious about your suggestion, but not that curious ^_^.

 

[jgazal]

I did it not only with that video, but with every binaural I have found until now. And I won’t tell you. Just to leave you a little bit more curious.
You can always use a mattress...