[Anathallo]

Then why make the argument at all?  Just to portray yourself in an intelligent light?  The whole argument was based around EQ making a large difference when it came to mimicking a live performance, or 'original sound' (which stemmed from funkmeister's comment about EQ'ing entry-level AKGs to sound like top-end headphones).
 
We get it - you're smart - you can stop the crusade now.  Hurray for opinions.
 
Quote:

 
Specifically, EQ changes the spectral envelope of a sound, thus it changes timbre. I never claimed that it could make a pair of headphone sound exactly like another.

 

 

[khaos974]

Quote:

Then why make the argument at all?  Just to portray yourself in an intelligent light?  The whole argument was based around EQ making a large difference when it came to mimicking a live performance, or 'original sound' (which stemmed from funkmeister's comment about EQ'ing entry-level AKGs to sound like top-end headphones).
 
We get it - you're smart - you can stop the crusade now.  Hurray for opinions.

I made the argument because you wrote "Not to mention that EQ does absolutely nothing for timbre and soundstage, among other things.", which is untrue. That is all. Let's drop it.
 
 

 

[Anathallo]

Oh, my apologies sir, how dare I make such an obvious and dire oversight.  Let me please edit this incredible blunder of a post.
 
Please see the fruits of my labour below - I hope you find them to your liking.  In the future I will do my best to avoid making potentially misleading statements that could take you off on a tangent to the far reaches of semantics.
 
Quote:

I made the argument because you wrote "Not to mention that EQ does absolutely nothing for timbre and soundstage, among other things.", which is untrue. That is all. Let's drop it.
 
 

 


Quote:

Not to mention that EQ does absolutely nothing substantial for timbre and soundstage, among other things.

 

 

[funkmeister]

I use EQ to not let one frequency range mask another and therefore sound more like what was intended, and this is done by measurement. I don't think there is any top headphone that sounds like these do because of differences in coloration. Additionally the EQ does (almost) nothing to help detail extraction, transient response, timbre, soundstage, and a headphones resonant frequencies. There may be changes in those areas, but they won't make it sound like a top-tier headphone. If my junior AKG's and a top-tier headphone were both EQ'd ruler-flat then they might sound the same in terms of bass/mids/highs balance, which paints a nice picture, and is what I'm going for here. I don't see how my junior AKG would be any better in the other ways to measure performance... not by a long shot.
 
I apologize that this has become so polarizing. At the same time, it is very interesting to see everyone's own approaches. I stand by my desire for a headphone that doesn't sound stuffy (K142HD is stuffy) or one that doesn't lack bass (K171 lacks bass) and is without other problems (sibilance, treble dips, forward mids, etc.). Yeah, it doesn't exist. All these things can be helped with EQ, but only within the responsiveness of the headphone. Closed headphones are harder to tune because their cans have more resonance with even throws off constant Q equalization.
 
So... I'd like to see that Shure SRH1840 FR chart with the HRTF of the measurement equipment taken into account. I bet it'd look awesome... and still bright... but awesome.

 

[Digital-Pride]

I can't wait till we argue about the actual headphones this thread is about.

  Should be fun!

 

[funkmeister]

Quote:

I can't wait till we argue about the actual headphones this thread is about.

  Should be fun!

I know. We'll have to wait 'til they're in regular folks' collections. I'm eagerly anticipating the day. I would also like to know how the SRH1440 turns out. It sounds like the Beats killer for people who go for that stuff... for reasons other than fashion. I run a sales program and I have (among a large team) some folks who like the Beats but also like quality sound. They borrow headphones around the office sometimes. I wonder if this will make a good incentive or kick-back for good performance. It looks like it won't be good for workin' in the cubes, but the home office should be a great place for 'em. They spend a day or two a week there anyway.

 

[ac500]

I suspect the SRH1440, if it has emphasized bass, probably won't be at the Beats level of stupidly overblown bass. Probably more like M50, SRH840, or HD650. Beats fans will stick with their Beats until they discover what they're missing by drowning everything out in bass.

 

[achristilaw]

The argument was comedic because between posts, certain arguers would leave the thread and blanket the web for some more info to support their case. Return, armed with blanks and fire away! What has to be addressed is the web manufacturing tin-plated parrots. Nothing practical to actually offer.....because of no practical "hands on" experience. Parroting another persons "opinion" will not make you an "expert". People had more substance and three dimensional make-up before the web....... 

 

[Beagle]

Quote:

It's a good thing that I can enjoy music with ibuds then

, but the hobby is also named high fidelity.
And is the use of "imagine" difficult to understand? Having no knowledge of your specific system, it was a hypothetical situation, why would you assume that your speakers+room matches the studio where the producer heard the mix? After all you are imagining the what the producer heard too!
What's bothering you with EQ specifically? Would you against eliminating room modes via bass traps? correcting resonances and reverberation times/ All those are means to achieve better fidelity.
 
 

Aww dad-drattit! I never thought of that! Now I can no longer enjoy music knowing I cannot reproduce the exact setting that the music was made in. I have to win the lottery and buy every studio that was used for every recording I have in order to hear correctly what actually went down. Maybe I'll just keep one recording and have a room built that matched the one in that particular studio and find out what speakers were used and have an ear transplant where I can swap head-flaps with the engineer in charge of the job.

 

[ac500]

> I have to win the lottery and buy every studio that was used for every recording I have in order to hear correctly what actually went down. Maybe I'll just
 
EXACTLY. Now you're getting it.
 
OR... -- now here's a novel though -- you could just use EQ and do the best you can given your current equipment. Problem solved.
 

 

[Beagle]

Or you could not take things out of context and recognise sarcasm. Problem solved.

 

[Digital-Pride]

 

[Dennis]

Quote:

 
Some of you people are seriously confused about what "the original sound" is. There is no such thing as "original" except a live performance. ALL microphones, headphones, amps, etc. are colored in one way or another -- compounding so that what you hear is never going to be truly perfect. Every recording is going to be different, no recording is going to be perfect, etc. etc.
 
The closest way to have "the original sound" is in fact WITH an equalizer, not without -- and you would have to tune your EQ for every single individual song you have, because they're all different slightly.

I totally understand that every amplifier, microphone and headphone/speaker has their own unique sound signatures which will color the original sound.
As u said, nothing is perfect, that's also the reason why audiophiles pay a lot to achieve the ultimate goal --> as realistic as possible + as original as possible.
 
I am talking about the EQ that we use on players, DAC or some softwares.  EQ leads to distortion --> This is an undeniable fact.
You may say, every CD has been equalized before they are being sold, YES, that's right.  But the question is, do you know WHY?
One of the reason's becoz when a singer sing a song directly toward a microphone, the microphone will record the "air blown" sound.
For example, the word "Poker". when we pronounce it, we try to seperate it into --> "Po" + "Ker".
In order to pronounce "Po", we need to blow some air out and the microphone will record that down clearly.
The producers always try eliminate those imperfect recordings by editing the sound tracks and adding EQs.
 
Just now, u said "the closest way to hv the original sound is with an equalizer".  Let me ask u a very simple question, what do u think about the iPod's EQ?
(pls dun say iPod's EQ is an exception

)

 

[maverickronin]

Quote:

Just now, u said "the closest way to hv the original sound is with an equalizer".  Let me ask u a very simple question, what do u think about the iPod's EQ?
(pls dun say iPod's EQ is an exception

)

Well no one said you should use an EQ if you can't get a decent one.  There are certainly plenty of crappy ones but there are good ones as well.  You don't judge the HD800s by Sennheiser's cheap IEMs do you?
 
Get a player with a good EQ like a Cowon and get a minimum or linear phase EQ VST plugin for your music software.  Good EQs don't introduce any audible changes besides what you ask for.  If I had a headphone you hadn't heard or read about before before and applied an EQ curve which didn't reach the physical limits of the driver and gave you a switch that flipped it on and off with out telling you which was which its not like you're likely to be able to tell which one is is the natural response.
 
The main differences between what EQ changes about the sound and what headphone choice, amp selection, DAC selection, tube rolling, and searching for "synergy" change is that EQ is cheaper, more precise, and easier to adjust.

 

[ac500]

Well if CES is tomorrow, then we should be hearing more about the SRH1840 from Jude within 24 hours it seems
 
Quote:

LOL. No, that's not it at all. There was CanJam @ RMAF, then Tokyo, then the Gift Guide, and all of that combined with the last quarter of the year and the holidays, which is always the busiest time of year for me, at work and at home--and now CES is pretty much here. Around the holiday, I took some much needed time away from computers and the web, to be with my family and friends.
 
I will say more about the SRH1840 (and maybe the SRH1440) before I leave for CES.