[Shaffer]

As for frequency response from this amp. I don't know how to get the most out of this chart, but these are the measured results that I should expect:

Red: without
Green: with




It says kameleon, but the filter design remains the same as far as I understand.

I'm not really sure this is a good thing. In many ways, the EQ module (or whatever it may be called) is removing the very factors that give HD650 its character. Look at it this way: Video is much more accurate than film, but film looks a lot better.

 

[JacobLee89]

 
lol.  well I disagree with the digital vs analog filter, as you can (at least on a computer) hope to simulate the behavior of analog filters if you feel like it. but I certainly agree that EQ is a scary word for most, and that using one correctly does require work and time(at least for people who suck at setting one by ear like .... myself ^_^).

 
I switch between two headphones, and having two different amps which both use the same wallwart (I made the SeNNator's power supply to use the O2's 15V ac Wallwart !) makes it a simple matter of reaching out and replugging stuff.
 
I can very easily get a program to save different equalisation settings, but sometimes I don't like clicking out of a program... Odd how I categorise what's labour intensive and what is not.
 
Funny how we tend to leave out lifestyle habits from this wonderful hobby, when it does play a huge part of how we engage in it.

 

[Solrighal]

 
maybe I'm missing something, but couldn't it be done with a good EQ?

 
I thought like you too. I spent ages trying to emulate Frans' filter via the parametric EQ built-in to JRiver and, although I haven't heard the physical filter, I would say I maybe got about 75% of the way there. I'm basing that figure purely on the reports I've read from others who have actually heard the filter. I have managed to eliminate the mid-bass bloom inherent in the HD 650 and with some recordings it has an amazing effect. But not on all. The part I simply can't replicate is the apparent boost in the 30Hz region. I can dial it in but I can't physically hear it. All my tests are documented somewhere on DIYAH.
 
I'm actually going to make an appointment to get my ears syringed because I'm getting old.
 
I'm also not entirely convinced I want to EQ anyway. I don't have a pathological aversion to EQ like some seem to but I did choose the HD 650 for it's warm characteristics. I've actually now sold every other pair of headphones I owned - except my ever-faithful PX100II's which I use as portables - and I can honestly say I don't miss any of them.
 
Gordon.

 

[CanadianMaestro]

  I'm actually going to make an appointment to get my ears syringed because I'm getting old.
 
I'm also not entirely convinced I want to EQ anyway. I don't have a pathological aversion to EQ like some seem to but I did choose the HD 650 for it's warm characteristics. I've actually now sold every other pair of headphones I owned - except my ever-faithful PX100II's which I use as portables - and I can honestly say I don't miss any of them.
 
Gordon.

EQ-ing just seems unpure, like cheating.
 
Be careful with ear canal rinsing. If the water comes out of the other ear, that's really cause for serious worry.  That's a condition humourously called "Cranium vacuumitis". 

 

[castleofargh]

Originally Posted by CanadianMaestro /img/forum/go_quote.gif
 
EQ-ing just seems unpure, like cheating.
 
Be careful with ear canal rinsing. If the water comes out of the other ear, that's really cause for serious worry.  That's a condition humourously called "Cranium vacuumitis". 

funny to see you say that with your signature ^_^. so what do you do to correct the FR errors of the headphones? or do you just accept that you don't need neutral(I actually use EQ but not to go neutral, just to get what I like most)?

 

[CanadianMaestro]

I actually don't make a point of letting FR errors get to me. I aim for neutrality with full system, less so with HPs,  so that the artists' intent on the recording can hopefully get through unblemished. Wishful thinking, but I still enjoy the music without any EQ-ing. To each his own.
 
off to dinner,
cheers

 

[JacobLee89]

Stay posted for SeNNator news..
 
Also I forgot to buy a toggle switch so I can switch the amp on and off..
Hopefully the local electronics store has a suitable one.

 

[CanadianMaestro]

Cheaper just to yank the wall plug. Saves buying a switch. 

 

[mikoss]

  Part of micro-detailing includes hearing the ambience of the recording venue, as well as instrumental textures (the sharp twang of a violin's strings as the bow is pulled back on a soloist's cadenza is one example). It doesn't necessarily mean very low-level sounds. A lot of it has to do with good separation between closely-positioned instruments. It may not all have to do with just the 650. I suspect upstream gear would play a big role as well.

This for sure. I happen to think a lot of that information is actually in the midrange... the lower mids lending more to texture, and the upper mids contributing to the sense of atmosphere/ambience. When I first started paying attention to music on headphones, I was impressed by the details revealed in the highs (and I suspect a lot of people are drawn to "brighter" headphones for this reason.) However, as I eventually came to enjoy the 650's over brighter phones, I realized I wasn't seeking details in the same fashion... I think the 650's presentation is much more natural to me, and lends itself to presenting the details in a much more laid-back fashion. I'm able to hear the nuances of the music very nicely, despite the 650's not overly exaggerating much.

 

[CanadianMaestro]

Very true. Laid-back for sure. Still, I sense there's something missing, compared to other greats like PS500, LCD-2.2.  Not just the highs and treble "in your face". None of these 3 are aggressive, imo, with classical music. I need to think more about this. 650 is a lifer for sure, for genres apart from opera and symphonic music, anything really large-scale is just not great on my 650. Female vocals like Barber and Cole, are fabulous on 650. So is acoustic music (Dead Can Dance, Vollenweider, etc.).

 

[JacobLee89]

I'm not really sure this is a good thing. In many ways, the EQ module (or whatever it may be called) is removing the very factors that give HD650 its character. Look at it this way: Video is much more accurate than film, but film looks a lot better.

 
I have no idea what to expect at all. My ears may like what I end up with, or it may not. Only two have heard the SeNNator in full motion, and there are a few others whom have heard the Kameleon amp with the HD650 filter, so this section is treading an unknown direction.
 
One could also say that tube amps are their own type of filter, are "EQ'ing" the sound for the headphones, and that tube rolling is akin to trying out different EQ presets.

 

[DDDamian]

  This for sure. I happen to think a lot of that information is actually in the midrange... the lower mids lending more to texture, and the upper mids contributing to the sense of atmosphere/ambience. When I first started paying attention to music on headphones, I was impressed by the details revealed in the highs (and I suspect a lot of people are drawn to "brighter" headphones for this reason.) However, as I eventually came to enjoy the 650's over brighter phones, I realized I wasn't seeking details in the same fashion... I think the 650's presentation is much more natural to me, and lends itself to presenting the details in a much more laid-back fashion. I'm able to hear the nuances of the music very nicely, despite the 650's not overly exaggerating much.

I tend to agree. The upper registers tend to project air and space and sparkle, but much of the micro-detail is in the first and second harmonics, and in all the subtle sounds like the draw of a bow or the slap of a string on the soundboard, which are more in the mids. I think speed (as in attack and decay) have a lot to do with how much detail is brought out, and contributes to texture, imaging and separation.

 

[CanadianMaestro]

That may very well explain much of the detailing excellence of planars like LCD's. Speed. And lucid mids. I must admit though, the 650s do mids very well with vocals and acoustic music.

 

[mikoss]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NjEL9RlXkOY I don't know if that will embed as the video, but that song is an example of something I completely enjoy on the 650's. The delicate keyboard, beautiful, resolving/plucky guitars, intricate nuanced drumming, reverb on his voice... all the tiny little things together. Even on youtube, I get the atmosphere and engagement. 
 
I honestly haven't spent enough time with the LCD-3's to get them to the level of pure satisfaction I get with the 650's with the right songs/genres, but I suspect as you both mentioned that their speed will make them better suited across the board... Whether they are better suited for acoustic guitar/vocals/whatever sounds beautiful with the 650's remains to be heard.

 

[purpledrank]

I saw a video that compared a headphone (cant remember), a denon, the Hifiman HE-400 and the Sennheiser HD 650. The reviewer picked the HE-400 over everything else. Has anyone here listened to both headphones raw and with an amp? How would you compare the two? I know this is the Sennheiser thread but try not to be too biased, just as honest as possible.