[rwelles]

Quote:

  Any past he-500 owners in here? Bought an he-500(upgraded from hd-600 + asgard) and paired it with a project sunrise II amp. While its definetely  better than my previous setup i'm not sure if its 3x the price worth. I have an aftermarket copper cable otw so ill wait for that but i cant imagine it really opening these up much more. Anyone come back to the hd650 after having a he-500 without any regret? I know these scale well so im hoping the power from my amp and maybe an upgraded silver cable will get me close enough. Im not hurting for money but i cant really justify having a $1300 setup that im not absolutely blown away by. Also looking at moving to speakers  or getting two mid range headphones 1 closed for bass and hiphop and maybe a pair of grado or something for acoustic/rock but that's another forum .
 

 
Since no one else (that I've found) has responded, I'll venture an opinion.Though my experience with different equipment is well shy of other members...
My home rig is Mjolnir/HE500. For work, I recently acquired a magni/modi stack. A couple of weeks ago, I got the HD650s for work. The pairing is phenomenal, considering the price. I've listened to the HE500 on the Magni. I'm reticent to describe the difference in non-audio terms, usually mis-interpretated in forums, but none the less...
The M/HE500 is more fluid, yet more detailed at the same time. IMO, yes, you will probably lose in moving from the HE500 to the H650. Is it a lot (aka worth the price)?? That's a subjective judgement that will undoubtedly vary from listener to listener. In an ideal world, you'd have both HPs. I feel lucky to be able to own both.
That said, I'd love to hear about any (relatively) inexpensive balanced HE650 cables other members would recommend. Itchin' to hear the 650s on the Mjolnir and make a comparison with that amp.

 

[MattTCG]

I owned the he500 and came back to the hd650. The hd650 is like a good jacket that you've had for 10 years, but is just too damn nice to trade it for something else. The 650 made a big leap forward with the lyr and the right tubes for me. I can just melt into those mids for days. 
 
And then, I made the vintage amp discovery. And yes, the 650 got even better. 

  Yes, you can quote me. The hd650 on the 20+ year old amp that I forgot was in my attic, sounds better than the lyr. 

 <the guy with the stick=headfi community, the whipped dog is MattTCG
 
The hd650 does everything that the he500 did while being much more comfortable...talking about mids here. The he500 does instrument separation and decay of notes better though. So as you can see, I have no issue choosing the 650 over the he500. 

 

[brokenthumb]

Hey Matt, I have a 17 year old Pioneer (was stored in the storage shed out back

) I tried the HD650 on one day while listening to some records and found it sounds incredible.  I liked it much more than the Burson and FiiO amps I had at the time.  So you are not alone.

 

[jwusoccer]

Just ordered a pair of sylvania green hornet tubes for the lyr! Hopefully they'll be an improvement over the stock ones.

 

[MattTCG]

I'm just learning about what vintage amps can really do...and can't do. There are no words to describe what this old Denon does for the 650. I'll be bringing it to the Atlanta meet so that others will be able to appreciate the pairing. 
 
I love the 650 and have for some time. But it literally woke up and was reborn on this amp. Amazing!!
 
The old Pioneers are great. It all depends on the headphone output stage. The one on my denon is like speaker taps. 

 

[jazzerdave]

Quote:

I'm just learning about what vintage amps can really do...and can't do. There are no words to describe what this old Denon does for the 650. I'll be bringing it to the Atlanta meet so that others will be able to appreciate the pairing. 
 
I love the 650 and have for some time. But it literally woke up and was reborn on this amp. Amazing!!
 
The old Pioneers are great. It all depends on the headphone output stage. The one on my denon is like speaker taps. 

 
I've got an old Marantz 2270 that I'm in the process of re-capping.  Whenever I finish that project I'll report back.  I remember it sounding pretty good in the past, but the only headphones I used back when it was in regular rotation were AKG K240's and Koss Pro 4AA's (I used it mainly for speaker setups).

 

[wazzupi]

you guys with ur old receivers scare me <.< lol i think im going to start checking craiglist and garage sales now <.< 

 

[gopanthersgo1]

I'll have to try my receiver...

 

[calipilot227]

Quote:

you guys with ur old receivers scare me <.< lol i think im going to start checking craiglist and garage sales now <.< 

 
They're that good. I've picked up two so far (sold one) from Salvation Army for under $50, both in working condition (both got the DeOxit treatment as per standard). It can be done.

 

[wazzupi]

do you guys have any recommendations on what I should be looking for ? 

 

[calipilot227]

Quote:

do you guys have any recommendations on what I should be looking for ? 

 
Pioneer and Marantz are the usual suspects, although I picked up an Onkyo TX-2500 II and it sounds very good with the HD650s.

 

[pp312]

Quote:

I owned the he500 and came back to the hd650. The hd650 is like a good jacket that you've had for 10 years, but is just too damn nice to trade it for something else. The 650 made a big leap forward with the lyr and the right tubes for me. I can just melt into those mids for days. 
 
And then, I made the vintage amp discovery. And yes, the 650 got even better. 

  Yes, you can quote me. The hd650 on the 20+ year old amp that I forgot was in my attic, sounds better than the lyr. 

 <the guy with the stick=headfi community, the whipped dog is MattTCG
 
The hd650 does everything that the he500 did while being much more comfortable...talking about mids here. The he500 does instrument separation and decay of notes better though. So as you can see, I have no issue choosing the 650 over the he500. 

 
I have a similar experience. I have both HE-500 and DT880 Pro and I'm currently using a Marantz SR4200 HT amp. Frankly, the DT880 with the Marantz doesn't leave me wanting much, and since it's easier to drive and much more comfortable than the HE-500 I'm very much leaning toward keeping it and tossing the HE-500. The hifiman is somewhat more incisive and defined overall, with less grain, but otherwise I prefer what to me is the "sunnier" sound of the DT880, which also happens to be more forgiving. As for the Marantz receiver, someone on Audioreview said it sounded like an $800 NAD or Rotel integrated, and though I can't verify that, the sound certainly is very good and probably not improvable for sensible money. There's a lot of gems around, not just in vintage gear but stuff from the nineties and noughties, especially in Marantz and Rotel (and Denon apparently), who don't seem to distinquish between integrateds and HT receivers in terms of sound quality. Plus with an HT receiver you get remote volume in 1db increments (ah, luxury), multiple inputs and, joy of joys, electronic tone controls for very fine adjustments. Whats more you don't have tubes heating up your room or distracting you when you're watching TV.  And they can be dead cheap on Ebay (this one was $85, but would be cheaper in the US and UK). Only real drawbacks are bulk and power usage. However, I measured the Marantz at under 60w under typical conditions, so it's not exactly draining the grid. Anyone contemplating the purchase of an expensive dedicated HP amp should consider the alternatives.  

 

[captouch]

Pioneer and Marantz are the usual suspects, although I picked up an Onkyo TX-2500 II and it sounds very good with the HD650s.

Sansui and Yamaha are also favorites.

If you want to use the headphone jack (versus connecting to the speaker outputs using speaker taps), it's generally best to find a receiver/integrated amp that uses resistors to drop the power from the main amp output. If a dedicated HP circuit is used (like an opamp circuit), you may not get the power or sound quality benefit.

Generally, older receivers (70's) use resistor drops, with many newer receivers using dedicated circuits. As an example, I have a Yamaha 15wpc late 70's receiver that uses resistors and there's plenty of power from HP out to drive HD650 or even power hungry orthos like the HE-5LE. On the other hand, I had an early 2000's NAD (90wpc) that used a dedicated circuit that never gave me decent SQ from the HP jack. Service manuals will often show schematics to tell you what approach was used on the HP jack.

You don't need to spend much to get great sound, but the older you go, you have to keep in mind that things like electrolytic caps can go bad. If you're not able to service these things yourself, repair can become a headache or expensive. For that reason, one approach is to keep the purchase price low, use it as long as it works, and then you're not out much if something goes bad and you can't fix it yourself. At that point you can often resell, even if not working, and recover some of your purchase price.

The other approach is to find something you really like and have it serviced/restored so it lasts another 30yrs. Some can do this themselves, but it's non-trivial requiring extensive diassembly and desoldering/resoldering. Or pay hundreds of $ to have it done. But the upside is these older pieces are often really classic/pretty and you can use them as your main receiver in a 2 channel speaker setup.

If you think HP gear is addictive, the same is true for vintage electronics. I started into HP gear and, searching for old cheap receivers to power my orthos, ended up buying 6 or 7 receivers, some vintage speakers, and eventually tube preamp and amps for full size setup. Not to mention two turntables.

 

[BobJS]

I'd love to hear Matt's 650s.  Mine must have been duds.  No highs.  Also no comparison the HE-500.  HE-500 blows them out of the water.
But seriously, I hear people talk about variability between individual HD650s .... I have to believe this is true because the ones I had weren't in the same league as the HE-500 ..... they couldn't even compare with the Mad Dogs .... so I'll have to get myself to a meet because there simply has to be something more to them than the supposedly mint pair I had and sold.
 

 

[dmudan]

I'm using my main hifi amp, a modified Pioneer A-400 and I'm perfectly happy with the results. I initially demoed the HD650 in some £1400 hp amp in the hifi shop and and feel no desire to buy a dedicated one as my Pioneer sounds great. Some here may know how good the A-400 was and still is.